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#121 Cavscout

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Posted 10 December 2010 - 06:33 PM

i'd hate the mallett pick. i'd be fine with the newton pick if we it was the result of some fine trading down resulting in a good few early picks and another 1st rounder the following year.

first choice is still luck easily and i think that is going to be the case with harbaugh and most teams in the league if they were given a chance/had the need.


If we don't get Luck at #1 for some reason, and we trade down, I would rather us pass on all other QB's including Newton

#122 rayzor

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Posted 10 December 2010 - 06:41 PM

newton > clausen and it isn't even close.

#123 SgtJoo

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Posted 11 December 2010 - 02:00 AM

I don't watch college ball..

Without bias, is Scam on the level of Luck?

#124 rayzor

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Posted 11 December 2010 - 02:19 AM

I don't watch college ball..

Without bias, is Scam on the level of Luck?

i like both. it depends on who you ask. i like luck more and think he's the safer pick. it also depends on what style you like or think is better. if you like the way peyton manning plays then you'll like luck. if you prefer what vick does, esp the mature version that is at philly, then you'd probably like newton.

luck isn't a coach/OC playing QB like peyton, but he's incredibly cerebral and does everything right. he can read defenses, buy time in the pocket make solid decisions...you've read all of it and you see it all when you watch him play. he's got a really good ability to run and does it with a lot of speed as well, but he prefers to make sure that there is no one open first.

newton is like a very mobile big ben as a passer. he's also a lot like mike vick is now...only bigger and tougher.

imo, both have great futures ahead of them. luck would be more able to fit into any offense and do incredibly well. newton would more need a offense built around him to reach his potential. in the right offense, he could be downright lethal. one thing that will hold newton back is that it might take him longer to learn how to read defenses. not really a knock against him, luck is incredibly smart...3.55 at stanford and he's able to pick up things incredibly quick no matter what it is. newton is able to pay attention to what safeties are doing to help with timing and placement of his passes, but things will be a lot more complicated than that. it's probably more important for newton to have a mentor and to have someone start in front of him for a year.

both are also pretty strong leaders on their team and are able to get their teammates motivated and playing hard for them.

Edited by rayzor, 11 December 2010 - 02:25 AM.


#125 jpniner

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Posted 11 December 2010 - 11:22 AM

Newton is not as fast as Vick, I'd say he's a more talented McNabb over Vick.

#126 Woodie

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Posted 11 December 2010 - 11:56 AM

newton > clausen and it isn't even close.

Exactly right, the only mistake is you've got the arrow pointing the wrong direction :D.

Sorry, but I'm just not that impressed by Newton. Sure he's exciting and can break a big play...in college. But from what I've seen of him, many of his big plays would not fly in the NFL. His passing, while good, is relatively unchallenged. Teams cheat so bad against the run against Auburn that most of the time, he's throwing to wide open receivers...and even then, it's usually to the first or possibly second option. He rarely has to go through his progressions or thread the needle to squeeze the pass in between defenders.

A lot of people want to make the Vick comparison, and in his passing game, it is a good one. Both had offenses tailored to their athleticism and ability to run/improvise. Neither were asked to do a whole lot as a passer but take what the defense gave them, then run if something wasn't there after the initial read. I will give Newton this, though, I do think he is more accurate than Vick coming out of college, but we don't know if he can do it consistently when things aren't laid out for him.

As a runner, there's little comparison to Vick other than the general point that they are both running QB's. Vick's running was based on his superb quickness and speed and the ability to make guys miss, while Newton's is based on being athletic enough to force the defender into arm tackles, then being big and strong enough to run through those tackles (although he can make guys in college miss on occasion, I don't believe he has the quickness to regularly do it in the NFL). And in the NFL, he won't be running through arm tackles like he does in college. (I'm not talking about the runs through wide open lanes that any athletic running QB can make at any level, just the plays that he creates on his own).

Don't get me wrong, I think Newton has the potential to be a decent QB in the NFL, and make the occasional play, I just don't think it will be for a couple of years. But overall, I believe his success as a runner will be similar to Culpeppers pre-injury. Which is good, as long as you have the passing ability to make defenses play honest, but I'm not convinced Newton does at this point. Fwiw, I think Newton is very much like Vince Young (with a better head on his shoulders, hopefully), which is fine for a 2nd or 3rd round QB, but not a 1st.

#127 Cracka McNasty

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Posted 11 December 2010 - 12:08 PM

Exactly right, the only mistake is you've got the arrow pointing the wrong direction :D.

