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Pennsylvania Republican Mike Turzai explains the goal of his state's Voter ID laws for us


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#31 I Mean He Was Found Guilty

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 11:31 AM

What's wrong with voter ID? Somebody casting a vote in an American election should have to prove they are eligible to vote.

Do you support fraudulent votes? You have to show ID to buy alchohol, cigarettes, and a myriad of other things. Showing ID will not suppress anybody from voting unless that person does not qualify to vote. It's a no brainer.

So why do you oppose voter ID?


all i did was post a video of a prominent republican politician explaining why he's in favor of voter ID

how would you react to a democrat giving a speech following the repeal of a voter ID law that contained a phrase like "repeal of voter ID laws, which will allow president obama to win this state. done."?

obama won pennsylvania by over 600,000 votes in 2008. either mike turzai is asserting that 600,000 cases of voter fraud occurred at the polls, or he's literally referring to penn's voter ID law as a disenfranchisement effort. how else can you interpret a statement like, and i quote, "Voter ID, which is gonna allow Governor Romney to win the state of Pennsylvania, done.”?

#32 I Mean He Was Found Guilty

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 11:44 AM

also all of you who think it's no big deal should read this article posted on the previous page:
http://articles.phil...-voter-id-cards

these measures are intended to stress out state resources and make it a pain in the ass for people in demographics that are annoying to republicans to vote, bottom line. i know conservatives have blue balls for it but it's something that needs to be phased in over the course of several years instead of shoehorned through like eight months before the general election.

But for most voters, the Pennsylvania driver's license is the standard photo ID. The disclosure that 9 percent of the state's registered voters don't have one - or an alternative, nondriver PennDot photo ID - provides a clearer picture of the hurdle set up by the state's new voter ID requirement.



lmao 9 percent of the state who were previously able to vote possibly locked out of the general election. what tools you all are. also if any of you would like to prove that 600,000+ cases of voter fraud occurred in pennsylvania in 2008 and this move will subsequently stop that thus handing the state to romney fair and square, then be my guest.

#33 I Mean He Was Found Guilty

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 02:06 PM

Aparently, government mandates to purchase things are now legal, so all we need is a government mandate to purchase a Photo ID, and the problem is solved.


wow, i hadn't thought of it that way.

the only real issue with this airtight argument is that you need the supreme court to overturn the 24th amendment and make poll taxes (which is exactly what making people pay for an ID in order to vote is) legal again.

#34 MCP

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 03:35 PM

wow, i hadn't thought of it that way.

the only real issue with this airtight argument is that you need the supreme court to overturn the 24th amendment and make poll taxes (which is exactly what making people pay for an ID in order to vote is) legal again.


If the mandate said you had to puchase it to vote, you may have a point, but since all I said was mandate that everyone have a photo ID. your argument equals fail.

And since eveyone would then have a Photo ,by government mandate, there is no reson they shouldn't show it to prove who they are when they go to vote.

#35 I Mean He Was Found Guilty

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 05:40 PM

If the mandate said you had to puchase it to vote, you may have a point, but since all I said was mandate that everyone have a photo ID. your argument equals fail.

And since eveyone would then have a Photo ,by government mandate, there is no reson they shouldn't show it to prove who they are when they go to vote.


caveats would have to be made for people who have religious objections just like with the health care reform which would otherwise still result in the issue of people being unable to vote. you'd also have state governments bitching about a federal mandate being foisted upon them with many outright refusing to cooperate which is exactly what happened in 2005 when the real ID act forced the states to comply with minimum federal standards for driver's licenses and other IDs. that law has now been basically shelved with half of the states choosing not to comply at all: http://en.wikipedia....iki/REAL_ID_Act. that is also what is happening with the medicaid expansion under the PPACA in some states to keep the obamacare analogy rolling.

then there's the issue of high-powered groups like the ACLU suing on a 24th amendment basis anyway.

so yes i suppose i sure did "fail hard" by mildly misinterpreting your inane proposition.

#36 Davidson Deac II

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 07:39 PM

All photo IDs must contain an expiration date that is current, unless noted otherwise. Acceptable IDs include:

  • Photo IDs issued by the U.S. Federal Government or the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania:
  • Pennsylvania driver’s license or non-driver’s license photo ID (IDs are valid for voting purposes 12 months past expiration date)
  • Valid U.S. passport
  • U.S. military ID - active duty and retired military (a military or veteran’s ID must designate an expiration date or designate that the expiration date is indefinite). Military dependents’ ID must contain an expiration date
  • Employee photo ID issued by Federal, PA, County or Municipal government
  • Photo ID cards from an accredited Pennsylvania public or private institution of higher learning
  • Photo ID cards issued by a Pennsylvania care facility, including long-term care facilities, assisted living residences or personal care homes
If you do not have one of these IDs and require one for voting purposes, you may be entitled to get one FREE OF CHARGE at a PennDOT Driver License Center.



