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I do not want Newton, Do you?


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#106 MWCarolina

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 09:17 PM

not a pure passer? Why cause hes black? Jesus Christ u racist losers are dumb as hell Posted Image

Why is it that when someone says something like this, people say, oh he's racist. Well people said the same thing about The Golden Calf of Bristol and i dont hear people calling for other's heads saying they are racist. it's not racism, it's just how people feel. he ran alot in college, something i know he was asked to do yes, but the point is he did run alot and that will have to stop. Young tried to run alot too, now Vince Young doesnt run as much as he used to and i think Vince Young is faster than Newton or at least similar with speed.

Rodgers takes off more than any QB in the league outside of Vick. You guys try to downplay all the rushing yards he picks up because he kills your "only stiff pocket passers win Super Bowls theories". Rodgers is a running QB in a WCO.

Rodgers is NOT and i repeat NOT a running Quarterback. Vick WAS a running QB, BUT now he's learned to pass more from the pocket. Rodgers doesnt take off all the time, yes he runs, but he runs when he has too, he looks for a pass first though, the same thing for Luck, except Luck is slower.

#107 teeray

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 09:47 PM

Rodgers is NOT and i repeat NOT a running Quarterback. Vick WAS a running QB, BUT now he's learned to pass more from the pocket. Rodgers doesnt take off all the time, yes he runs, but he runs when he has too, he looks for a pass first though, the same thing for Luck, except Luck is slower.


So you are satisfied with he amount of times Rodgers ran on passing plays? Me too.

Rather than settle for their Potter Stewart-esque explanations (“I know it when I see it”), we at Universal Draft have chosen to rely on facts and figures, isolating details rather than buying vagaries. The natural and undeniable conclusion is that nobody should accuse Cameron Newton of being a ‘run-first’ quarterback, or a glorified running back, or anything of the kind. The fact of the matter is we have isolated every single snap (both pass and run) of Cam Newton’s over his final six games against Ole Miss, Chattanooga, Georgia, Alabama, South Carolina and Oregon. What we found is that Newton only scrambled for yardage on a total of 15 of 169 pass snaps. The other 80 or so runs were called as run plays from the sidelines. The rate (just under 9%) at which Newton pulled down the ball and ran for yardage rather than continuing to try and pass the ball, was comparable with the rate at which Aaron Rodgers did the same (just under 8%) for the Green Bay Packers during the 2010 regular season, according to Pro Football Focus.


http://weblogs.sun-s..._breakdo_1.html

#108 mav1234

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 09:56 PM

in the span they looked at, he ran more times than he completed passes. plus, they're looking at less than half his season.

to me, it is not a very good argument that Newton is a pass first quarterback when nearly a third of his snaps end up in him running for yards... Perhaps he is a "dual threat" quarterback, that's fine, but let's stop with the "statistical" comparisons to Rodgers, please.

edit: however, to the central point of this thread, he's nothing like Russell and the OP is totally wrong. :P

Edited by mav1234, 09 April 2011 - 10:03 PM.


#109 teeray

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 09:58 PM

in the span they looked at, he ran more times than he completed passes. plus, they're looking at less than half his season.

to me, it is not a very good argument that Newton is a pass first quarterback when nearly a third of his snaps end up in him running for yards... Perhaps he is a "dual threat" quarterback, that's fine, but let's stop with the "statistical" comparisons to Rodgers, please.


They are designed runs. it wasn't a situation where he bailed on passing plays. It is equally unfair to call him a running QB

#110 teeray

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 10:00 PM

You guys realize he was learning the playbook as he went. He was essentially a true freshman right in terms of familiarity with the playbook??

#111 mav1234

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 10:12 PM

They are designed runs. it wasn't a situation where he bailed on passing plays. It is equally unfair to call him a running QB


We don't actually know the playcalls. It is possible they were option runs or presnap reads that were passes called to runs. The end result is *runs*. More rushing attempts than passing attempts in his conference games. 20 rushing attempts per game in his last 6 games. He was as much a runner as a passer; therefore, saying he ran as much as Aaron Rodgers runs is incorrect. Rodgers has called runs only in very rare situations. One out of two to three times he touched the ball and didn't hand it to Dyer or another back, Cam was running it.

You guys realize he was learning the playbook as he went. He was essentially a true freshman right in terms of familiarity with the playbook??


