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Kurt Warner a Hall of Famer?


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#16 Falcons1stPanthers2nd

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 04:24 AM

This post shows how spoiled we are as football fans. If Cam Newton had his 2013 numbers in 1999, he would have been fourth in passing TDs. Instead he was tied for 12th.

In 1999, only Steve Beuerlein and Kurt Warner had over 30 passing TDs. Steve had 36 and Warner had 41. 41 passing TDs in 1999 was huge.... that made Kurt Warner the only person not named Dan Marino to have thrown 40 TDs in a season (at the time).

 

A few years later, he put up the second most passing yardage in history (at the time). Then he had his hand (wrist?) injury and it took a long time for him to get over that. The year he played for the Giants, he was only there to mentor Eli. The Giants were definitely a run first team; much of the passing game even went through Tiki Barber.

 

When he got to Arizona, he had no run game and no defense. When he finally was given control of the team (he was originally set to mentor Matt Leinart) and had a run game and a modicum of defense, the Cardinals were NFC Champs.

 

If you look at it with a modern perspective, Warner's numbers were simply above average. But if you look at his numbers in context with history and the era in which he played, he would definitely get in on a "slow year."

No. It shows i have higher standards for HoF. I don't like the way the game has been offensively steered. My favorite era to watch is the 70s. I justdon't think he's a HoFer. The year he threw for all that yardage? Guess what he also threw 22 picks. It's notlike he played in some offensively sputtering era. He was just one of the first to usher in the new. Outside the 2 seasons you mentioned he never had a qb rating over 90 except 2008. That's not HoF to me. you've just mentioned a couple great seasons. It takes more than that to be a HoFer.


Edited by Falcons1stPanthers2nd, 25 June 2014 - 04:30 AM.


#17 Chimera

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 07:45 AM

2-time MVP
greatest UDFA ever
Most passing yards in superbowl (x3)
Over 1100 passing yards in a single post season
Career 65.5 completion %
career 93.7 passer rating

His wikipedia page has more records than I'm willing to copy and paste from a phone.

But yeah, let's judge him on the years he mentored Eli Manning and Matt Leinart.

Edited by googoodan, 25 June 2014 - 07:45 AM.


#18 Chimera

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 07:49 AM

Remember, the hall of fame isn't called the hall of stats. It honors players who have made a mark on the game. Warner showed that exotic offenses can win championships. He showed the "next man up" mentality can work if you put some confidence in the guy. His story is an inspiration to all college players who don't get drafted.

Being old and pining for 40 years ago holds no bearing on who is chosen to represent the NFL in Canton.

Edited by googoodan, 25 June 2014 - 07:52 AM.


#19 dos poptarts

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 09:13 AM

I'd vote him in.



#20 Falcons1stPanthers2nd

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 05:23 PM

2-time MVP
greatest UDFA ever
Most passing yards in superbowl (x2)
Over 1100 passing yards in a single post season
Career 65.5 completion %
career 93.7 passer rating

His wikipedia page has more records than I'm willing to copy and paste from a phone.

But yeah, let's judge him on the years he mentored Eli Manning and Matt Leinart.

 

Why couldn't he perform those years as well like a HoFer would? You mentioned 1 record btw and you were inaccurate in your 3x

Remember, the hall of fame isn't called the hall of stats. It honors players who have made a mark on the game. Warner showed that exotic offenses can win championships. He showed the "next man up" mentality can work if you put some confidence in the guy. His story is an inspiration to all college players who don't get drafted.

Being old and pining for 40 years ago holds no bearing on who is chosen to represent the NFL in Canton.

Exotic offenses can win championships? Raiders in 76 80 83. Redskins in the glory years. I'm a huge Warner fan. I've made my career in a grocery store believe me i love Warner. Just don't think he's HoF. Just outside? Yes. 

 

I'm not old. You assume that cause i said my favorite era is the 70s as a reply to you saying this shows how fans are spoiled. You proceeded to insinuate i was 13 then 60 in 2 posts. Which is it? And the current HoF is a joke. Also you have no bearing on who is chosen to represent the NFL in Canton either. So quit being pretentious. I'm not the only one who said No he's not a HoFer. 

 

By your logic plunkett should be in. And Warner in before Stabler is lulz.


Edited by Falcons1stPanthers2nd, 25 June 2014 - 05:29 PM.


