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Julius Peppers, No Problem.


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#121 Fox007

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 08:42 PM

If you don't consider Peppers a problem, then you have a problem.

We don't care if you hate him but the fact is, he is a game changer, and every smart football fan knows this.

#122 DaCityKats

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 08:44 PM

dude stop reaching pep got cole.

#123 CRA

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 08:48 PM

The passes defensed are impressive, but the picks and the fumbles? How much of that isn't just luck? Catching a tipped ball? Forcing a fumble?
They are impressive numbers, but they can't be directly attributed to skill.

The tackles can..and the margin there is impressive, You could make the argument they are running away from Peppers, but they are doing the same thing to Cole as well..

Technically Cole has 31.5 half sacks over the past 3 seasons, and if you go back 4, he blows Peppers out of the water, as that was his 2.5 sack stat year (just to address that part of the stat sheet you listed)


Peppers doesn't just catch random tipped passes.......he jumped in front and picked off passes to the flat, batted up balls and showed his tremendous athletic ability picking it off, etc. Those are attritbuted to skill. His passes defended and INTs are glaring over Cole...and what is shows is Peppers has the ability to be used to defend things that Cole simply doesn't have the ability to do to the degree Peppers does.

FFs is partially luck.....but some DEs seem to be "luckier" than others. Take Osi for example, he makes his tackles with an emphasis on the throwing arm. That is why he gets lucky so often.

Yeah, if you go back to 4 season when Peppers physically shrank and was rumored to of played a season through health conditions....Cole only takes over 1 category from Peppers and that is sacks. That 4 seasons ago isn't reflective of what Peppers is doing in Chicago.....

bottom line is recent play does show....Cole isn't outproducing Pep like you claimed. And stat sheets never tell the full story. You need to watch Pep in Chicago more.....playing different than he did here.

Edited by CRA, 26 September 2011 - 08:52 PM.


#124 pantherclaw

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 08:51 PM

Peppers was/is/always will be a beast. He was my favorite player when he was here, my dogs name is even Julius for crying out loud. I am not going to downplay his talent, but not one player or coach knows the guy better than Jordan Gross. He will tell Chud absolutely everything he knows as far as scheming to minimalize his effectiveness. I think our oline has held up fairly well against the likes of Darnell Dockett and Clay Matthews, and when you factor in Stews emergence as a true pass catching threat out of the backfield, I think we have a lot going for us in neutralizing Peppers. Dude is a beast, but with the right schemes, he can do a vanishing act.

i don't consider all the attention he'll be getting, a vanishing act.

Yes, pep can be schemed...that'll give other talanted players on the bear defense even more of a chance to make plays.

Pep got paid cause he's worth it. He demands attention. He is easily the best defensive end that will be on that field this coming sunday.

#125 Cat'sGrowl

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 08:59 PM

Peppers doesn't just catch random tipped passes.......he jumped in front and picked off passes to the flat, batted up balls and showed his tremendous athletic ability picking it off, etc. Those are attritbuted to skill. His passes defended and INTs are glaring over Cole...and what is shows is Peppers has the ability to be used to defend things that Cole simply doesn't have the ability to do to the degree Peppers does.

FFs is partially luck.....but some DEs seem to be "luckier" than others. Take Osi for example, he makes his tackles with an emphasis on the throwing arm. That is why he gets lucky so often.

Yeah, if you go back to 4 season when Peppers physically shrank and was rumored to of played a season through health conditions....Cole only takes over 1 category from Peppers and that is sacks. That 4 seasons ago isn't reflective of what Peppers is doing in Chicago.....

bottom line is recent play does show....Cole isn't outproducing Pep like you claimed. And stat sheets never tell the full story. You need to watch Pep in Chicago more.....playing different than he did here.


You can guarantee that all 4 of those INT's were coverage picks?
Just seeking context.

So are you saying that Peppers isn't as good as some thought he was while he was here? That's part of what I'm addressing. The idea that he was some legendary player here in Carolina, when he wasn't. I've already said Pepper's has improved since he went to Chicago, but there have been such an emergence of great DE's in the league recently, I just don't think he is Top 5-especially if you factor in the OLB/DE hybrids-this whole argument doesn't fall on Cole.

