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More voter disenfrancise goodness


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#31 MadHatter

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Posted 13 March 2012 - 09:20 AM

THERE IS no SOLUTION NEEDED BECAUSE THERE IS NO PROBLEM JESUS H CHRIST


The evidence of actual voter fraud begs to differ.

JESUS H CHRIST.....you ARE actually that stupid. All this time, I thought half of the crap you post was just to get a rise out of people.

#32 MCP

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Posted 13 March 2012 - 09:34 AM

CWG, everybody else is doing it=bad argument

Here are your arguments so far:

1. It's no big deal
2. Everyone's doing it

I can't wait for you all to go to court and present your "I'm 12 years old now mom, why can't I go to the big kids party?" argument.


CWG, everybody else is doing it=good argument.

Like every other President for the last 32 years.



#33 Catalyst

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Posted 13 March 2012 - 09:41 AM

My argument here is that the percentage of actual voter fraud will be far outweighed by the percentage of voters who should be able to vote but who are turned away due to some technicality with their I.D.

You're going to end up with more people denied the vote who are who they say they are than people who commit actual voter fraud now. That's not a viable solution, IMO. I'd rather have some voter fraud and have everyone who should be allowed to vote do so than deny a bunch of legit voters their right in the name of "preventing voter fraud."

The solution you guys are proposing ends up becoming the very thing you claim to be fighting against. I don't get how you can't see that.

#34 cookinwithgas

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Posted 13 March 2012 - 09:42 AM

The evidence of actual voter fraud begs to differ.

JESUS H CHRIST.....you ARE actually that stupid. All this time, I thought half of the crap you post was just to get a rise out of people.


Thats funny, I keep asking for this and nothing happens but sites about electronic voting machines, or G5s bogus claims - there was one, having to do with a "Working Families Party" primary in New York - where the existing laws caught the jerks doing it.

I've proven that the actual voting process introduces much more "disenfranchisement" than any modern cases of voter fraud - nevermind just the ones that any VoterID law would stop. It's a proven fact that the poorest people in the country, who literally have no other voice in our nation than their single vote, would be most at risk of losing it or at least making it more difficult to use, which is the exact opposite of what you think you are doing the help the process simply because you don't want these people voting.

That's what we got. You just keep believing it though.

#35 cookinwithgas

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Posted 13 March 2012 - 10:03 AM

Here are your arguments so far:

1. It's no big deal
2. Everyone's doing it

I can't wait for you all to go to court and present your "I'm 12 years old now mom, why can't I go to the big kids party?" argument.


Oh and now theres:

3. OMG you just don't understand!
4. Every other kid is going! What? No, I can't say who! I'm just telling you, everyone else is going! GOD, DAD!

Keep it up, we may be able to write a new teen drama for the WB with this

#36 blackcatgrowl

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Posted 13 March 2012 - 11:02 AM

Here are your arguments so far:

1. It's no big deal
2. Everyone's doing it

I can't wait for you all to go to court and present your "I'm 12 years old now mom, why can't I go to the big kids party?" argument.

Oh and now theres:

3. OMG you just don't understand!
4. Every other kid is going! What? No, I can't say who! I'm just telling you, everyone else is going! GOD, DAD!

Keep it up, we may be able to write a new teen drama for the WB with this


Backed into a corner and lash out much?

No matter how you try and trivialize the counterpoints to the argument, you're quite wrong here, and it's so obvious, all you can do is fire off the equivalent of "I know you are but what am I?" comments and make an ass of yourself.

For a legal resident, getting ID is required to get by on a day to day basis. It takes a few hours to get, and is needed for just about every legal transaction in this country from applying for Welfare to buying beer, driving, using a Credit/Debit card, sending money via wire, etc.

Voter ID requirements are not unique to Texas, just like having illegal immigrants aren't unique to Texas. Huffingpoo didn't report that fact with their liberal spin on this, so, like the good sheep you are, you just started a whole libtarded ranting fit.