#21 Chimera

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 11:33 PM

Why couldn't he perform those years as well like a HoFer would? You mentioned 1 record btw and you were inaccurate in your 3x

Exotic offenses can win championships? Raiders in 76 80 83. Redskins in the glory years. I'm a huge Warner fan. I've made my career in a grocery store believe me i love Warner. Just don't think he's HoF. Just outside? Yes. 

 

I'm not old. You assume that cause i said my favorite era is the 70s as a reply to you saying this shows how fans are spoiled. You proceeded to insinuate i was 13 then 60 in 2 posts. Which is it? And the current HoF is a joke. Also you have no bearing on who is chosen to represent the NFL in Canton either. So quit being pretentious. I'm not the only one who said No he's not a HoFer. 

 

By your logic plunkett should be in. And Warner in before Stabler is lulz.

 

How was I inaccurate in my 3x? Its right there...

Most Yards Gained, Game 414 Kurt Warner, St. Louis vs. Tennessee, XXXIV 377 Kurt Warner, Arizona vs. Pittsburgh, XLIII 365 Kurt Warner, St. Louis vs. New England, XXXVI

http://www.nfl.com/s.../player/passing

 

Why didn't Stabler perform so well after his only SB victory as a HoFer would? (hint: same reason as Warner)

Stabler won the same number of Super Bowls as Warner, threw more interceptions than touchdowns, and was actually drafted. Oh, and he had one fewer league MVP trophy.

 

Not sure what was "exotic" about the '76 Raiders offense. It was a carbon copy of the Air Coryell that the Cardinals had been using for a few years. Sure, the Rams' offense was too, but unlike earlier teams, they didn't need a 2:1 rush to pass ratio to set it up.

 

Again... it is not the Hall of Stats. How is Ken Stabler's story better than Kurt Warner's? Is it the three divorces? The three DUIs? Nonpayment of taxes?

 

Plunkett's career was pretty pedestrian all around. The Super Bowl against the Eagles was a brilliant game, but that was about it.


Edited by googoodan, 25 June 2014 - 11:36 PM.


#22 @bonafidebanter

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Posted 26 June 2014 - 09:44 AM

If Steve Young made it, why not this guy? Go back and look at Steve Young's career. USFL to the bench in Tampa then to another back up role in San Fran until he FINALLY got a chance to start on a stacked team. Steve Young is one of the most overrated QB's in his-story!!



#23 Davidson Deac II

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Posted 26 June 2014 - 09:02 PM

How was I inaccurate in my 3x? Its right there...

Most Yards Gained, Game 414 Kurt Warner, St. Louis vs. Tennessee, XXXIV 377 Kurt Warner, Arizona vs. Pittsburgh, XLIII 365 Kurt Warner, St. Louis vs. New England, XXXVI

http://www.nfl.com/s.../player/passing

 

Why didn't Stabler perform so well after his only SB victory as a HoFer would? (hint: same reason as Warner)

Stabler won the same number of Super Bowls as Warner, threw more interceptions than touchdowns, and was actually drafted. Oh, and he had one fewer league MVP trophy.

 

Not sure what was "exotic" about the '76 Raiders offense. It was a carbon copy of the Air Coryell that the Cardinals had been using for a few years. Sure, the Rams' offense was too, but unlike earlier teams, they didn't need a 2:1 rush to pass ratio to set it up.

 

Again... it is not the Hall of Stats. How is Ken Stabler's story better than Kurt Warner's? Is it the three divorces? The three DUIs? Nonpayment of taxes?

 

Plunkett's career was pretty pedestrian all around. The Super Bowl against the Eagles was a brilliant game, but that was about it.

 

Stabler played in an era where mugging the receiver was common practice.  It became illegal to hit a receiver past the 5 yard line in the late 70's early 80's.  Because of that, QB's from that era tend to have a lot more int's than QB's from the 80's on. 



#24 Falcons1stPanthers2nd

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Posted 26 June 2014 - 10:55 PM

How was I inaccurate in my 3x? Its right there...

Most Yards Gained, Game 414 Kurt Warner, St. Louis vs. Tennessee, XXXIV 377 Kurt Warner, Arizona vs. Pittsburgh, XLIII 365 Kurt Warner, St. Louis vs. New England, XXXVI

http://www.nfl.com/s.../player/passing

 

Why didn't Stabler perform so well after his only SB victory as a HoFer would? (hint: same reason as Warner)

Stabler won the same number of Super Bowls as Warner, threw more interceptions than touchdowns, and was actually drafted. Oh, and he had one fewer league MVP trophy.