#126 CRA

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 09:14 PM

You can guarantee that all 4 of those INT's were coverage picks?
Just seeking context.

So are you saying that Peppers isn't as good as some thought he was while he was here? That's part of what I'm addressing. The idea that he was some legendary player here in Carolina, when he wasn't. I've already said Pepper's has improved since he went to Chicago, but there have been such an emergence of great DE's in the league recently, I just don't think he is Top 5-especially if you factor in the OLB/DE hybrids-this whole argument doesn't fall on Cole.


Not all were coverage picks.....they weren't "lucky". Peppers is a freak of nature and those were often displays of it.

I am saying Peppers is playing great right now since arriving in Chicago. While in Carolina, he was flawed.....but with his flaws he could still dominate. He didn't show up every week....but neither do guys with "nonstop" motors like Allen.

Peppers isn't a legend. He was the best DE our franchise has seen.....and one of the best athletes to play the position in the NFL.

I don't include guys playing in 3-4s in coversations with guys in 4-3s. Different positions really. Some guys simply fit one scheme and not the other. There are just too many OLBs that you can't compare to DEs or vice versa.

#127 Cat'sGrowl

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 09:24 PM

Not all were coverage picks.....they weren't "lucky". Peppers is a freak of nature and those were often displays of it.

I am saying Peppers is playing great right now since arriving in Chicago. While in Carolina, he was flawed.....but with his flaws he could still dominate. He didn't show up every week....but neither do guys with "nonstop" motors like Allen.

Peppers isn't a legend. He was the best DE our franchise has seen.....and one of the best athletes to play the position in the NFL.

I don't include guys playing in 3-4s in coversations with guys in 4-3s. Different positions really. Some guys simply fit one scheme and not the other. There are just too many OLBs that you can't compare to DEs or vice versa.



I'm not arguing this. The term "freak" and all this other stuff that gets applied to Pep because of his tangibles though, that's part of the issue.
People keep putting Peppers in a class of his own because he's a "freak", they then justify him when he fails to produce by saying he doesn't care.

I'm suggesting that maybe he cares, and that his tangibles are overrated. It seems like "common knowledge" that having great physical traits doesn't make you a great football player, then people go and place Peppers on a pedestool because of his physical traits without seeing that other's are outperforming him, which, to reiterate, they then go on to justify by saying "well he just wasn't playing hard"

#128 pantherclaw

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 09:24 PM

Dude wtf are you talking about?

You act like you know what you're talking about.

But obviously you don't.


And you clearly don't have a leg to stand on, or you wouldn't keep resorting to petty comments rather than an intellectual response.

"Dude, no, Pep is beast dog. You're clearly just stupid. Don't you know? Pep was the second overall draft pick and a face on a small market team. Clearly he's dominant over all those guys who yield better production than Pep year in and year out."

your butt is hurt. Stop posting, go to the hospital, get treated for the ass raping you've been taking, and move on with your life.

#129 CRA

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 09:43 PM

I'm not arguing this. The term "freak" and all this other stuff that gets applied to Pep because of his tangibles though, that's part of the issue.
People keep putting Peppers in a class of his own because he's a "freak", they then justify him when he fails to produce by saying he doesn't care.

I'm suggesting that maybe he cares, and that his tangibles are overrated. It seems like "common knowledge" that having great physical traits doesn't make you a great football player, then people go and place Peppers on a pedestool because of his physical traits without seeing that other's are outperforming him, which, to reiterate, they then go on to justify by saying "well he just wasn't playing hard"


Peppers is a freak. Peppers doesn't produce every week......very few can. Those guys are HOFers.

He tangibles aren't overrated. You can gameplan away from a DE.......we will do that this weekend. Even when a guy like Peppers has no impact...he really does.

Edited by CRA, 26 September 2011 - 09:48 PM.


#130 Cat'sGrowl

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 09:47 PM

Peppers is a freak. Peppers doesn't produce every week......very few can. Those guys are HOFers.

He tangibles aren't overrated. You can gameplan away from a DE.......we will do that this weekend.


