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Mayock on Gabbert


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#31 Jackofalltrades

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 01:09 AM

Newton has more than just the character flags, despite what you think you've "debunked."

#32 teeray

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 01:27 AM

Newton has more than just the character flags, despite what you think you've "debunked."


I think I just said that. I just consider the other stuff to be minor in nature and easily correctable.

Tell me this Jack. If he has so many red flags, and his mechanics is so far off, why would 6 NFL teams have him as the #1 overall prospect. How can he be that far off and have all this other character stuff and be that highly rated by multiple teams??

Serious question. Are these teams stupid??? Don't know any better??

I mean The Golden Calf of Bristol had legit mechanical deficiencies but off the chart intangibles but was rated in the late first round to second round.

Why would a guy that is so far off with his mechanics, according to you, and with off the field questions be rated so much higher than a guy that also has bad mechanics but is a great guy and a winner??

My belief is that because teams feel like he is pretty solid in every area except this off the field stuff. His mechanics are actually really good. Does he have some problems with is footwork sometimes?? Yes. But that is a pretty easy fix.

Does he need to adapt to an NFL offense? Yes, but actually so do QB's that come from pro systems and there is zero evidence that they do so quicker than QBs from non-traditional offenses in college.

Does he need to adjust to NFL defenses?? Yes, but so do all young QBs when they make that transition.

I don't believe he is perfect in every way. I just feel like he has no more questions than any other QB rated in the top ten would.

With the lone exception of the off the field stuff which in my belief is his biggest obstacle in deciding whether he will be picked first or 10th overall.

#33 nagai

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 01:28 AM

There are plenty of people on the opposite side who are sure Newton is the next great QB.


Anyone who is so sure about any prospect is fooling themselves. You can say a certain player is safe, and that they'll at least be OK given certain traits that transition well. To say someone like Newton is a guaranteed hit OR bust however, is being overly confident in something they don't really know.

Edited by nagai, 25 February 2011 - 01:37 AM.


#34 Catalyst

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 02:00 AM

Ick.

#35 KDawg004

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 03:10 AM

Blaine Gabbert- 44.3 percent, 6 TD, 5 INT<----3rd down efficiency. That's horrible.

#36 Udogg

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 03:14 AM

Honestly how would you possibly know. Did you ever have a conversation with him?? Who knows if he can read a defense. I don't know nuclear physics either but that doesn't mean I can't learn or am stupid because I don't.

That kind of uninformed bias speaks to another kind of ignorance.




He has no idea whether or not Cam can read defenses or even learn to read defenses. He just looked at him and assumed he was dumb. We all know why, but to say so would derail this post.

#37 unicar15

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 05:37 AM

You people who are down on Gabbert will be eating your words. The guy is going to be a franchise QB down the road and we are going to be pissed if we pass on him. He has all the tools...

#38 micnificent28

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 06:24 AM

You people who are down on Gabbert will be eating your words. The guy is going to be a franchise QB down the road and we are going to be pissed if we pass on him. He has all the tools...


he had all the tools at mizzo as well and look what that produced..:confused:

#39 Catalyst

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 06:52 AM

I honestly don't understand what the big deal is with this guy. He's got all the same question marks as Newton on the field without half the potential. He also had like half Cam's production last season.

I honestly have Christian Ponder and Jake Locker both rated above him, and I don't consider either of those guys 1st round quality prospects.

#40 BBQ&Beer

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 06:54 AM

Anyone who is so sure about any prospect is fooling themselves. You can say a certain player is safe, and that they'll at least be OK given certain traits that transition well. To say someone like Newton is a guaranteed hit OR bust however, is being overly confident in something they don't really know.


Stop using logic. This is the internet.

#41 MadHatter

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 07:20 AM

That bothers me too, especially after he criticized Cam without even bothering to watch his workout. He admits that Cam has a great arm and can make every throw, but he just assumes that Cam can't learn an NFL offense.

This is the same thing people were saying about Warren Moon when he was forced to go to Canada in order to play QB.


You need to understand....there is NOTHING that Cam can do in a workout to answer the biggest questions about him.

Can he make reads at the LOS....can he go through his progressions in the passing game....can he be successful under center (turning your back on the defense during your drop back and then re-engaging your eyes with your receivers). He did NONE of this at Auburn....and he can't do any of this in a workout.

No one is questioning his arm strength, touch, athletecism, etc... And those are the ONLY things he can show in a workout.

He is a huge boom or bust prospect. Teams will have to gather a ton from his interviews, and then blindly hope they are right about him.

#42 panthers55

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 08:09 AM

You need to understand....there is NOTHING that Cam can do in a workout to answer the biggest questions about him.

Can he make reads at the LOS....can he go through his progressions in the passing game....can he be successful under center (turning your back on the defense during your drop back and then re-engaging your eyes with your receivers). He did NONE of this at Auburn....and he can't do any of this in a workout.