 

Not sure what was "exotic" about the '76 Raiders offense. It was a carbon copy of the Air Coryell that the Cardinals had been using for a few years. Sure, the Rams' offense was too, but unlike earlier teams, they didn't need a 2:1 rush to pass ratio to set it up.

 

Again... it is not the Hall of Stats. How is Ken Stabler's story better than Kurt Warner's? Is it the three divorces? The three DUIs? Nonpayment of taxes?

 

Plunkett's career was pretty pedestrian all around. The Super Bowl against the Eagles was a brilliant game, but that was about it.

i read an inaccurate source.

 

I'm simply using your metrics to say Stabler is a hofer. More ints than TDs? So did every qb who played in the 70s. Eras.

 

I also mentioned the redskins. And the Cardinals didn't have cliff branch (who deserves hof over lynn swann 3x over)

 

So great stories are HoFers? Marques colston should be in then. Induct Rudy while we're at it. Is it the Hall of Stories? What is this poo you keep saying about the hall of stats? A HoFer dominates for several years. Your boy dominated one year maybe two. Quit being so butthurt cause i don't think he's as good as you do. As much as you guys bash Ryan for having amazing weapons so did Warner.

 

Jesus he's a great QB but not HoF. Sorry. Just because someone disagrees doesn't mean you have to have a coronary.

Either way it's a stupid argument cause the HoF is a sham.


Edited by Falcons1stPanthers2nd, 26 June 2014 - 10:58 PM.


#25 Chimera

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Posted 28 June 2014 - 12:00 PM

i read an inaccurate source.

I'm simply using your metrics to say Stabler is a hofer. More ints than TDs? So did every qb who played in the 70s. Eras.

I also mentioned the redskins. And the Cardinals didn't have cliff branch (who deserves hof over lynn swann 3x over)

So great stories are HoFers? Marques colston should be in then. Induct Rudy while we're at it. Is it the Hall of Stories? What is this poo you keep saying about the hall of stats? A HoFer dominates for several years. Your boy dominated one year maybe two. Quit being so butthurt cause i don't think he's as good as you do. As much as you guys bash Ryan for having amazing weapons so did Warner.

Jesus he's a great QB but not HoF. Sorry. Just because someone disagrees doesn't mean you have to have a coronary.
Either way it's a stupid argument cause the HoF is a sham.


By Hall of Stats, I'm saying the hall is about more than stats. Warner changed the way scouts do their jobs. He passed for 4000 yards before further rule changes to boost the passing game. He was bagging groceries less than a year before he was league MVP. He took two perennial loser teams to the Super Bowl.
Had he retired after his injury, I would see him as you see him: a flash in the pan who peaked early. It was his 2008/2009 performances, combined with his early years, that make him HOF material in my eyes.

#26 Falcons1stPanthers2nd

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Posted 28 June 2014 - 07:16 PM

By Hall of Stats, I'm saying the hall is about more than stats. Warner changed the way scouts do their jobs. He passed for 4000 yards before further rule changes to boost the passing game. He was bagging groceries less than a year before he was league MVP. He took two perennial loser teams to the Super Bowl.
Had he retired after his injury, I would see him as you see him: a flash in the pan who peaked early. It was his 2008/2009 performances, combined with his early years, that make him HOF material in my eyes.

Fair enough. I mean i could see both sides. I love his story. 



#27 cardiackat88.

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Posted 29 June 2014 - 03:07 PM

Why is this even a question?

 

Absolutley!



#28 cardiackat88.

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Posted 29 June 2014 - 03:09 PM

By Hall of Stats, I'm saying the hall is about more than stats. Warner changed the way scouts do their jobs. He passed for 4000 yards before further rule changes to boost the passing game. He was bagging groceries less than a year before he was league MVP. He took two perennial loser teams to the Super Bowl.
Had he retired after his injury, I would see him as you see him: a flash in the pan who peaked early. It was his 2008/2009 performances, combined with his early years, that make him HOF material in my eyes.

 

Not to mention he was still lightin' it the hell up before he retired.

 

His last few games were something fierce!



#29 footballisasport

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 07:32 PM

He'll get in on the first ballot. He works for the NFL Network. Name one person who works for that network and not made the FHoF on their first try?

#30 tommy gun

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 08:10 PM

the last few yrs, the hall has let a few head scratchers in...ricky jackson? warren sapp? I think warner will get in. above average career, sb win, and all around great back story. also think, plunkett, stabler and phil simms deserve it too. all had sb wins, and all around winners. simms never had anybody to throw to. still had 199 tds. 




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