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Brockers Vs Cox


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#151 ClarkCam

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 12:55 PM

Just a question from a passive observer.I keep reading Brocker was constantly double teamed rarely hear that with Cox.Is that accurate and if so might that explain why he was more successful? All I care about is getting the best one available.I wonder how the Panthers have them graded? In fact I would like to see how they have the whole draft graded.My hope is all 3 qbs and a rb will go before we pick which will equate to us getting 5th pick being we have no use for a qb or rb.


Brockers, from what I have seen, was definitely double teamed more often.... I'm not so sure that makes him a better player. Brockers, when double teamed, does not collapse the pocket. That is my problem with him. He does not seem to have any pass rushing ability. Kris Jenkins, for example, still pushes and tries to get in the backfield. Brockers almost seems content having two guys block him and then he sits back.

#152 jungleking

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 03:15 PM

Brockers, from what I have seen, was definitely double teamed more often.... I'm not so sure that makes him a better player. Brockers, when double teamed, does not collapse the pocket. That is my problem with him. He does not seem to have any pass rushing ability. Kris Jenkins, for example, still pushes and tries to get in the backfield. Brockers almost seems content having two guys block him and then he sits back.

Brockers has more room to improve his pass-rushing repertoire, though. He's only been a full-time defensive lineman for two years, and his technique in the run game is already outstanding. If we have to pick between two good players, one a run stopper, the other a pass rusher, I like the guy with the potential to improve his weak area.

#153 jarhead

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 03:32 PM

Brockers, from what I have seen, was definitely double teamed more often.... I'm not so sure that makes him a better player. Brockers, when double teamed, does not collapse the pocket. That is my problem with him. He does not seem to have any pass rushing ability. Kris Jenkins, for example, still pushes and tries to get in the backfield. Brockers almost seems content having two guys block him and then he sits back.

No it does not make him a better player but does impact his stats I would imagine

#154 ClarkCam

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 03:35 PM

Brockers has more room to improve his pass-rushing repertoire, though. He's only been a full-time defensive lineman for two years, and his technique in the run game is already outstanding. If we have to pick between two good players, one a run stopper, the other a pass rusher, I like the guy with the potential to improve his weak area.


Firstly, both of these guys have tons of potential, I would say Cox has the most. He is so freaking quick. Brockers had a worse combine by far than Cox...Cox had an impressive combine. But, both of these guys are full of potential, I think Brockers would help our run right off the bat, while Cox would wreak havoc on the pass rush in the beginning. It is preference really.... Brockers and Edwards are similiar players, AKA Cox would probably be best to pick up in our situation.... I think it is harder to find someone with the skill set of Cox than Brockers.

#155 ClarkCam

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 03:41 PM

No it does not make him a better player but does impact his stats I would imagine


Definitely.

#156 panthers55

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 03:48 PM

If you are worried about this year, you pick Cox. If you are looking down the road, Brockers will continue to grow and get bigger and stronger.

Everything I have read is that Rivera wants an impact player now. So he either goes Cox or goes in a different direction all together. The fact that he looked at so many DTs throughout the draft suggests he is interested in the position. Hard to say though. If we are looking to draft down as many folks suggest, then it won't be Cox although he would give us the ability to trade down rather well.

If Brockers falls then he could be a very strong consideration later in the first round.

#157 ClarkCam

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 04:27 PM

If you are worried about this year, you pick Cox. If you are looking down the road, Brockers will continue to grow and get bigger and stronger.

Everything I have read is that Rivera wants an impact player now. So he either goes Cox or goes in a different direction all together. The fact that he looked at so many DTs throughout the draft suggests he is interested in the position. Hard to say though. If we are looking to draft down as many folks suggest, then it won't be Cox although he would give us the ability to trade down rather well.

If Brockers falls then he could be a very strong consideration later in the first round.


To say that Brockers will be better than Cox in the long run, isn't necessarily founded upon any facts. Fletcher has more athleticism than Cox, and his technique can only get better.... You can look at it in that regard as well. I consider both of them full of potential.

#158 jungleking

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 04:30 PM

Firstly, both of these guys have tons of potential, I would say Cox has the most. He is so freaking quick. Brockers had a worse combine by far than Cox...Cox had an impressive combine. But, both of these guys are full of potential, I think Brockers would help our run right off the bat, while Cox would wreak havoc on the pass rush in the beginning. It is preference really.... Brockers and Edwards are similiar players, AKA Cox would probably be best to pick up in our situation.... I think it is harder to find someone with the skill set of Cox than Brockers.

