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Wide Receiver


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#46 fieryprophet

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 12:44 AM

Quarterbacks make receivers, not vice versa. Ever notice how Peyton Manning, Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers, etc. of the world always seem to have great receivers around them? That's because elite QBs make the entire offense go. You can get 80% of the production of an elite receiver from a decent receiver if you have an elite QB. A mediocre QB + an elite receiver = crap.

#47 fieryprophet

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 12:47 AM

I strongly disagree with this statement. Just because a QB is good, does not mean you should not upgrade them. If Gettis and Lafell don't produce as they should next year, yet are still average and not "world beaters" I think you MUST upgrade them. Look at the Patriots. Tom Brady is a HOF quarterback, who granted won a superbowl with not so great receivers (but a kick ass defense). However, they continue to upgrade his weapons and receivers all the time.

Of course the season has not started yet, but I simply don't see Lafell as the answer. Gettis I think has serious potential. He was putting up decent numbers with Clausen and no Steve Smith. Lafell, he simply did not produce even when he got into the lineup when Naanee went down. As I said earlier, yes he can catch and I was more harping on two seasons ago and the preseason... BUT, if you watch the games, he simply does not put up great numbers. The last three games he put up 0, 100, and 27 receiving yards. The 100 yard game was mainly off a 91 yard TD catch that was busted coverage..... I simply don't have faith in his ability to get open.


LaFell didn't really start to come on until the end of the year anyways because he had so much trouble picking up the offense (hence Naanee starting over him.) Now that he's going to be in it for the second season in a row and will have Gettis drawing attention along with Steve Smith. Frankly, Cam's going to have trouble distributing the ball between Smitty, Gettis, LaFell, Olsen, DeAngelo, Stewart, Tolbert and his own touches.

#48 ClarkCam

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 12:52 AM

"You can get 80% of the production of a elite receiver from a decent receiver with an elite quarterback".... Where did you pull that from?

#49 koolkatluke

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 12:57 AM

"You can get 80% of the production of a elite receiver from a decent receiver with an elite quarterback".... Where did you pull that from?


Plain and simple Brady won 3 superbowls with who ? at wr. Do you know? And before you say Moss no he didn't win when he had Moss.

#50 ClarkCam

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 01:08 AM

Plain and simple Brady won 3 superbowls with who ? at wr. Do you know? And before you say Moss no he didn't win when he had Moss.


Yes, Deion Branch was Superbowl MVP for one of them..... And he was on the team for the other one. So I would say he was somewhat important at the time.... He also had Troy Brown who was pretty dynamic in the 2001 season. It would be fair to say he had a bad receiving core in one of his Superbowls not all three. Good try though.

In addition,he also had a defense that everyone seems to forget. I'm not saying its impossible, but the reason everyone knows he had little to no weapons is because it is so rare. All the other offenses of this modern passing era go after WR's. It is becoming a more and more high paid and sought out position. I would be willing to conceed that we could pass on WR this year to see how everything pans out (although I still see Braylon Edwards as a low risk, possible high reward scenario). However, it is ignorant and somewhat foolish to settle for average WR's. I'm pretty sure no GM settles for "okay" wide receivers because they want to let their QB get them out of their problems. The Patriots just signed a plethora of WR's this season, and drafted two tight ends for Brady last season. It's not like they tried to have a bad receiving core for Brady...

#51 fieryprophet

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 01:12 AM

"You can get 80% of the production of a elite receiver from a decent receiver with an elite quarterback".... Where did you pull that from?


From watching the NFL the last 15 years. I don't feel there is a Calvin Johnson or Steve Smith type of receiver in this draft (and the Steve Smiths of the world are only found by sheer accident) and those are the only kind of receivers I would demand to take with our first pick no matter what. Otherwise, Blackmon would be nice but I wouldn't cry if we missed him, and the rest all hinge on realizing their potential, in which case you should be able to nab one later in the draft and mold him into a playmaker.

But you take an elite QB away from his receiver and that receiver disappears. See: Steve Smith/Clausen, Calvin Johnson/Orlovsky, Reggie Wayne/Painter, etc.

#52 fieryprophet

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 01:18 AM

Yes, Deion Branch was Superbowl MVP for one of them..... And he was on the team for the other one. So I would say he was somewhat important at the time.... He also had Troy Brown who was pretty dynamic in the 2001 season. It would be fair to say he had a bad receiving core in one of his Superbowls not all three. Good try though.