Sorry, but I'm just not that impressed by Newton. Sure he's exciting and can break a big play...in college. But from what I've seen of him, many of his big plays would not fly in the NFL. His passing, while good, is relatively unchallenged. Teams cheat so bad against the run against Auburn that most of the time, he's throwing to wide open receivers...and even then, it's usually to the first or possibly second option. He rarely has to go through his progressions or thread the needle to squeeze the pass in between defenders.

A lot of people want to make the Vick comparison, and in his passing game, it is a good one. Both had offenses tailored to their athleticism and ability to run/improvise. Neither were asked to do a whole lot as a passer but take what the defense gave them, then run if something wasn't there after the initial read. I will give Newton this, though, I do think he is more accurate than Vick coming out of college, but we don't know if he can do it consistently when things aren't laid out for him.

As a runner, there's little comparison to Vick other than the general point that they are both running QB's. Vick's running was based on his superb quickness and speed and the ability to make guys miss, while Newton's is based on being athletic enough to force the defender into arm tackles, then being big and strong enough to run through those tackles (although he can make guys in college miss on occasion, I don't believe he has the quickness to regularly do it in the NFL). And in the NFL, he won't be running through arm tackles like he does in college. (I'm not talking about the runs through wide open lanes that any athletic running QB can make at any level, just the plays that he creates on his own).

Don't get me wrong, I think Newton has the potential to be a decent QB in the NFL, and make the occasional play, I just don't think it will be for a couple of years. But overall, I believe his success as a runner will be similar to Culpeppers pre-injury. Which is good, as long as you have the passing ability to make defenses play honest, but I'm not convinced Newton does at this point. Fwiw, I think Newton is very much like Vince Young (with a better head on his shoulders, hopefully), which is fine for a 2nd or 3rd round QB, but not a 1st.


that's pretty much exactly how i feel about newton as well.

#128 D34Williams

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Posted 11 December 2010 - 09:38 PM

Well no Heisman for Luck as we all predicted, but seeing his highlights, whether its trucking db's, forcing a fumble, or making plays, I'm pretty fired up about getting him, and would love to see it work out.

#129 theDIRTYcode

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Posted 11 December 2010 - 09:53 PM

Has Mike Mayock put out a scouting report on Andrew Luck yet? If there is one analyst you want to listen to when it comes to QBs, he is it. Dude is money scouting QBs.

#130 Mother Grabber

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Posted 12 December 2010 - 01:09 AM

Newton is not as fast as Vick, I'd say he's a more talented McNabb over Vick.


With a passing % in the high 60s, he could very well be a great NFL QB. He seems to have the physical tools. We'll have to see what kind of head he has before we know, though.

#131 Cavscout

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Posted 12 December 2010 - 05:43 AM

Newton has skills. That is not in question. The question I have is though, just like The Golden Calf of Bristol, Alex Smith, and others who have played in the spread offense in college is how long will it take for them to transistion to the different nuances of a pro-style offense. Luck is playing in a pro-style offense already so there is less of a learning curve.

Is Newton the type of player who will be the first one in the building and the last one out using all of his time to study like Manning and Ryan or will he be more like Russell and Leaf who spent the off-season party-ing and thinking that just because they had all of the physical tools that they did not need to develop any further.

Newton is a one year starter in FBS. I know that it was the SEC but it is still college. He rarely took a hit in college with his scrambling ability. That won't be the case in the NFL. Can he take hits? How does he throw when under pressure? does he step up into the pocket well or merely just take off running every time?

To me their are more questions about Newton than answers. Yes, he has skills and uses them effectively in college, but are those skills so dazzling that people don't see his flaws in how he relates to being an NFL QB?

#132 Urrymonster

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Posted 12 December 2010 - 09:59 AM

Has Mike Mayock put out a scouting report on Andrew Luck yet? If there is one analyst you want to listen to when it comes to QBs, he is it. Dude is money scouting QBs.


He loved Clausen

#133 Rags

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Posted 12 December 2010 - 10:21 AM




this guy knows what he's talking about guys.

#134 Lumps

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Posted 12 December 2010 - 11:06 AM

Take careful note at exactly why he doesn't think Luck is a franchise quarterback found at 1:07, I think you'll find some (a) very good point why Luck won't be a good quarterback. Also whenever he says 'I'm just', he says it twice...u know he means business.

#135 ...

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Posted 12 December 2010 - 11:20 AM

He loved Clausen


More like up and down on Clausen. I've seen quotes where he says "he has all the tools to succeed" and other quotes where he says "I'm not a big Clausen fan."

It's hard to tell what he really thinks. Draft analysts are often afraid to go against the grain or say anything too negative.


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