I don't really know if the combine is the indicator of potential. Brockers has a poor combine as far as strength goes, but he still holds up well against SEC interior lineman double teaming him. His lower body strength has to be impressive in order for the tape to show what it does.

Edwards is old and coming off of an injury. Carolina just invested in McClain, a penetrating guy who hasn't developed yet. I feel like he fills the role that Cox would come into, and then never be able to develop fully here.

#159 ClarkCam

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 04:52 PM

I don't really know if the combine is the indicator of potential. Brockers has a poor combine as far as strength goes, but he still holds up well against SEC interior lineman double teaming him. His lower body strength has to be impressive in order for the tape to show what it does.

Edwards is old and coming off of an injury. Carolina just invested in McClain, a penetrating guy who hasn't developed yet. I feel like he fills the role that Cox would come into, and then never be able to develop fully here.


Sorry, I didn't mean to say that the combine was a showing of potential, I just was making the point that he had horrible speed, horrible vertical jump.... Just a poor showing of athletic ability at the combine...He also put on over 15 pounds during the offseason. I am not saying he won't be good, but there are some red flags.... He is also coming out of LSU, where Glenn Dorsey and Tyson Jackson initially flopped in the NFL. They did do better this past year though.

#160 panthers55

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 04:54 PM

To say that Brockers will be better than Cox in the long run, isn't necessarily founded upon any facts. Fletcher has more athleticism than Cox, and his technique can only get better.... You can look at it in that regard as well. I consider both of them full of potential.


What you have to do is compare then at the same point in time. Compare Brocker's stats this year with Cox's last year. Brockers has less experience and is still growing into his body. He came in as a freshman at 250 lbs and was a defensive end. He gains almost 60 lbs and you don't think he has some adjustment to grow into his body and wouldn't get better with time.
He reminds me of a 12 year old who puts on 20 lbs and has to redevelop his athletic potential as he grows. Brockers put on 60 lbs over 2 years to play DT and you think he doesn't have to learn to adjust to that?? He should have stayed in school. He would have been the best DT by far next year.

#161 Jack Power

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Posted 24 April 2012 - 09:40 PM

What you have to do is compare then at the same point in time. Compare Brocker's stats this year with Cox's last year. Brockers has less experience and is still growing into his body. He came in as a freshman at 250 lbs and was a defensive end. He gains almost 60 lbs and you don't think he has some adjustment to grow into his body and wouldn't get better with time.
He reminds me of a 12 year old who puts on 20 lbs and has to redevelop his athletic potential as he grows. Brockers put on 60 lbs over 2 years to play DT and you think he doesn't have to learn to adjust to that?? He should have stayed in school. He would have been the best DT by far next year.

Which means that we will have gotten the best DT by far next year and still have a frist round pick..... hello!

#162 JawnyBlaze

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Posted 25 April 2012 - 03:09 AM

I so want Brockers on our team.

#163 JawnyBlaze

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Posted 25 April 2012 - 03:14 AM

Sorry, I didn't mean to say that the combine was a showing of potential, I just was making the point that he had horrible speed, horrible vertical jump.... Just a poor showing of athletic ability at the combine...He also put on over 15 pounds during the offseason. I am not saying he won't be good, but there are some red flags.... He is also coming out of LSU, where Glenn Dorsey and Tyson Jackson initially flopped in the NFL. They did do better this past year though.


I read this and all I see is "he isn't a star-in-shorts and previous LSU picks weren't good so we he has red flags". All I can say is if you're judging prospects on combine performance and previous players from his school, that's simply ignorant. These two factors are probably the two LEAST indicative of how someone is going to turn out possible. Brockers is going to be good, bet on it. Not running fast and not benching much at the combine and Glenn Dorsey and Tyson Jackson will not stop him.

#164 ClarkCam

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Posted 25 April 2012 - 05:13 PM

I read this and all I see is "he isn't a star-in-shorts and previous LSU picks weren't good so we he has red flags". All I can say is if you're judging prospects on combine performance and previous players from his school, that's simply ignorant. These two factors are probably the two LEAST indicative of how someone is going to turn out possible. Brockers is going to be good, bet on it. Not running fast and not benching much at the combine and Glenn Dorsey and Tyson Jackson will not stop him.


I said I wasn't judging his complete ability by this... I was saying, those are definitely red flags... Dorsey was better in college, and he still has only proved to be mediocre, or slightly above. Brockers is a hoss, and if you had read my previous posts, I would have made it clear that I thought he had both potential and talent.

#165 JawnyBlaze

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Posted 25 April 2012 - 05:54 PM

Fair enough. I didn't go back and reread the rest of this thread after reading that to refresh my memory :) I just think so many people overvalue the combine it's not even funny.


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