In addition,he also had a defense that everyone seems to forget. I'm not saying its impossible, but the reason everyone knows he had little to no weapons is because it is so rare. All the other offenses of this modern passing era go after WR's. It is becoming a more and more high paid and sought out position. I would be willing to conceed that we could pass on WR this year to see how everything pans out (although I still see Braylon Edwards as a low risk, possible high reward scenario). However, it is ignorant and somewhat foolish to settle for average WR's. I'm pretty sure no GM settles for "okay" wide receivers because they want to let their QB get them out of their problems. The Patriots just signed a plethora of WR's this season, and drafted two tight ends for Brady last season. It's not like they tried to have a bad receiving core for Brady...


I think you don't understand just how difficult it is to find a truly game-changing receiver. The receiver position is LOADED with talented pass-catchers, but very few of them are game-changers in the sense that they can succeed in any offensive system or with any quarterback. One of the overlooked benefits of LaFell is that he is a fantastic downfield blocker, and he really helped Stewart and Williams get some tough yards a few times this season (Naanee was very good, too. He sprung DeAngelo's longTD run vs. the Saints.)

I'm not saying we just bring on a ton of scrubs and hope Cam makes them all better, but we don't need to mortgage picks or potential to try and grab some big name receivers, because you can often find similar potential talents elsewhere via free agency or the draft. It really comes down to how much a receiver wants to learn the offense and sell out for the team anyways: why do you think Randy Moss ended up getting shipped for peanuts to the Patriots, then he had one of the greatest receiving years of all time, and then he got whiny and fell off the map?

And Deion Branch has never been more than above-average at best player.

#53 The Huddler

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 01:26 AM

ouch this dude wrote so much and no pie.. sorry bro

#54 cultclassiccat

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 02:05 AM

i heart quick

#55 koolkatluke

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 02:39 AM

Yes, Deion Branch was Superbowl MVP for one of them..... And he was on the team for the other one. So I would say he was somewhat important at the time.... He also had Troy Brown who was pretty dynamic in the 2001 season. It would be fair to say he had a bad receiving core in one of his Superbowls not all three. Good try though.

In addition,he also had a defense that everyone seems to forget. I'm not saying its impossible, but the reason everyone knows he had little to no weapons is because it is so rare. All the other offenses of this modern passing era go after WR's. It is becoming a more and more high paid and sought out position. I would be willing to conceed that we could pass on WR this year to see how everything pans out (although I still see Braylon Edwards as a low risk, possible high reward scenario). However, it is ignorant and somewhat foolish to settle for average WR's. I'm pretty sure no GM settles for "okay" wide receivers because they want to let their QB get them out of their problems. The Patriots just signed a plethora of WR's this season, and drafted two tight ends for Brady last season. It's not like they tried to have a bad receiving core for Brady...



No way in hell are you going to make Deion Branch, Troy Brown and ........ David Givens out to be a great wr group. Without Brady the Pat's are the Browns.


What do you think we were doing under FOX getting Avg. wr.

#56 Marguide

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 03:46 AM

Going into last year, I was screaming for a #2 WR. Rivera had said no one had really stepped up and it wasn't a sure thing that Smith would return to form.

Obviously, Smith was a beast and hopefully he can keep it going another 2 or 3 years.

Naanee sucked, and as others pointed out, played because he knew the system. I would be willing to bet that Naanee has a hard time catching on with another team. The guy just doesn't have the talent.

LaFell made some big catches, and I expect him to continue to get better. Gettis is still an unknown, but an unknown with promise.

Bottom line...I think we are okay barring injury. We need to find Smitty's replacement before too long, but this is not an urgent need compared to the cluster fug we had on D last year. Let's focus on that side of the ball this year, and see if better balance doesn't win us more games.

#57 mario

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 05:49 AM

Lafell, he simply did not produce even when he got into the lineup when Naanee went down.

Steve Smith yards per target in '11: 10.8
Brandon LaFell yards per target in '11: 10.9

You can't explain that...

#58 panthers55

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 07:28 AM

If Smitty doesn't get signed long term than the concerns about wide receiver are justified. If he does get signed we have bought ourselves a few years to replace him. Until then both LaFell and gettis could become the number 2. We just don't have another legitimate number 1 besides Smith.

#59 jarhead

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 08:12 AM

I think everyone agrees it is a need but considering the health of our defense that should be the highest priority.

#60 KSpan

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 08:41 AM

But you take an elite QB away from his receiver and that receiver disappears. See: Steve Smith/Clausen, Calvin Johnson/Orlovsky, Reggie Wayne/Painter, etc.


Those are pretty extreme examples - I don't think anyone would consider Clausen, Orlovsky, or Painter to be even below-average QBs at this point in time. Steve Smith/Matt Moore, Calvin Johnson/Jon Kitna, Randy Moss/Matt Cassel or Kerry Collins, or Andre Johnson/Matt Schaub are probably better examples, and with those QBs the elite receivers still put up pretty good numbers. There are a lot of factors invovled, and to say that receivers are purely dependent on the quality of their QBs is not an entirely accurate statement.


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