121 replies to this topic

[mav1234]

Far-right groups from across Europe are holding a rally in Denmark aimed at setting up what they term an anti-Islamic alliance across the continent.
The demonstration has been organised by various groups who are concerned about the "Islamification of Europe".
The English Defence League (EDL), which is taking part, said it hoped it would be the start of a Europe-wide movement.
Campaigners against racism are worried that hardline Islamaphobic groups in Europe are now joining forces.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17570464

Eeesh... not that I am surprised, it's not like America holds a monopoly on extremist organizations.

so much hate in the world.

If you guys had the power to prevent this kind of demonstration, would you? Not just talking about rights guaranteed under the Constitution here (if this was being held in the US etc) but how would you respond to this kind of thing if a group wanted to have it in your town?

[CatofWar]

Let em and the counter protesters have it it.

[chris999]

Let them protest it out.

Who am I to say they cant freely speak their mind?

[Floppin]

Well I see that the Toulouse shootings and Brussels incidents have had their intended effects.

[ARSEN]

Millions of muslims moved to europe very recently. And I'm sure everything would be fine but Muslims act like they own the place. They creating a mess within europe.

[Gazi]

Muslims are the new Jews in Europe?. Who's next?

[Panthers128]

They should just ban all religion. Religion is hate speech and it is flawed thinking that incites violence. Seems like I read a story every week on the Daily Mail about Muslim youths gang-raping European girls. They have no respect for women or anyone who isn't a Muslim. They go around calling people kaffirs and addicting young girls to drugs so they can gang rape them.

http://www.dailymail...s-young-13.html

http://www.dailymail...ear-racist.html

As for those mentioning Jews, the biggest threat to them in Europe is Islam as well:

http://www.haaretz.c...mitism-1.301276

[Floppin]

fuging mexicans, lets just landmine that border already.....ohh wait, wrong thread.

[Stannis]

No, but religion brings so much hope and peace to the world. If only everybody accepted MY religion, they would see...-- Any religious member of X religion.


Seriously, religion has to go. Secular humanism and secular morality are superior and sure, without religion, people would STILL find reasons to hate each other, but why not take away one DEFINITE cause of hate and discrimination?

[Floppin]

Because hell and damnation and whatnot.

[mav1234]

No, but religion brings so much hope and peace to the world. If only everybody accepted MY religion, they would see...-- Any religious member of X religion.


Seriously, religion has to go. Secular humanism and secular morality are superior and sure, without religion, people would STILL find reasons to hate each other, but why not take away one DEFINITE cause of hate and discrimination?

I think there is room for spirituality (and religion) without violence and hate and discrimination. I know a fair number of religious people who do not think as you describe in the first sentence, but admittedly they are a rare breed and locked away in Vermont where no other Christians have to deal with them

[cotblock]

Seriously, religion has to go. Secular humanism and secular morality are superior and sure, without religion, people would STILL find reasons to hate each other, but why not take away one DEFINITE cause of hate and discrimination?

Religion is a form. Apart from adherents, it is completely harmless, like a shadow without it's source. Secular humanism is no less a form. It is simply de-mythologized religion. As long as people consider forms equivalent to substance, then we will have wars, hatred, discrimination, et. al. The only solution is the full embrace of true agnosticism. It's difficult to go to war over who's "right" when everyone admits, "I don't know."

[Stannis]

I think there is room for spirituality (and religion) without violence and hate and discrimination. I know a fair number of religious people who do not think as you describe in the first sentence, but admittedly they are a rare breed and locked away in Vermont where no other Christians have to deal with them

I understand that fundamentalists of any religion are few in number, they do exist and that is dangerous. There are people who do ecstasy in small doses few and far between, but that doesn't mean they're somehow "better" than those who abuse ecstasy.

My problem with religious moderates is that they validate the hate perpetuated by their religion for the fundamentalists/extremists. One could argue that fundamentalists are doing it right. And if you want to say, "society today knows better than to stone people based on creed, sexual orientation, etc.", then why have religion in the first place, other than to make you feel good and important since you think your "god" is looking out for you? Why not accept personal responsibility for your life, be done with religion, and avoid religiously justified genocide, discrimination, etc, so that these fundamentalists don't harm people anymore?


All that being said, I respect people's right to believe what they want. I may not agree with it, and I may not respect the belief itself, but the person I do respect. That's where secular morality and secular humanism are far superior to religion. Religion teaches hate, ignorance, fear, etc. whereas if we just tried to better the species and tried to work together to make this life as wonderful as possible, we would all be better off.

[Stannis]

Religion is a form. Apart from adherents, it is completely harmless, like a shadow without it's source. Secular humanism is no less a form. It is simply de-mythologized religion. As long as people consider forms equivalent to substance, then we will have wars, hatred, discrimination, et. al. The only solution is the full embrace of true agnosticism. It's difficult to go to war over who's "right" when everyone admits, "I don't know."

Secular humanism is philosophy, not religion (since religion is dependent on belief in a god(s) or deity). Once you take the myth aspect away from religion, you're left with philosophy. The two are mutually exclusive. But I see your point. And I agree. Taking the intellectually honest route of saying "I don't know" to the god question is fine and something people should do, but my fear is still that there ARE agnostic theists, and because there are, the hate, discrimination, etc. can still be justified. For instance, "I don't know that there is a god, but since I can't be sure, I'm going to do what my god wants so that he's pleased in the event that he is real. And what would make him pleased is if I kill/harm/marginalize x-group."

[mav1234]

How do they validate it? Would you say that organizations like the New Black Panthers are validated by civil rights organizations with no ties to violence or extremism at all. I don't agree with that assessment at all, personally.

As to why have religion or whatever, people look for answers and understanding and find comfort in religion & the divine. I do not understand it myself, but I am most certainly not going to claim to understand why exactly it is they believe what they believe, nor will I outright tell them their beliefs are wrong, though I will fight vehemently against them trying to force them on others.

As to religion being used as a justification for things... people use all manner of things to justify the terrible things they do. I agree people need to take personal responsibility, but if they don't use religion to justify something, they will use something else. Various aspects of science have been twisted to be used as justification for truly awful things, yet I would not advocate that we abandon the pursuit of scientific knowledge because of that...

I do think that religions (not spirituality) are losing much of their place, but a large part of that has to do with failure of those religions to properly adapt to what is changing in society. I personally think that no matter how advanced we become, there will always be people that look upon the idea of a deity or some form of the divine for comfort. That isn't to say EVERYONE will, but I think that there will always be room in society for religion in some form.