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Clausen stopped listening to coaches


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#145 mav1234

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Posted 23 April 2011 - 09:15 PM

yeah Smith's college career was before I watched much college football... rarely got any games from the west coast where I was.

#146 Marguide

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Posted 23 April 2011 - 09:17 PM

I have no idea if Smith was more accurate because I never saw him play a game, but I can guarantee you that completion percentage alone doesn't tell you a damn thing about which one of them was more accurate.


By itself, completion % may not tell the whole story. But I am much more interested in what happens on the field than I am in, for example, how someone throws at the combine.

A high completion % in a tough conference, along with a high YPA, and a good touchdown to interception ratio tells you a lot.

Not directed at you Mav, but I find it ironic that some commentators now speak of Gabbert as the more accurate passer based on a few drills. In January, people listed accuracy as one of Newton's strengths, but now list it as a question.

If teams really do value game performance over work-outs in shorts, these guys aren't even in the same league. So, what is it that causes people like Mayock to rate Newton as number 2 on their big board? It is character questions, nothing more. It is things like work ethic, and speed of learning, etc.. And that's fine. But call it for what it is.

People like MHS prefer to lump Newton in with every bust over the last 20 years. But there is no reason to polish up the argument by comparing his accuracy to Smith or anyone else. Just have some balls and say you don't like him as a person and save us all time.

#147 mav1234

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Posted 23 April 2011 - 09:30 PM

By itself, completion % may not tell the whole story. But I am much more interested in what happens on the field than I am in, for example, how someone throws at the combine.

A high completion % in a tough conference, along with a high YPA, and a good touchdown to interception ratio tells you a lot.

Not directed at you Mav, but I find it ironic that some commentators now speak of Gabbert as the more accurate passer based on a few drills. In January, people listed accuracy as one of Newton's strengths, but now list it as a question.

If teams really do value game performance over work-outs in shorts, these guys aren't even in the same league. So, what is it that causes people like Mayock to rate Newton as number 2 on their big board? It is character questions, nothing more. It is things like work ethic, and speed of learning, etc.. And that's fine. But call it for what it is.


Nowhere in this thread did I question Newton's accuracy at all. If you want to make a "Is Newton Accurate?" thread, go ahead. I will say this, though: A lot of the early "expert" predictions are not very refined and are not based on much film. Through Jan., a lot of work goes into researching players... both by watching film, but also by talking to scouts who have to get this stuff right for a living. If they raise a concern, it can quickly turn a positive to a negative because a lot of work still needs to be done in analyzing a prospect by the time Jan. hits.

But seriously. This thread was never about if Newton was inaccurate or not on his own.

I was telling someone that comparing the accuracy between two players by completion percentage is silly.

Edited by mav1234, 23 April 2011 - 09:32 PM.


#148 Marguide

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Posted 23 April 2011 - 09:38 PM

But seriously. This thread was never about if Newton was inaccurate or not on his own.

I was telling someone that comparing the accuracy between two players by completion percentage is silly.


I understand that. The thing I find amazing sometimes is how every year the draft experts get caught up in the evaluation process, and sometimes overvalue what happens at the combine/proday/Gruden camp, etc.

While not the be all and end all, things like QB rating, completion %, YPA, touchdown to interception ratio, and won-loss record are valuable pieces of information. I wouldn't use this information blindfolded to make a decision, but it is an important part nonetheless.

#149 Cyberjag

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 08:16 AM

I guess someone will have to ask Gantt about it again..I'm not a twitter user but I'm sure some one can find out. I'm sure the observer wouldn't of made a full fledged article out of something like this considering the firestorm it would cause with Panthers brass.


You really think every football publication out there would just ignore it? Really?

#150 Panths

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 09:37 AM

I remember Gantt tweeting about this issue, and then nothing else really came of it. It was an enigmatic comment, without any real context, that left one hanging , and some bloggers took it and ran with it. Can't blame the kid for trying to win when the coaches are just calling it in, if what he did worked we'd all be praising him for his decision. But it's really not worth speculating on a comment about Jimmy from a beat writer who still misses Delhomme

#151 Happy Panther

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 09:45 AM

Pretty funny that most people on this board blame this on the coaching staff.

an NFL ready QB takes the plays his coach gives him and makes it happen. Missing open receivers, being confused in the pocket and mismanaging games can't be blamed on the coach.

its like... Clausen rolls left and overthrows a wide open LaFell by 3 yards...Fox's fault

#152 RHCPanther

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 10:21 AM

Right after his quote in that particular chat I asked for clarification. His response was

I think it’s reasonable to argue he thought he was getting bad coaching.


Later when it became clearly that we were seriously looking at the QBs in the draft I asked him when Clausen was getting cut. His responses are here, here and here.

You remember how long HIM held on? The Jimmy will have more chances.

One small point to make re: The Jimmy: Notice when Fox took most of his staff to Denver, he didn't ask OC/QB coach to join 'em. Coincidence?

Can't absolve Jimmy of his role in last year's disaster (he was after all the lowest-rated passer in the NFL), but there was plenty of help.


I think Jimmy has the ability to do well in the NFL. I don't know if he is going to be playing for the Panthers though. As Cyberjag noted, the comment "He stopped listening to coaches" is not specific enough. When did he stop listening to the coaches? With 3 games left on the schedule or when he got benched for the first time? Was it possible that what he was told was unreasonable? We don't know the answers to all of that. It is a vague statement and I wonder why it was made in the first place, given that it was so vague.

#153 jasonluckydog

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Posted 24 April 2011 - 10:22 AM

Jimmy is a QB not a QB

#154 RHCPanther

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Posted 25 April 2011 - 07:45 AM

Jimmy is a QB not a QB


what does this mean? I must be missing some sort of reference here.

#155 CRA

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Posted 25 April 2011 - 07:49 AM

Right after his quote in that particular chat I asked for clarification. His response was



Later when it became clearly that we were seriously looking at the QBs in the draft I asked him when Clausen was getting cut. His responses are here, here and here.





I think Jimmy has the ability to do well in the NFL. I don't know if he is going to be playing for the Panthers though. As Cyberjag noted, the comment "He stopped listening to coaches" is not specific enough. When did he stop listening to the coaches? With 3 games left on the schedule or when he got benched for the first time? Was it possible that what he was told was unreasonable? We don't know the answers to all of that. It is a vague statement and I wonder why it was made in the first place, given that it was so vague.


People keep saying this.....but until further notice......there is no evidence suggesting Clausen belongs on an NFL field.

#156 RHCPanther

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Posted 25 April 2011 - 08:04 AM

People keep saying this.....but until further notice......there is no evidence suggesting Clausen belongs on an NFL field.


I am aware that 99% of football fans feel differently. I am not changing my stance on that yet.