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Christianity's Founding Fathers Admit Similarities.


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#31 Bama Panther

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Posted 06 December 2008 - 01:07 PM

seriously why would you post something this stupid, oversimplistic and intentionally obtuse unless you wanted to be laughed at?


Essentially, the quote of tattoo's is exactly what it all comes down to. Something/Someone created all of this, or it created itself.
There was no Earth. Fast forward. There is an Earth.

It was created somehow. You don't need big words or fancy equations/formulas to see that.

#32 Fiz

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Posted 06 December 2008 - 01:15 PM

[quote name='Bama Panther']Does it not cross your mind that believing in life beginning from nothing takes just as much, if not more, faith than believing in a Creator?[/quote]
it didn't come from nothing. all the elements existed from before the big bang. they've recreated life in laboratories under the same conditions of primordial earth.

Scientists have tried all the experiments testing their theories . . . shooting electricity through protein goo; they have tried to create the protein chains that make life possible and have been unsuccesful, especially when starting with absolutely nothing.[/QUOTE]
sorry you're wrong

#33 Fiz

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Posted 06 December 2008 - 01:17 PM

It was created somehow. You don't need big words or fancy equations/formulas to see that.

yes, it was created when a giant ball of burning gas and matter started spinning, throwing off smaller balls that turned into planets.

there will always be a point far enough back where science can't explain it, and that's where your designer will always be, until that point is explained and then that creator is pushed farther back into the shadows.

and people who believe in it will never make the connection.

#34 tattoorhino

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Posted 06 December 2008 - 01:21 PM

I can see how all the planets just produced themselves and came out perfect from a burning ball of gas, and that seems way more intelligent....are you even reading what you write and believe?

#35 tattoorhino

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Posted 06 December 2008 - 01:23 PM

Some things in the body and in living matter DONT evolve. So how do explain that way? You cant. But I guess we just arent smart enough yet to explain it, but thats ok to jsut blindly believe that later on we will be able to. WOW.

#36 Bama Panther

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Posted 06 December 2008 - 01:31 PM

[quote name='Fiz']it didn't come from nothing. all the elements existed from before the big bang. they've recreated life in laboratories under the same conditions of primordial earth.

Scientists have tried all the experiments testing their theories . . . shooting electricity through protein goo; they have tried to create the protein chains that make life possible and have been unsuccesful, especially when starting with absolutely nothing.[/quote]
sorry you're wrong[/QUOTE]

As for the Miller-Urey experiment, see my post in the other thread. Many scientists now believe that the atmosphere composition used by Miller and Urey is far from what the early atmosphere was like.

As a matter of fact, check out the wikipedia link that you provided. The following quote matches a lot of what I said about the belief that the early atmosphere was not like that used in Miller's experiment.

[quote]Originally it was thought that the primitive secondary atmosphere contained mostly ammonia and methane. However, it is likely that most of the atmospheric carbon was CO2 with perhaps some CO and the nitrogen mostly N2. In practice gas mixtures containing CO, CO2, N2, etc. give much the same products as those containing CH4 and NH3 so long as there is no O2. The hydrogen atoms come mostly from water vapor. In fact, in order to generate aromatic amino acids under primitive earth conditions it is necessary to use less hydrogen-rich gaseous mixtures.[/quote]

These are all theories right now, but what makes Miller's anymore correct than others? Nothing.

Edited by Bama Panther, 06 December 2008 - 01:46 PM.


#37 Bama Panther

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Posted 06 December 2008 - 01:41 PM

yes, it was created when a giant ball of burning gas and matter started spinning, throwing off smaller balls that turned into planets.

there will always be a point far enough back where science can't explain it, and that's where your designer will always be, until that point is explained and then that creator is pushed farther back into the shadows.

and people who believe in it will never make the connection.


As I mentioned in the other thread, just because I am a Christian and creationist does not mean that I have not done research into the issue.

Where does the original matter come from, Fiz? Science teaches us all in 8th grade chemistry that from nothing comes nothing. Science holds that as an empirical truth. Is it just convenient to overlook it when discussing the beginning of the universe.

#38 Zaximus

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Posted 06 December 2008 - 02:00 PM

Fiz likes feeling cool in a small group of people, and I BET he listens to indie music and anything else mainstream is for IDIOTS.

He also doesn't believe in punctuation, complete sentences, or capital letters.

Perhaps some research into the 3rd grade could help him.

#39 Fiz

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Posted 06 December 2008 - 02:37 PM

Where does the original matter come from, Fiz? Science teaches us all in 8th grade chemistry that from nothing comes nothing. Science holds that as an empirical truth.

the matter existed before the big bang. the current theory from the last time i found my girlfriend's science journals is that the carbon and hydrogen existed everywhere and exploded from everywhere, if that makes any sense. of course the current theory explaining the universe postulates matter and time are like a spider web where reality only exists where the strands touch. i'm not going to pretend i understand all of that stuff, but i'm also not going to just hide under a blanket of "god did it."

but really if your only argument is that not every single facet of the moment has been fleshed out therefore you have the right to believe in the only thing there's less evidence for, it's not much of an argument. if your argument is to make me say i don't know, congrats, you stumped someone who didn't study astronomy or astrophysics.

#40 Fiz

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Posted 06 December 2008 - 02:38 PM

Fiz likes feeling cool in a small group of people, and I BET he listens to indie music and anything else mainstream is for IDIOTS.

i listen to all kinds of music.

but sweet burn brah

#41 Bama Panther

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Posted 06 December 2008 - 02:52 PM

the matter existed before the big bang. the current theory from the last time i found my girlfriend's science journals is that the carbon and hydrogen existed everywhere and exploded from everywhere, if that makes any sense. of course the current theory explaining the universe postulates matter and time are like a spider web where reality only exists where the strands touch. i'm not going to pretend i understand all of that stuff, but i'm also not going to just hide under a blanket of "god did it."

but really if your only argument is that not every single facet of the moment has been fleshed out therefore you have the right to believe in the only thing there's less evidence for, it's not much of an argument. if your argument is to make me say i don't know, congrats, you stumped someone who didn't study astronomy or astrophysics.


You apparently read none of my posts in the other thread. I am not hiding under a blanket saying "God did it." I am researching the different viewpoints and seeing which one I think makes more sense.

Your girlfriend's journal, once again, is conveniently overlooking that whole "nothing comes from nothing" thing. That's all I'll say.

Let me know how you like this argument I am about to throw out. It is one of rodeo's favorites. If your science is trying to prove that life, basically, came from nothing, it is science's job to prove it, not my job to disprove it.

My belief, while it started based on being raised a Christian, is now based on researching both sides of the fence and determining which one makes more sense to me. It takes just as much faith to fill in the gaps in science as it does to believe in a Creator. There are many holes that are left unfilled by science. To me, it appears illogical to think that those holes will be filled in.

Believe what you want though. I don't think less of you, nor will I condemn you for it.

#42 Fiz

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Posted 06 December 2008 - 03:29 PM

Y
Your girlfriend's journal, once again, is conveniently overlooking that whole "nothing comes from nothing" thing. That's all I'll say.

the bbt has nothing to do with the origins of the universe, simply how it developed over time.

edit* but if you're asking me if i have an answer for what happened before that, no i do not. however, science has had a tendency to answer questions all throughout history that were thought to be unanswerable. i'm confident eventually an answer will be had, and after that people that the god of the gaps will retreat to something else.

Edited by Fiz, 06 December 2008 - 03:34 PM.



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