I'm not saying his tangibles are overrated. I'm saying Peppers is overrated because of his tangibles. People can't comprehend that someone so physically gifted isn't the most dominating defensive player they have ever seen, so they create excuses for him. There have been plenty of great "freaks" in the league. Not all of them are any good. Any time someone talks about Peppers, they always say "man that guy is a freak!"

Noone ever says, man that guy gets to the QB all the time!
"Freak" is the only compliment he ever receives, and I'd say it's for good reason.

#131 pantherclaw

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 09:48 PM

As I've said, his legend here is bigger than his performance, and I won't hold that against you guys. He was one of the first faces of this team, he's a Tarheel, so i can understand why people are so enamored with him

stop beating that drum. You have got to be a complete fuging idiot if you believe this.

Panthers are still a very young franchise. Most of us fans have been football fans longer than the panthers been around. I can't speak for you, but i can speak for myself and anybody that is my age or older...
Who cares he was a panther? Who cares he was a tarheel? That doesn't take anything away from peppers, and the fact that he is easily one of the best complete defensives ends in the game today.

I understand, you got your emotions involved, and it makes ya look like a complete idiot. Did peppers rape your gril in front of you?
Cause you sure act like he has.

I've been a football fan all my life. Far longer than the panther franchise has been around. Guess it makes it easier for me to be more unbiased towards players.

You have gone off spouting nothing but poo in this thread. For 3 pages at 40 posts a page....don't ya think ya taken enough beating for one day?

Don't admit you are wrong..i don't care..but dude...stop beating that busted drum of yours.

Edited by pantherclaw, 26 September 2011 - 09:55 PM.


#132 CRA

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 09:52 PM

I'm not saying his tangibles are overrated. I'm saying Peppers is overrated because of his tangibles. People can't comprehend that someone so physically gifted isn't the most dominating defensive player they have ever seen, so they create excuses for him. There have been plenty of great "freaks" in the league. Not all of them are any good. Any time someone talks about Peppers, they always say "man that guy is a freak!"

Noone ever says, man that guy gets to the QB all the time!
"Freak" is the only compliment he ever receives, and I'd say it's for good reason.


Peppers is a freak and one of the top DEs/defensive players in the game. Not sure what you are arguing.

Charles Johnson will never get the "freak" label simply b/c he will never make the plays Peppers can and does.

#133 Cat'sGrowl

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 09:52 PM

lol at you beating the emotions drum. I've already made it clear I was very happy we didn't resign Peppers. No grudge about it. Glad we used the money on players who were more talented and more deserving like Beason. Then again, you may know it if you weren't so caught up in picking and choosing your battles, rather than being too scared to address the facts that have been presented in this thread. You're apparently a tad too scared to accept that someone couldn't not want us to overpay for a DE who the FO apparently didn't feel was as good as some fans do when it came down to it, so you conjure up the "emotions" nonsense and run with it. I'm all chill on this end, bro. You're the one who seems a tad too emotionally invested. Peppers donate to your sperm bank when you couldn't put out?

#134 Hairless Cat

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 09:58 PM

Peppers couldn't beat out Gross last year when we faced them (that is why his biggest plays against us came agaist our back up RT), and this year we have a healthy Otah on the right side. I really think Otah will maul Peppers, but that is just me. It will be interesting.


you mean the perenially hurt Otah?

#135 Cat'sGrowl

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 09:59 PM

Peppers is a freak and one of the top DEs/defensive players in the game. Not sure what you are arguing.

Charles Johnson will never get the "freak" label simply b/c he will never make the plays Peppers can and does.


In the NFL, the freak label is generally applied to someone who is extremely athletically gifted. Peppers fits that bill. Unfortunately for him, it doesn't stretch too much beyond that.

I think you just made the perfect illustration that most Huddlers struggle with, and that's the distinction between "athleticism" and actual talent.

Just because he is a 6'7"
Just because he is 280
Just because he is fast (though not very quick or explosive)
Does not make him a Top 5 DE in this league.
There are other DE's who do more with less, and that is the disappointment that is Julius Peppers.

Some people apparently can't differentiate between his measureables from his talent, so, as i said, they resort to making excuses for why he didn't live up to his athleticism.


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