lol, this is f**king classic. try thinking next time. start by looking up the definition of the word "because"
aside from that, it's nice to see people making actual arguments in the latter stages of this thread. i think woodie has a pretty reasoned and realistic view of the offseason moves, and additionally i happen to feel similarly. there are reasonable and realistic arguments to be made for the contrary, but p55 certainly isn't making them.
you always need average players to fill important roles on your team, but you still want difference-makers. i just don't see where these difference-makers were on the free agency market aside from a few guys who the panthers would have gotten outbid on anyways.
and i also agree with woodie that a lot of the players that, as of now, will be expected to step into more important roles (fiammetta, leonard, tyler, connor, anderson, sutton) are currently average. the difference is they are young and de-fin-ite-ly possess the potential to become more than average. hell, fiammetta was a rookie. sutton has played 2 years. leonard has played 3 years. in most of these cases the panthers were never going to find out if they were more than average unless they gave them more responsibility and more snaps. what, you're going to draft a young player and let them be unimportant until they're too old to improve? why are you spending 3rd round picks and trading 4th and 5th round picks for these guys, then? there are acres of fat dudes who can stand up in the middle of the d-line and be average that are available at any point during any NFL season. and they're all dying to play. you give picks for guys you believe in and want to give a real chance to matter.
if the right player comes available after the draft and during training camp, then hurney and fox have shown the tendency to pick those guys up on the cheap. harris worked out great. sutton worked out really well for what they asked him to do. this is really not all that different from how the panthers have behaved in the past several offseasons. is it really all that surprising or OMG OMINOUS?
I thought I was done here but will make one last post and let it go. First of all I don't think we are done for the year. We have the draft and the FA signing period after the draft. I never said we will won't try and fill the holes we have. Hurney has a job to do and he is doing the best he can given the marching orders he has been given. He recognizes that Fox's job is on the line and hasn't signed his extension yet from What I have read in somewhat of a leveraged attempt to convince Richardson to keep Fox.
No one is also arguing that you don'r need role players or guys who you find in the bargain basement or obtain by scouting every nook and cranny looking for talent. The Panthers have always done a good job of that. And for the most part we have gotten the most out of the guys we pick up like that.
THis whole discussion has morphed from the original concept that Richardson and the Panthers are purposely tanking the season into a number of bunny threads. MY discussion with Woodie was simply that his perception was that everyone we lost were average easily replaceable guys. My perception was while we had them on the team we all considered them pretty good and have devalued them to be average now that they were gone and wanted to discount their worth. Plus we were counting on their backups to all step in and play well which may or may not happen. Then we discussed that this whole thread didn't address the folks who complained that we always go for average and seem content to settle for being a contender in some years and otherwise settle for 8-8 or 7-9.
My concerns have been that this isn't business as usual, we got rid of a lot more starters than we every have in any year past- go do the homework. We are operating under a different set of priorities than we have in the past which is go cheap first and find talent secondly. And that we are under no financial crisis. We are one of the haves not the have nots and don't need to act like Tampa. And finally that the rest of the division by keeping their starters and players and not dumping them are already above us in terms of talent and seem content on getting better without going on the cheap.
THis is not an indictment of Fox or Hunrey but my feelings that Richardson is operating with a different agenda given his leadership role on the negotiating committee with the players and not about winning as in years before. And yes I think if you can't see that you are a sheep. All of the statements about it will be alright, the guys we lost are average, everyone will step up etc misses the real point. We are more worried about a lockout which the owners are in fact forcing on the players than we are in winning this year. And that most of this was avoidable if Richardson wanted to do it but he doesn't. If we end up okay this year it will be a real testament to the work Hurney and Fox and the coaching staff have done not to the flexibility and support given by Richardson this year.
That has been my point all along. Otherwise I am done until after the draft. Then I will have something new to talk about.
Edited by panthers55, 13 April 2010 - 07:17 AM.