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Fox/Delhomme Supports-- I want to hear from you.


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#16 TheSaint

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Posted 30 November 2009 - 12:36 PM

Count me as a full supporter.

#17 err456

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Posted 30 November 2009 - 12:40 PM

Moore may not be the answer but Jake is clearly not either.
I hope Moore or someone else gets a shot.
Loosing is bad but giving it away to such bad teams is just horrible.

#18 Udogg

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Posted 30 November 2009 - 12:48 PM

I don't have a problem with Fox or his coaching philosophy. I like the run the ball, play action, play defense and play field position type of football. I think it works. I have a problem with his loyalty to certain players, but I think that's more of a he see them during practice thing and we don't. I know in TC Jake looked better than Moore by a long way. But gameday is different this year apparently. I can see if he was like Mangini and the players look confused most of the day. Our players look like they know what is going on, its just bad execution at times. Defense is playing better and better each week IMO. Seems we haven't had as consistent offensive line play this year, but losing arguably your best lineman couldn't help the cause.

Jake however is like Rick Ankiel's pitching and Charles Barkley's golfswing. Physically there is nothing wrong, but mentally he can't do it at a high level anymore. He is done, and it hurts me to say it, because I do remember what he "did" for us, and how many games he pulled us through. But when your QB doesn't play with confidence it's a trickle down affect.

So I would like to keep Fox, and get rid of Jake. I am not sure about Davidson yet, because he doesn't have a QB this year. Meeks and the Defense has shown steady improvement imo. Plus historically speaking, next year will be a great year for us under Fox :)

#19 MaineManPanther

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Posted 30 November 2009 - 12:48 PM

I understand clearly. This is what I don't get. We all knew Jake was going to continue sucking, Jake has sucked on a monumental level. I don't see how you would believe he is truly our best chance to win when our head coach has shown before to be overly loyal to vets and you yourself know he sucks. Yet, instead of coming up with your own opinion of Matt Moore, you choose to put your stock into that head coach. Coaches CAN be wrong...ask Jeff Fisher. He thought Kerry Collins was still better than Vince Young. I know you want to believe Fox, but when every analyst, rival fan, etc. is agreeing with the average poster, maybe you have to sit down and think who is truly right. Man, just watch Delhomme play. Can there really be anybody WORSE than that?

And you guys were supporting Fox/Delhomme, even after games like the Buffalo one. If you truly stick by what you say, stick with Delhomme/Fox for the rest of the season. You should want Delhomme to start for the rest of the season and you should want Fox to return next year.


Read my past posts in other threads. I have said if we lose another, if we were out of the playoffs then I beleive we should put in Moore. My reason for going with Jake is that I believe there would be a better chance at him being decent them Moore doing better. There was no logical reason why Jake couldnt. He's never had a season remotley as bad as this one. We were in uncharted waters. However, obviously he has shown that for some reason I cant figure out, that he is not who he was.

And how can I have a opnion of Moore? How can anybody? Nobody has seen him play in a real game in two years. So if I have nothing to go on, why would I make a opinoin? All I have is a Pro coach who seen him every day. And if my choice is between that or just assuming Ill go with the coach.

Fox has shown numerous time hell play rookies or younger guys if he bleives they are better. Beason, Godfry, Peppers,Wharton, Marshall, Davis, Gross, Otah, Morgan,Hagartner,Mathis, Martin, Jenkins, Captian, Delhomme. And that just off the top of my head.

Every anylasts, reporter etc. Just beleives Dlehomme sucks, I know that, Fox knows that, everybody does. But not one of them know who Moore is. So they wouldnt know the right move would they? Coaches can absotluley be wrong, but if you were to tell me who'd id rather bet on Id pick a coach over posters or espn anaylst.