Edited by blackcatgrowl, 13 March 2012 - 11:30 AM.


#37 cookinwithgas

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Posted 13 March 2012 - 12:13 PM

Yeah I'm really backed into a corner here. You all are going to lose this fight and lose it big time.

I've done nothing but tell you all the simple facts of the situation. I know you are not going to change your mind, because in your heads the only reason people don't want to vote the way you do is because they are cheaters or lowlifes. You can't provide any kind of compelling evidence to add new laws and government programs to combat an issue that only exists on the pages of right wing bloggers.

But for all you other folks -


Here you have a situation where people, thinking they are doing what's best for themselves and their country, actively persuing an agenda that will disenfranchise a small, yet statistically significant, portion of the population in order to prevent a problem that does not exist, and calling it a necessary thing.

Theres a zero dollar cost associated with leaving things the way they are, which is to say, no problems of any real statistical significance. There is a many millions of dollars cost associated with implementing these laws, which will affect a statistically significant portion of law abiding citizens. The people that are calling for this are the same folks who argue against runaway government spending and the idea of a National ID card as being "socialist" (I'm not a fan of that either). You all are smart. You figure it out.

#38 blackcatgrowl

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Posted 13 March 2012 - 12:13 PM

My argument here is that the percentage of actual voter fraud will be far outweighed by the percentage of voters who should be able to vote but who are turned away due to some technicality with their I.D.


And your argument is flawed because it assumes that the voters who are legally eligible to vote won't go get ID or don't have it already.

If it is a stipulation that you have to present ID to vote (like it is in over a dozen states), then make sure you have ID if you want to vote. It's that fuging simple.

My daughter turned 18 a week ago... what was the first thing she did? Literally, she woke up and went and got her State ID. Took 3 hours. You idiots act like getting ID is some fuging mammoth undertaking. It isn't... unless you are not a legal citizen of the U.S.

Posted Image

You can't provide any kind of compelling evidence to add new laws and government programs to combat an issue that only exists on the pages of right wing bloggers.


Voter Fraud has happened, and has proven to have happened in this country. That's all the evidence anyone needs to prompt a change. If you need more compelling evidence than that, you're a moron.

The only people affected are those who are ineligible to get ID, and they have no right to vote in this country in the first place.

Yeah I'm really backed into a corner here. You all are going to lose this fight and lose it big time


Lol.. wow... do you really think this?

Its only a matter of time before there is a national program for Voter Identification and Verification. And it will probably be a Democrat that suggests it.

Edited by blackcatgrowl, 13 March 2012 - 12:21 PM.


#39 g5jamz

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Posted 13 March 2012 - 12:46 PM

Frankly, I'm amazed that in the state of Vermont...liberal bastion...that they hate old and/or minority gay couples by not allowing them to get married without ids.

#40 blackcatgrowl

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Posted 13 March 2012 - 01:11 PM

Frankly, I'm amazed that in the state of Vermont...liberal bastion...that they hate old and/or minority gay couples by not allowing them to get married without ids.


Clearly they are disenfranchising all the gay illegal immigrants.

#41 Catalyst

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Posted 14 March 2012 - 02:01 AM

And your argument is flawed because it assumes that the voters who are legally eligible to vote won't go get ID or don't have it already.

If it is a stipulation that you have to present ID to vote (like it is in over a dozen states), then make sure you have ID if you want to vote. It's that fuging simple.

My daughter turned 18 a week ago... what was the first thing she did? Literally, she woke up and went and got her State ID. Took 3 hours. You idiots act like getting ID is some fuging mammoth undertaking. It isn't... unless you are not a legal citizen of the U.S.

Posted Image



Voter Fraud has happened, and has proven to have happened in this country. That's all the evidence anyone needs to prompt a change. If you need more compelling evidence than that, you're a moron.

The only people affected are those who are ineligible to get ID, and they have no right to vote in this country in the first place.



Lol.. wow... do you really think this?