No one is questioning his arm strength, touch, athletecism, etc... And those are the ONLY things he can show in a workout.

He is a huge boom or bust prospect. Teams will have to gather a ton from his interviews, and then blindly hope they are right about him.


Reading NFL defenses is something that all college quarterbacks have to learn to do. The fact that Newton has less experience means the transition takes longer but it isn't as if he is a huge risk for example and Gabbert isn't because he made a few reads that Cam didn't. Both would have adjustments to make. And as we all saw in 2010, being deemed NFl ready didn't exactly help Clausen all that much.

I agree on the boom element but don't believe the bust prospect is as big as you suggest. The things that doomed a Russell which was effort and discipline, don't seem to be an issue at all with Newton. Plus they will do chalk talks with Newton which is totally about presenting plays and finding out if he understands what read to make and where the ball should go. I am sure he and Whitfield have spent quite a bit of time on that. If he passes those tests, teams won't be concerned that he played in the Auburn offense. After all the Binn offense did require more reads than he had to make at Auburn and was more of a pocket passing offense if I remember correctly.

The bigger concern for me is that if the CBA drags on for a few more months it makes no sense to draft a quarterback at all since they will get little work and be of no benefit this year. Given that, we would actually be more likely to take a position ready guy like Peterson or Green and wait on a Qb for next year. I think whether or not the CBA gets settled will have a lot more to do with who we pick up then whether or not he can read defenses.

#43 MHS831

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 09:07 AM

Honestly how would you possibly know. Did you ever have a conversation with him?? Who knows if he can read a defense. I don't know nuclear physics either but that doesn't mean I can't learn or am stupid because I don't.

That kind of uninformed bias speaks to another kind of ignorance.


I don't know how smart he is because I have never talked to him. Nor do you all know that he is smart. Ha! Now you guys are in the arena you should be investigating. Please read all of this before responding.

I think he has shown the propensity to make stupid personal decisions. Or was the cheating ordeal that caused him to transfer to a junior college not his fault? Why did he try to destroy the evidence (stolen computer) AFTER police had taken the serial # off it? How could he NOT know that his father was his college agent and why would an intelligent person call himself an ICON as a result of 14 college games when he knows he has baggage and has not played a down in the NFL? All examples of stupidity.

But stupid off the field is not always the same as stupid on the field. Can CN break down a defense? If so, where did he learn it? AT UF? no. Jr college? no. Auburn? Not in that system. Was he born with this knowlege?

But you huggers want evidence that he DOES NOT know how to read an NFL defense. I would say that you could be the smartest medical student ever, but if you have not been trained in brain surgery, you probably cannot do it. Here is your evidence:
1. Auburn's offense is known for its simplicity. 1 Presnap read. Not open? Run or look to dump to outlet in flats. I coached high school offenses where we asked more from our QB.
2. THey would line up rather quickly and on many pass plays, Cam would look to the sideline. He was getting the play which was called based on the alignment of the defense. He then knew the pre-snap read and a simple progression.

In the NFL, your reads are pre snap and post-snap. Because play action is such a huge part of the offense, he would have to turn his BACK to the defense during the fake and then read the coverage afterwards. Has Cam ever shown the ability to read the coverage post snap from the shotgun? Watch tape and see how many times his head switches from one receiver to another while in the pocket. Good luck with that.

Look, I am sure you all have made your decisions. When NFL experts like Mayock and former Personnel directors point out things and you all call them stupid, I don't expect to change your minds with logic and common sense.

Edited by MHS831, 25 February 2011 - 09:11 AM.


#44 teeray

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 09:13 AM


The bigger concern for me is that if the CBA drags on for a few more months it makes no sense to draft a quarterback at all since they will get little work and be of no benefit this year. Given that, we would actually be more likely to take a position ready guy like Peterson or Green and wait on a Qb for next year. I think whether or not the CBA gets settled will have a lot more to do with who we pick up then whether or not he can read defenses.


Panther55 I think you are one of the most reasonable people on this site and I appreciate everything you post.

But I disagree with you on this point.

I think if the CBA drags on it makes us more likely to draft a QB.

My reasoning is that if you don't take a QB you lose all control over who you bring in to compete with Jimmy Clausen. And if they want to fulfill their commitment to bring in competition but they can't address it before the draft it could end up in a situation where either no one actually makes it here or we overpay, either in salary or draft picks, to get a guy in here.

In order to truly control your own destiny, if there is no CBA don't you have to take a QB??

#45 firstdayfan

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 09:15 AM

Regardless of the simplicity of the offense I think people don't remember that he was only in it ONE year. Of course he had to get checks from the sideline...the guy hadn't spent two years learning the offense like most junior QBs. And he still ran that offense very effectively against the SEC defenses. Give the kid a break. It's not like all the "reads" clausen made in college gave him any advantage in the NFL.


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