#20 AceMan

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Posted 30 November 2009 - 01:05 PM

I don't have a problem with Fox or his coaching philosophy. I like the run the ball, play action, play defense and play field position type of football. I think it works. I have a problem with his loyalty to certain players, but I think that's more of a he see them during practice thing and we don't. I know in TC Jake looked better than Moore by a long way. But gameday is different this year apparently. I can see if he was like Mangini and the players look confused most of the day. Our players look like they know what is going on, its just bad execution at times. Defense is playing better and better each week IMO. Seems we haven't had as consistent offensive line play this year, but losing arguably your best lineman couldn't help the cause.

Jake however is like Rick Ankiel's pitching and Charles Barkley's golfswing. Physically there is nothing wrong, but mentally he can't do it at a high level anymore. He is done, and it hurts me to say it, because I do remember what he "did" for us, and how many games he pulled us through. But when your QB doesn't play with confidence it's a trickle down affect.

So I would like to keep Fox, and get rid of Jake. I am not sure about Davidson yet, because he doesn't have a QB this year. Meeks and the Defense has shown steady improvement imo. Plus historically speaking, next year will be a great year for us under Fox :)


I'm not too sure about that, but I see where you're getting at. Jake has looked pretty bad in training camp, scrimmage, and the preseason. Moore has looked bad in the preseason as well.

Read my past posts in other threads. I have said if we lose another, if we were out of the playoffs then I beleive we should put in Moore. My reason for going with Jake is that I believe there would be a better chance at him being decent them Moore doing better. There was no logical reason why Jake couldnt. He's never had a season remotley as bad as this one. We were in uncharted waters. However, obviously he has shown that for some reason I cant figure out, that he is not who he was.

And how can I have a opnion of Moore? How can anybody? Nobody has seen him play in a real game in two years. So if I have nothing to go on, why would I make a opinoin? All I have is a Pro coach who seen him every day. And if my choice is between that or just assuming Ill go with the coach.


Ultimately, I guess it is just a matter of opinion. At the end of the day, we're both Panther fans and our franchise is hurting. IMO, if you couldn't see that midway through last year, the Arizona playoff game, the Eagles game this year, and the Buffalo game this year that Jake Delhomme would never be decent again, I just don't know what to tell you. Didn't this same "stick with veteran's mentality" burn us before with Wahle, Rucker, etc.?

When I say opinion, I mean this...You have Pro-Moore fans using his 2-1 start as reasoning for him to start. Then you have the ones against Moore using his preseason(maybe?) or John Fox to rationalize not starting him. No one really knows what this kid would do. But, I would be damned if I wouldn't put this unknown in instead of tanking the season on HOPE that Jake Delhomme can return to average. YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME! The logical reason is that Jake's arm is done and he just can't do it anymore. We can't win with Jake, let's see if we can win with Moore. THAT is the logical reason. Ask any non-Panther fan. But like I said earlier, it's just a matter of opinion.

#21 MaineManPanther

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Posted 30 November 2009 - 01:15 PM

I'm not too sure about that, but I see where you're getting at. Jake has looked pretty bad in training camp, scrimmage, and the preseason. Moore has looked bad in the preseason as well.



Ultimately, I guess it is just a matter of opinion. At the end of the day, we're both Panther fans and our franchise is hurting. IMO, if you couldn't see that midway through last year, the Arizona playoff game, the Eagles game this year, and the Buffalo game this year that Jake Delhomme would never be decent again, I just don't know what to tell you. Didn't this same "stick with veteran's mentality" burn us before with Wahle, Rucker, etc.?

When I say opinion, I mean this...You have Pro-Moore fans using his 2-1 start as reasoning for him to start. Then you have the ones against Moore using his preseason(maybe?) or John Fox to rationalize not starting him. No one really knows what this kid would do. But, I would be damned if I wouldn't put this unknown in instead of tanking the season on HOPE that Jake Delhomme can return to average. YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME! The logical reason is that Jake's arm is done and he just can't do it anymore. We can't win with Jake, let's see if we can win with Moore. THAT is the logical reason. Ask any non-Panther fan. But like I said earlier, it's just a matter of opinion.


