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Need a Vet QB for a one year lease


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#31 CarolinaPantherSinceDay1

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 04:09 PM

Either that or Brunell lost all of his money and after NO let him go he still needs a paycheck to survive...


http://sports.yahoo....ptplayers013111
yep i'll have to say you were right about that one.

#32 rayzor

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 04:18 PM

Run an offense then that hasn't been ran..west coast. And get a vet who like you said has experience with the system you running and has had success with it...Garcia.

you make the point of this thread worth a read thx much...i couldnt have done it better.

dude what?

why would we run a WCO? the coaching staff doesn't have experience in a WCO. terminology is completely different from the coryell. really none of the players have experience in it either. it's like learning a whole other language. there is no point in leanring a whole new offensive system like that, esp. when you already have a playbook made up already. and you want them to do it for a guy who will only be here one year? :lol:

go ahead and rationalize that all you want.

#33 CarolinaPantherSinceDay1

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 04:21 PM

WCO quarterback who has sucked every time he played for a non-WCO team.

No thanks.


would you change your mind if we ran a WCO....I'm just saying where's the beef...

#34 monstercat

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 04:23 PM

would you change your mind if we ran a WCO....I'm just saying where's the beef...


We don't run a WCO and we're not going to be running a WCO anytime soon, and furthermore, Garcia is old and washed up.

#35 CarolinaPantherSinceDay1

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 04:26 PM

dude what?

why would we run a WCO? the coaching staff doesn't have experience in a WCO. terminology is completely different from the coryell. really none of the players have experience in it either. it's like learning a whole other language. there is no point in leanring a whole new offensive system like that, esp. when you already have a playbook made up already. and you want them to do it for a guy who will only be here one year? :lol:

go ahead and rationalize that all you want.


The coaching staff once again has Rivera..Chud...who mind you come from San Diego who's head coach was Norv Turner who praises the WCO to all. And what playbook do you keep talking about...once again. JR and MH don't called the plays the coaches do. And to have a vet that knows the system well and teach others is a plus. New Coach...New Ideas...aint that how its suppose to work if not why not have kept Fox.

#36 rayzor

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 04:27 PM

We are basically getting a San Deigo type offense and a Philly type defense in Carolina next year if you do your research with the personal we have and what they are use to running.

You act as if JR and MH are calling plays

you know this makes sense if you don't think about it.

a little education for you. just because a team is on the west coast doesn't mean they run a WCO. Eagles have been running a WCO for years. san diego, on the other hand (and coast) have been running an air coryell for a long time, mainly because it is the birth place of the air coryell offense. at first coryell was called the west coast offense, but then bill walsh came up with his offensive system and called it the west coast and the name took off for that.

chud's experience is with a WCO and there are very few teams that actually run th WCo anymore. probably only 4 or 5 teams run it. it's a pretty complex system to learn and i really don't think there is enough of an advantage to it to go through all the work it would take to learn it all becuase you think that jeff garthia would be a good fit for a season here.

#37 rayzor

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 04:28 PM

The coaching staff once again has Rivera..Chud...who mind you come from San Diego who's head coach was Norv Turner who praises the WCO to all. And what playbook do you keep talking about...once again. JR and MH don't called the plays the coaches do. And to have a vet that knows the system well and teach others is a plus. New Coach...New Ideas...aint that how its suppose to work if not why not have kept Fox.

do what? where in the world are you getting that from?

#38 rayzor

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 04:37 PM

little education about the coryell offense for ya....

Coryell offense is the name given to the scheme and philosophy developed by former San Diego Chargers Coach, Don Coryell. Air Coryell was initially a nickname given to the offense of the San Diego Chargers under Coryell from 1978–1986, but now has come be used interchangeably with the term Coryell offense or the less common vertical offense as a descriptive term for the offensive philosophy Coryell developed.
With Dan Fouts as quarterback, San Diego Chargers' offense was among the greatest passing offenses in NFL history. The Chargers led the league in passing yards an NFL record 6 consecutive years from 1978-1983 [1] and again in 1985. They also led the league in total yards in offense 1980-1983 and 1985. Fouts, Charlie Joiner, and Kellen Winslow would all be inducted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame from those Charger teams.
Coryell opens up passing in the NFL

Coryell set the league on its ear with his passing offenses after moving up from the college ranks. He won two consecutive division titles (1974, 1975) with the Cardinals and three straight division titles (1979, 1980, 1981) with the Chargers, reaching the playoffs four consecutive times with the latter team. Coryell is the first coach ever to win more than 100 games at both the collegiate and professional level. Coryell's offensive innovations changed the entire nature of the league from a run-first league to a pass-first one.
Today most NFL offenses' passing games are at least partially based on Coryell conventions.
Former coach of the St. Louis Rams, Mike Martz, says "Don is the father of the modern passing game. People talk about the West Coast offense, but Don started the 'West Coast' decades ago and kept updating it. You look around the NFL now, and so many teams are running a version of the Coryell offense. Coaches have added their own touches, but it's still Coryell's offense. He has disciples all over the league. He changed the game."

and now a little education about norv turner and the coryell...

