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So I got called an atheist today


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#166 Mr. Scot

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:31 PM

Only christians get to decide who is a christian, duh.

It actually is kind of a valid point.

If I tell you I'm a devout Muslim, but I don't believe in Allah, Islamic ideals or anything the Koran says, do you believe me?

#167 Porn Shop Clerk

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:32 PM

Only Allah knows the truth in your heart.

#168 The Saltman

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:35 PM

thats it im converting to Wicca

#169 mmmbeans

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:39 PM

It actually is kind of a valid point.

If I tell you I'm a devout Muslim, but I don't believe in Allah, Islamic ideals or anything the Koran says, do you believe me?


does it matter if I believe you?

#170 Mr. Scot

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:39 PM

Only Allah knows the truth in your heart.

Ah, but the heart dictates the words and deeds.

To put it another way, if I tell you I'm a pacifist, then proceed to take out a baseball bat and beat the daylights out of everyone I see, do you buy it?

#171 Cat

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:40 PM

It actually is kind of a valid point.

If I tell you I'm a devout Muslim, but I don't believe in Allah, Islamic ideals or anything the Koran says, do you believe me?



I think it's pretty evident through Hilter's speeches that he did believe in Jesus and that Jesus died on the cross and raised form the dead and that he was god. Those beliefs are in his writings and speeches.

Now does god actually consider hitler a christian? Well that's all a matter of opinion. I think no because I don't think the Christian god even exist. But I'd still call Hilter a Christian.

#172 mmmbeans

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:40 PM

Ah, but the heart dictates the words and deeds.

To put it another way, if I tell you I'm a pacifist, then proceed to take out a baseball bat and beat the daylights out of everyone I see, do you buy it?




that's a slightly more extreme example.

#173 Cat

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:42 PM

Ah, but the heart dictates the words and deeds.

To put it another way, if I tell you I'm a pacifist, then proceed to take out a baseball bat and beat the daylights out of everyone I see, do you buy it?


Do you think Moses is in heaven and was a godly man?
Cause he committed genocide in the name of God numerous times.

What about King David who was a man after gods on heart? He was only a murderer and adulterer.

Edited by Cat, 01 February 2011 - 02:44 PM.


#174 Mr. Scot

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:44 PM

Do you think Moses is in heaven?
Cause he committed genocide in the name of God numerous times.

You didn't answer the question.

If someone says they believe in something, even says it strongly, but their actions are completely against what they say, why would you believe them?

#175 mmmbeans

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:46 PM

i think Goliath is in heaven.

#176 Cat

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:49 PM

You didn't answer the question.

If someone says they believe in something, even says it strongly, but their actions are completely against what they say, why would you believe them?


Yeah. I have many friends who I know believe it all but there actions look nothing like what is laid out in much of the bible.



How about you give me your definition of Christian.

When I was a Christian my personal favorite definition came from Romans 10:9

That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.



#177 Porn Shop Clerk

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:50 PM

Ah, but the heart dictates the words and deeds.

To put it another way, if I tell you I'm a pacifist, then proceed to take out a baseball bat and beat the daylights out of everyone I see, do you buy it?


Isn't becoming a christian a process?

A process that encompasses God "testing" your faith continually until the day you die?

So at what point in the process does the person become a Christian? According to many, all you have to do is believe Jesus Christ is your personal Lord and Savior, and you are a christian and automatically going to heaven, no matter what you do. Just ask for forgiveness every day and keep doing fuged up poo and you get a free pass.

Being an absolute pillar of humanity and do nothing but wonderful things with your life for others around you is irrelevant, because if you don't think Jesus was the Spirit born in flesh, or even existed then, you're automatically damned to Hell for eternity for for that thought process.

"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as you are." (Matthew 23:15)


The ratio of christians to Pharisees is roughtly 1:100 from my personal experience.

#178 The Saltman

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:52 PM

cant wait to go to hell then :party:

#179 Mr. Scot

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 02:57 PM

Yeah. I have many friends who I know believe it all but there actions look nothing like what is laid out in much of the bible.

How about you give me your definition of Christian.

When I was a Christian my personal favorite definition came from Romans 10:9

It's not magic words. Anybody can say they believe in Christianity or any other system and be lying.

I get that you want to say Hitler as a Christian because you dislike religion. I'm not really interested in going back-and-forth on that because frankly, it's silly.

Honestly it's no different than people trying to paint the Arizona shooter as a Tea Party member. The old "damn them by forced association " tactic is a pretty weak argument no matter how it's used or who's using it.

If it makes you feel better, go with it. Doesn't really work for me.

#180 Mr. Scot

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 03:00 PM

Isn't becoming a christian a process?

A process that encompasses God "testing" your faith continually until the day you die?

So at what point in the process does the person become a Christian? According to many, all you have to do is believe Jesus Christ is your personal Lord and Savior, and you are a christian and automatically going to heaven, no matter what you do. Just ask for forgiveness every day and keep doing fuged up poo and you get a free pass.

Being an absolute pillar of humanity and do nothing but wonderful things with your life for others around you is irrelevant, because if you don't think Jesus was the Spirit born in flesh, or even existed then, you're automatically damned to Hell for eternity for for that thought process.

The ratio of christians to Pharisees is roughtly 1:100 from my personal experience.

I've never been one to buy that someone can just do whatever they want to from here on out and claim to be truly Christian. No one's perfect, but if it's real, there are changes.

There's a book by John MacArthur called "The Gospel According to Jesus" where he argues against that particular theology. Got him a load of flack in the Christian community when he wrote it, but I always thought he was right.


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