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Game Of Thrones Grown Up Talk. Do Not Enter Unless You Have Finished All The Books

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#61 Bronn

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 11:26 AM

From Westeros.org's twitter a couple weeks ago...

And so with a few words in the World of Ice and Fire, a theory comes to an ignominious end at the hands of #GRRM


I wonder which theory they are talking about...

#62 Kurb

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 11:47 AM

What the hell? ^ How Ominous...

#63 rodeo

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 11:59 AM

I think they're referring to the one about Jeyne Westerling being an imposter based on her first being described with wide hips, and then Jaime later describing her with slender hips. Elio and Linda have always gotten really uppity (as they are prone to do) about that theory for some reason, insisting it's just a fact-checking mistake.

#64 Kurb

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 12:03 PM

Who is Elio and Linda ?

#65 rodeo

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 12:05 PM

The Westeros.org people, the ones writing the World of Ice and Fire book.

#66 Bronn

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 12:38 PM

On the Hound = Azor Ahai theory...

Basically, it is one of the more far fetched ones, but The Hound would provide some pretty harsh irony in that he's terrified of fire, he was "reborn" in the Saltpans when the Brave Companions found his helm and donned it to go on a raping/pillaging spree... There's hints by the priest that Brienne encounters that Sandor Clegane is indeed dead, but that the man that carried that name once might not be...

http://www.westeros..../Is_Sandor_dead

The part about him being AA is the irony of the fear of fire, paired with "dying" and being reborn in the Saltpans (the prophecy from Mel says reborn amidst salt and smoke)...

I don't buy it, really... I was somewhat jokingly hopeful that AA would be the Hound..

#67 Kurb

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 12:40 PM

I need to re-read the chapter tonight.

But wasn't Salt and Smoke mentioned when Jon got stabbed?


His wounds were "smoking" and he tasted or smelled Salt?

#68 Bronn

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 12:40 PM

I think they're referring to the one about Jeyne Westerling being an imposter based on her first being described with wide hips, and then Jaime later describing her with slender hips. Elio and Linda have always gotten really uppity (as they are prone to do) about that theory for some reason, insisting it's just a fact-checking mistake.


Other reactionary takes on it were:

Tyrion not being a half Targaryen

Jeyne not being pregnant with Robb's child

#69 Kurb

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 12:44 PM

I need to re-read the chapter tonight.

But wasn't Salt and Smoke mentioned when Jon got stabbed?


His wounds were "smoking" and he tasted or smelled Salt?



Found the exerpt:


Jon twisted from the knife, just enough so it barely grazed his skin. He cut me. When he put his hand to the side of his neck, blood welled between his fingers. “Why?”
“For the Watch.” Wick slashed at him again. This time Jon caught his wrist and bent his arm back until he dropped the dagger. The gangling steward backed away, his hands upraised as if to say, Not me, it was not me.
Men were screaming. Jon reached for Longclaw, but his fingers had grown stiff and clumsy. Somehow he could not seem to get the sword free of its scabbard.
Then Bowen Marsh stood there before him, tears running down his cheeks. “For the Watch.” He punched Jon in the belly. When he pulled his hand away, the dagger stayed where he had buried it.
Jon fell to his knees. He found the dagger’s hilt and wrenched it free.
In the cold night air the wound was smoking. “Ghost,” he whispered. Pain washed over him. Stick them with the pointy end. When the third dagger took him between the shoulder blades, he gave a grunt and fell face-first into the snow. He never felt the fourth knife. Only the cold


So no salt, but "smoke".

#70 Bronn

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 12:44 PM

I need to re-read the chapter tonight.

But wasn't Salt and Smoke mentioned when Jon got stabbed?


His wounds were "smoking" and he tasted or smelled Salt?


Yeah my real theory is that it is Jon... but that's almost too expected for GRRM to make it so... so I don't really know...

His wounds smoked, the tears were streaming by one of the NW guys involved (can't remember atm), the guy with the star sigil was being ripped apart by the giant...

Also, the fact that Mel basically told Stannis at one point that every time she looked for the answer all she saw was Snow... Snow with a capital S in the book text...

#71 Bronn

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 12:45 PM

the salt angle was the tears of Bowen Marsh...

#72 Kurb

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 01:09 PM

"When the red star bleeds and the darkness gathers, Azor Ahai shall be born again amidst smoke and salt"

Star Sigil guy was getting torn apart
NightWatch surrounding him = Darkness
Smoke from the Wound
Salt from tears ?

hummmm.


The flames crackled softly, and in their crackling she heard the whispered name Jon Snow. His long face floated before her, limned in tongues of red and orange, appearing and disappearing again, a shadow half- seen behind a fluttering curtain. Now he was a man, now a wolf, now a man again. But the skulls were here as well, the skulls were all around him.



Skulls. A thousand skulls, and the bastard boy again. Jon Snow...
Yet now she could not even seem to find her king. I pray for a glimpse of Azor Ahai, and R’hllor shows me only Snow.


A face took shape within the hearth. Stannis? she thought, for just a moment . . . but no, these were not his features. A wooden face, corpse white. Was this the enemy? A thousand red eyes floated in the rising flames. He sees me. Beside him, a boy with a wolfs face threw back his head and howled.



Welp, I've convinced myself.

#73 Delhommey

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 01:32 PM

"When the red star bleeds and the darkness gathers, Azor Ahai shall be born again amidst smoke and salt"

Star Sigil guy was getting torn apart
NightWatch surrounding him = Darkness
Smoke from the Wound
Salt from tears ?

hummmm.


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Welp, I've convinced myself.


Me too. Jon Snow at #14 this Thursday.

#74 Bronn

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 01:54 PM

There's also a strong case for Dany being AA...

Red Star (comet)
Darkness (night time)
Smoke and Salt (Drogo's funeral pyre and tears)
Born again (walking out of the ashes unharmed)

#75 Bronn

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Posted 23 April 2013 - 02:01 PM

All the prophecy and subtle hints at things/allusion that GRRM uses are great...

Tyrion, if you investigate his dreams and tendencies enough, could easily be half Targaryen... There's one dream he has where he's fighting a great battle and is in the midst of fire... Lannisters are dying everywhere in the field of battle, and he's helping kill them... He even kills Tywin again in the dream... Then he realizes that he has two heads in the dream, and that one head is laughing and the other head is weeping... Basically a Targaryen head and a Lannister head...

He's also seemingly obsessed with dragons, and he struggles with lust (both notable characteristics of Targaryen blood lines)...


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