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What were you taught about American involvement in the ww2 european front?

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Posted · Report post

You mean Saving Private Ryan is a sham, Vin Diesel died for nothing!!!!

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Posted · Report post

No, he died for our entertainment.

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Posted · Report post

I have to agree with the over-sexamazation of the invasion of Festung Europa by combined American, British, and Canadian forces as highly overblown here.

It was a big deal, but by 1944 the Russians had been getting shelacked for many years.

The British even longer.

Across a couple of oceans, the Chinese would say big deal, our barbarion island "friends" have been slaughtering our people for over 10 years.

And as Fiz points out, Mark Clark's forces were sloggin up Italy in an awful war of attrition long before France was retaken, in what has been largely forgotten, so appropos that Rome was taken, and a day later the headlines were stolen as the landings at Normandy took place.

So yeah, I totally hear you.

I believe the Russians would have eventually prevailed over the Nazis.

The learning curve was steep, but they figured out how to win a land war in Asia.

Drag it out as long as possible, get millions of your soldiers killed in a meat grinder, since the one resouorce you had before American lend-lease took over was almost endless human fodder, and send them in wave after wave, with NKVD "loyalty" squads behind them, ensuring that if they didn't get killed by the Krauts, they would be killed by their own "comrades".

Stalin and Hitler.....talk about two foul human beings.

Anyway, my history classes in HS were mostly bleh.

College was better, but not much.

I learn stuff on my own, and don't stop collecting data until I feel confident I can take most "experts" the distance.

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Posted · Report post

Hitler bit off more than he could chew. He was stretched thin and it made it tough to fight and occupy at the same time. No doubt the russians made serious sacrifices and took a pounding.

hitler was forced to attack russia, they were about to attack Germany. Then all those early routs were due to Germany getting behind the supply lines of the Russians.

But then yeah they were bogged down in Russia, and the rest is history

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Posted · Report post

Hitler knew war was going to happen, but he was not "forced" to attack the Soviets. He was impatient and after the UK proved to be a bit too tough to crack right away, he convinced himself that Russia would be a pushover and he could have his armies back on the Western front by that next spring. Stalin was busy building his armies, but they were nowhere near ready to take on the Germans - he would have preferred to wait a year or two. The thing is, Hitler came within 20 miles or so of Moscow before being stopped.

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Posted · Report post

Hitler knew war was going to happen, but he was not "forced" to attack the Soviets. He was impatient and after the UK proved to be a bit too tough to crack right away, he convinced himself that Russia would be a pushover and he could have his armies back on the Western front by that next spring. Stalin was busy building his armies, but they were nowhere near ready to take on the Germans - he would have preferred to wait a year or two. The thing is, Hitler came within 20 miles or so of Moscow before being stopped.

Even had the Germans made it to Moscow, I still don't think taking it wins the war for them. The Russians still had quite a few high quality divisions in the East that could have been moved West if the situation became truly desperate. Stalin traded space for time in order to build up new troops and reserves, in the end he won.

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Posted · Report post

I believe the Russians would have eventually prevailed over the Nazis.

Perhaps, had the Allies not been back in Europe in force, I imagine boundary lines would look quite a bit different than they do today however.

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Lots of WWII veterans in my church. One of them is my dad's father in law. He got a silver star and served in Africa. Of all of the men who are WWII vets in my church, hardly anyone knows of any significant about of stories about what happened while they were there. They just won't talk about it. One old guy can't hear because his bomber was hit. Anyway, thats not got much to do with the thread. I will say that D-day, as relatively successful as it was or wasn't, was a disaster in a LOT of respects. Drownings, crashes, etc. I read a really good book on it. There were HUNDREDS killed in a "practice run" of D-day. One story I remember is that a high ranking guy insisted on being in the first wave. They were so worried about his safety that they armor plated his glider....which made it too heavy to fly so it crashed. One consensus that I have spotted through most of what I have read is that Hitler did a lot to help the Allies defeat Hitler.

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Posted · Report post

also, good topic Fiz. been a while since something was actually discussed in here.

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Posted · Report post

post-85-133194756273_thumb.jpgMy father was a WW2 pilot. Never talked about it much but he did tell me that what amazed him was the devastation he saw in Germany while flying in the Berlin airlift after the war

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My wife is filipina and my father inlaw was a guerilla fighter in the Philippines during the war. He died before I met him, but many of those old folks that were there during the war still hate the Japanese with a fervor that most of us will never understand.

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Posted · Report post

hitler was forced to attack russia, they were about to attack Germany. Then all those early routs were due to Germany getting behind the supply lines of the Russians.

But then yeah they were bogged down in Russia, and the rest is history

Um, no.

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