Norv Turner, current San Diego Chargers head coach and former offensive coordinator with the Dallas Cowboys, also implements a version of the Coryell style of offense. The Turner strain of Coryell offenses are still very reliant of a good receiving TE. Norv Turner strains sometimes feature an 'F-Back' (formerly known as an 'H-Back' in the 1980s), a hybrid tight end/wide receiver/fullback/running back. An F-Back is a multi-purpose, unpredictable tool for the offense. On any play he may carry the ball, lead block or pass block, play as a wide receiver, or run a tight end route. He is also part decoy, as his unpredictable role forces defenses to keep an eye on him, thereby opening up other opportunities for the offense.
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Current disciples of the Coryell offense

Today the most famous and successful advocates of this system are Norv Turner, Mike Martz, and Al Saunders.
Norv Turner learned the offense from longtime Coryell assistant, Ernie Zampese. Turner's take on the Coryell system turned around the career of Hall of Fame QB Troy Aikman and has proven to be very successful with talented high draft picks struggling with the complexities of the NFL, such as Alex Smith. Turner' variant is not the most robust flavor of Coryell offense. It is a very sound, QB friendly scheme that favors taking controlled chances, like quicker midrange post passes to WRs off play action rather than slower developing passes that leave QBs exposed. It is almost exclusively run out of the pro set. Turner favors a more limited palette of plays than Coryell and most other Coryell disciples, instead insisting on precise execution. His offenses are usually towards the top of the league standings, but are often labeled predictable. His offenses tend to include a strong running game, a #1 WR who can stretch the field and catch jump balls in the end-zone, a good receiving TE to attack the space the WRs create in the middle of the field and a FB who fills the role of a lead blocker and a final option as an outlet receiver. In Dallas, Turner made RB Emmitt Smith & WR Michael Irvin Hall of Famers, and TE Jay Novacek a five time pro bowler. As head coach of the San Diego Chargers, Turner's system helped quarterback Philip Rivers set new franchise records for single-season quarterback rating and touchdown passes in 2008.
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Coryell advocates

Coryell's direct development of future coaches included Super Bowl head coaches John Madden and Joe Gibbs, Super Bowl offensive coordinators Ernie Zampese and Al Saunders, as well as Jim Hanifan and Rod Dowhower. Adding to the Coryell coaching tree, Super Bowl offensive coordinator Norv Turner tutored under Zampese, and another Super Bowl offensive coordinator Mike Martz studied under both Zampese and later Turner [5]. Dan Henning coached under Gibbs. Baltimore Ravens' offensive coordinator Cam Cameron has spent most of his pro career coaching a variation of Turner's offense. Before taking the offensive coordinator job with the New York Jets in 2006, Brian Schottenheimer served four years as quarterbacks coach with the San Diego Chargers under Cameron who was offensive coordinator at the time.
http://en.wikipedia....Coryell_offense


Edited by rayzor, 01 February 2011 - 04:42 PM.


#39 rayzor

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 04:47 PM

now this thread is worth reading.

....and your welcome.

#40 CarolinaPantherSinceDay1

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 04:51 PM

now this thread is worth reading.

....and your welcome.


excuse me for my manners...

#41 panthers55

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 10:34 PM

As noted above the WCO offense can be morphed into many things but the general rules are short timing passes, yards after the catch and the short passes largely replace the running game.
The Coryell offense uses more of a running attack and play action off the run to set up the pass. Routes are usually medium to deep and dump downs to receivers are what happens when no one else is open whereas in the WCO they are a primary staple of the passing game.

A QB in air coryell has to have a strong and accurate arm, good touch in the 10-20 yard range and be able to pass the ball on third down with onsistency to move the chains.

The offenses are not similar in philosophy.

#42 Stumpy

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 11:35 PM

Norv Turner strains sometimes feature an 'F-Back' (formerly known as an 'H-Back' in the 1980s), a hybrid tight end/wide receiver/fullback/running back. An F-Back is a multi-purpose, unpredictable tool for the offense. On any play he may carry the ball, lead block or pass block, play as a wide receiver, or run a tight end route. He is also part decoy, as his unpredictable role forces defenses to keep an eye on him, thereby opening up other opportunities for the offense.


Anybody know what Nick Goings is doing these days? ;)

#43 rayzor

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Posted 02 February 2011 - 11:45 AM

Anybody know what Nick Goings is doing these days? ;)

with all the concussions he got i'm not sure he would even know.

#44 Mr. Scot

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Posted 02 February 2011 - 12:12 PM

Take a look at the "Coaching Connections" thread and you'll see what Rivera alluded to on the radio. Our entire offensive staff so far is made up of guys with Coryell experience.

In the course of their careers, Chudzinski, Shula and Hoener have all worked directly with Norv Turner. Three other coaches - Matsko, Brown, Proehl - worked directly with Norv's mentor, Ernie Zampese. The only guy without a direct connection to one of those two is Graves, and even he had previously worked for Chudzinski (who worked for Turner).

Even DB Coach Ron Meeks has worked with Turner. Heck, we've even got Turner's son Scott on staff as an offensive QC. And then of course, there's the guy that spent the last four years under Turner, that being Head Coach Ron Rivera.

Looking at all that, is there really any reason whatsoever to doubt that we'll be running a Coryell offense?

The West Coast Offense isn't coming here. And if the offense isn't coming, then WCO quarterbacks don't need to be here either.

Edited by Mr Scot, 02 February 2011 - 12:14 PM.


#45 BigCat#1

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Posted 02 February 2011 - 12:19 PM

matt moore will be starter from day 1


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