So what? You can't look at his numbers and go, "Newton was a pass first quarterback." Just like you can't look at his tape and go, "Man he reads defenses so well during plays, going three deep in his reads." The offense wasn't designed for him that way. It does not mean he's incapable of doing it, but it does mean that we have limited examples of him doing it.

There's nothing wrong with that. It doesn't mean he can never do those things. It just means what we know about him now is what we've seen him do and the rest is just speculation, both ways.

All I would like is for people to stop making stupid comparisons between Newton and other players. He's Cam Newton, not Aaron Rodgers and certainly not Jamarcus Russell.

#112 teeray

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 10:24 PM

We don't actually know the playcalls. It is possible they were option runs or presnap reads that were passes called to runs. The end result is *runs*. More rushing attempts than passing attempts in his conference games. 20 rushing attempts per game in his last 6 games. He was as much a runner as a passer; therefore, saying he ran as much as Aaron Rodgers runs is incorrect. Rodgers has called runs only in very rare situations. One out of two to three times he touched the ball and didn't hand it to Dyer or another back, Cam was running it.



So what? You can't look at his numbers and go, "Newton was a pass first quarterback." Just like you can't look at his tape and go, "Man he reads defenses so well during plays, going three deep in his reads." The offense wasn't designed for him that way. It does not mean he's incapable of doing it, but it does mean that we have limited examples of him doing it.

There's nothing wrong with that. It doesn't mean he can never do those things. It just means what we know about him now is what we've seen him do and the rest is just speculation, both ways.

All I would like is for people to stop making stupid comparisons between Newton and other players. He's Cam Newton, not Aaron Rodgers and certainly not Jamarcus Russell.


I wish people would stop saying that we are comparing him to Aaron Rodgers. We aren't. We are saying that he wasn't just taking on read and running as much as people say he was. He didn't bail on pass plays if his first read wasn't open. It is simply false. He only ran on 15 times in 169 pass snaps. Unless Gus Malzhan developed the greatest offense in the history of mankind where the first read was open 154 of 169 snaps there is a serious disconnect there.

It isn't whether he plays like Aaron Rodgers, it is whether he bails on pass plays more than some NFL QBs. Which he clearly doesn't. That is the point.

And with these FACTS I can unequivocally say that on passing plays he was a pass first QB.

Edited by teeray, 09 April 2011 - 10:26 PM.


#113 mav1234

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 10:56 PM

I wish people would stop saying that we are comparing him to Aaron Rodgers. We aren't.


What exactly do you call making a thread titled "Cam Newton statistically similar to Aaron Rodgers"?

#114 teeray

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 11:09 PM

What exactly do you call making a thread titled "Cam Newton statistically similar to Aaron Rodgers"?


I didn't make that thread mind you. But saying someone is statistically similar in something like this isn't the same thing as saying they play the same style.

It is a statistical analysis of him breaking the pocket and abandoning his passing plays before going through his progressions and not just taking a one read and running. He threw the ball on 154 of 169 called pass plays. That isn't saying that he plays the same style as Aaron Rodgers it is saying that Cam Newton is no more of a run first QB on passing plays than Aaron Rodgers is.


It is designed to set a precedent not make a comparison.

But I didn't make that thread. See for yourself.

http://www.carolinah...d=1289156&pp=25

#115 TheRealDeal

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 11:18 PM

Cam Newton statistically similar to Jamarcus Russell

Choosing a very selective sample size and stats, I've determined those two players are very similar

In their respective bowl games during their final college seasons they posted these stats:

20/34 2 TDs 1 Int
21/34 2 TDs 1 Int

That settles it folks.

#116 mav1234

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 11:22 PM

But I didn't make that thread. See for yourself.


I didn't realize you used the royal "we."

#117 teeray

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 11:25 PM

Cam Newton 20/34 2 tds

Philip Rivers 23/37 2 tds gator bowl :party:

#118 teeray

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 11:26 PM

I didn't realize you used the royal "we."


It doesn't matter whether i said "me" or "we" the statistical comparison is for precedent not play style.

#119 TheRealDeal

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 11:27 PM

Those aren't as similar

Cam 6'6"
Russell 6'6"

Where do the statistic similarities end???????????

#120 teeray

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Posted 09 April 2011 - 11:34 PM

Aaron Rodgers in the Rose Bowl- 24/42 1 TD 1 INT.

CAM IS BETTER THAN RODGERS! SUPER BOWL! SUPER BOWL! :lol:


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