But most people are basing moore on the "hope' that he will be better. I wasnt basing on hope, I was basing it on what I thought was more likley. Just my humble opinoin I thought It was more likely that vetran Jake would reutrn to what he was atleast last year then a thrid string QB getting to a level that he's never shown he has. Jake he showed signs in some games of doing that. Sadly his bad vaslty outwiegh that. Im all for starting Moore now.
At the same time I totally understand your reasoning. Its seems to be a moot point now, as I highly doubt Moore doesnt start.

#22 Sandy Claws

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Posted 30 November 2009 - 03:37 PM

It's funny that it took some people THIS long to understand Delhomme was done. I guess that is what blind loyalty and slurping gets for you. Most of the Fox/Delhomme supports have jumped ship, which irritates me cuz they waited until our playoffs hopes were pretty much over to leave. If you slurpers really had faith in John Fox/Delhomme, you would wait until the season was over.

Anybody could have told you Delhomme was done LAST year. Again, he looked ball in training camp, the live scrimmage, and the preseason. What did you expect? Fox had two prime opportunities to bench Jake, after the Eagles game and during the by week.

I'll throw some names out there...MaineMan, Savior Faire, MrT, Delhommey, RT81/Jake Delhomme 17...I know I'm missing some more, but get your @rses in here and defend your boys...


You just want change. You don't give rat's ass whether it's for the good or not. NOT ALL CHANGE IS FOR THE BETTER!! Who starts? Moore? What have you seen in the 3 games he started with a watered down game plan in '07 and practices since that make him the better option today? What? You haven't seen any practices? No camp? So what are you basing your opinion on that Moore is the better option now?
When you're driving down the road and you come to a red light or stop sign, do you close your eyes and hit the gas? You might get away with it a time or two (like against the lowly Bucs next week) but you'll regret it sooner rather than later. I go to camp, spend quite a bit of time there in fact. Jake was the best looking QB there this year IMHO. I didn't really see it as very close competition either. Can Moore step up his performance during a real game? Possibly, but do we want a QB who picks when he decides to play at a peak? Some think we have a highly paid DE doing that now.

#23 AceMan

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Posted 30 November 2009 - 03:58 PM

You just want change. You don't give rat's ass whether it's for the good or not. NOT ALL CHANGE IS FOR THE BETTER!! Who starts? Moore? What have you seen in the 3 games he started with a watered down game plan in '07 and practices since that make him the better option today? What? You haven't seen any practices? No camp? So what are you basing your opinion on that Moore is the better option now?
When you're driving down the road and you come to a red light or stop sign, do you close your eyes and hit the gas? You might get away with it a time or two (like against the lowly Bucs next week) but you'll regret it sooner rather than later. I go to camp, spend quite a bit of time there in fact. Jake was the best looking QB there this year IMHO. I didn't really see it as very close competition either. Can Moore step up his performance during a real game? Possibly, but do we want a QB who picks when he decides to play at a peak? Some think we have a highly paid DE doing that now.


For peaks sake!

Of course I want change, man. Delhomme was and has killed our season. Wasn't totally his fault(Biggest chunk goes to Fox), but he was one of the major factors. Our franchise is in conservative hell! I think Moore is better because I don't think many QBs can play worse than Delhomme. I just want to see what the kid had, maybe we could have salvaged our season. Sometimes, you got to take chances. A reason why Gruden was able to win a SB with Dungy's team. If I knew that I wouldn't be able to make the playoffs with Delhomme, why not try Moore? If he is bad too, we get the same result. Personally, I don't think Moore will be that good and we will be scrambling for a QB this offseason. I'm almost ready to chalk next year as a rebuilding year. Who knows.

Also, all I've heard was Delhomme didn't look to impressive in training camp, but McCown and Moore looked bad. At the live scrimmage, Delhomme was booed. At preseason, Delhomme didn't look accurate. The writing was on the wall for our QBs.


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