Its only a matter of time before there is a national program for Voter Identification and Verification. And it will probably be a Democrat that suggests it.


My argument isn't about people not having ID's, it's about those that do being turned away because of problems WITH the ID. Faded photos, cracked ID's, photos that don't "look enough" like them because they've aged, etc.

What these laws are doing is asking the poll workers to use their best judgment to decide what is and isn't an appropriate form of ID. And by introducing human judgment into the equation you're inviting personal and political bias into the voting process and that's just asking for trouble.

The whole process is based on the notion that the poll workers can be trusted to not turn voters away who may "look" like they won't vote for the party/candidate they want to win, so they could then use some technicality to turn them away.

Poll workers are people, too. Flawed and selfish and capable of corruption just like the rest of us. We're putting the entire electoral system in the hands of a handful of poll workers who will decide who should and shouldn't be able to vote based on state ID's that are rarely a perfect form of identification anyway. And I speak from experience there, having held a job where I checked ID's dozens of times every day. It's NOT anywhere near the straight-forward process you guys seem to think it is.

I just don't like the idea of applying that process to people's right to vote is all.

Edited by Second City Panther, 14 March 2012 - 02:05 AM.


#42 dos poptarts

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Posted 14 March 2012 - 09:42 AM

2nd city panther: the texas law allows the person to place a vote even w/o id. U just have 5-7 days to confirm ur identity. Seen it used all the time because people move around in texas.

#43 g5jamz

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Posted 14 March 2012 - 10:23 AM

It's called the provisional ballot process.

#44 Catalyst

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Posted 14 March 2012 - 12:26 PM

Which still relies on the poll workers to do their job in an unbiased way. I wonder how many college students will see their provisional ballots go straight into the trash?

#45 blackcatgrowl

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Posted 14 March 2012 - 03:15 PM

My argument isn't about people not having ID's, it's about those that do being turned away because of problems WITH the ID. Faded photos, cracked ID's, photos that don't "look enough" like them because they've aged, etc.

What these laws are doing is asking the poll workers to use their best judgment to decide what is and isn't an appropriate form of ID. And by introducing human judgment into the equation you're inviting personal and political bias into the voting process and that's just asking for trouble.

The whole process is based on the notion that the poll workers can be trusted to not turn voters away who may "look" like they won't vote for the party/candidate they want to win, so they could then use some technicality to turn them away.

Poll workers are people, too. Flawed and selfish and capable of corruption just like the rest of us. We're putting the entire electoral system in the hands of a handful of poll workers who will decide who should and shouldn't be able to vote based on state ID's that are rarely a perfect form of identification anyway. And I speak from experience there, having held a job where I checked ID's dozens of times every day. It's NOT anywhere near the straight-forward process you guys seem to think it is.

I just don't like the idea of applying that process to people's right to vote is all.


So... let me get this straight...

You are disapproving of the idea that ID is required to vote because the election poll workers might be biased.

You do realize... that the same poll workers (or often the same group of volunteers) count the ballots cast...

So if someone is going to go to the trouble of trying to throw an election their way... wouldn't it make more sense to be worried that they would do it in more direct ways... like throwing out ballots... or adding double counted votes, or disqualifying ballots (hanging chads anyone)?

And again... your concern about "preventing the right to vote" is precluded by the more pertinent need to ensure each eligible citizen gets one vote.

Also, one thing that the anti-ID people aren't mentioning....

In almost every state, you have to REGISTER to vote. This is to prevent people near state lines or with multiple addresses from voting in more than one district or precinct.

http://www.declareyo...ate_info_2.html

Registration process almost always requires a Social Security or Driver's License number AND ID..

So... WHAT THE fug is the problem with these ID laws? It's mind-bogglingly stupid to say these laws are racist or disenfranchise anyone.

And now the NAACP is taking the ID issue to the U.N.. Which is absolute hilarity. The day the U.N. dictates U.S. election processes is the day this country needs to have a REAL 2nd Revolution.


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