The linked article on list those people who do not have a id from the transportation department. Doesn't list the ;numbers that have the other kinds of id. And the law says people can get a free id from the department of transportation. So I don't see that they have any excuse for not voting.

#37 MCP

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 08:39 PM

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The linked article on list those people who do not have a id from the transportation department. Doesn't list the ;numbers that have the other kinds of id. And the law says people can get a free id from the department of transportation. So I don't see that they have any excuse for not voting.


But but but .............................its all an underhanded consevative plan to disenfranchise democrats, Havn't you been paying attention?

#38 MCP

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 08:42 PM

..............

so yes i suppose i sure did "fail hard" by mildly misinterpreting your inane proposition.

So we agree, you failed.

#39 g5jamz

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 09:30 PM

If the Pennsylvania legislature/governor had not chickened out and done proportional delegation for electoral votes....Obama would have a much more difficult time "winning" the state.

#40 mav1234

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 11:19 PM

[/color]

The linked article on list those people who do not have a id from the transportation department. Doesn't list the ;numbers that have the other kinds of id. And the law says people can get a free id from the department of transportation. So I don't see that they have any excuse for not voting.


I think it comes down to this... there will be a number of people who will be disenfranchised because of this this since they are unable to get to a DMV, don't know about the law, or whatever before the election. Yes, crazy, blah blah, I get it, but for some people it may not be the priority it is for us. Should these people get to vote this election? I think so. But, given adequate time, I think most people can get photo IDs.

It seems to me laws like this should be implemented for future elections(that is, not active for this November) they should take advantage of the upcoming election to spread the word about the policy change. that is, when you go to vote, they tell you the next election you WILL need a photo ID. If you don't have one, they should allow you to vote then immediately set you up with a way to get one. Obviously every polling place can't necessarily issue government IDs but provide information etc on how to get one, which will mean those individuals who right now vote without a photo ID will be explicitly informed of the change and given a whole hell of a lot of time, as well as help, in getting one.

#41 Davidson Deac II

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 07:08 AM

Disenfranchised means deprived of the right to vote. Since no one is actually going to be deprived of the right to vote, then I don't see them as being disenfranchised. Its being made slightly (very slightly) more difficult, but thats about it. The only people I know of that are disenfranchised are felons who lost the right to vote and citizens of Washington DC, Puerto Rico, and a few other US territories, since they don't have representatives in Congress.

#42 I Mean He Was Found Guilty

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 07:41 AM

So we agree, you failed.


actual points addressed: 0

until you do your research like davidson deac and can make a valid point then shut the hell up

#43 I Mean He Was Found Guilty

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 07:43 AM

[/color]

The linked article on list those people who do not have a id from the transportation department. Doesn't list the ;numbers that have the other kinds of id. And the law says people can get a free id from the department of transportation. So I don't see that they have any excuse for not voting.



none of this addresses the content of the video, though.

we have three possibilities here given this information:

-turzai is lying. this will actually not stop anybody from being able to vote as normal.
-turzai thinks that enough voter fraud occurred in 2008 that the state will be swung to romney fairly this time.
-turzai believes that people who should be able to vote and would normally be able to a. won't be able to or b. just won't because it's too much of a pain in the ass, swinging the state to romney.

option 2 is such an undeniably insane assertion that if it was proven true i'd completely throw my support behind voter ID and start wearing eagle tears t-shirts purchased from walmart. option 3a is disgusting and 3b is only slightly less so.

#44 I Mean He Was Found Guilty

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 07:56 AM

If the Pennsylvania legislature/governor had not chickened out and done proportional delegation for electoral votes....Obama would have a much more difficult time "winning" the state.


let's pass it in some southern states so democrats could start making off with some electoral votes from republicans in red states all across the board. basing an electoral vote count largely on districts won sounds like a great idea; hell, let's amend the constitution so that every state has to do it and democrats could start pulling some serious mojo out of states that are conservative but have big population centers, like texas.

unless that would suddenly be "unfair".

#45 Davidson Deac II

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 08:20 AM

Fwiw, I think a far more important issue than voter id laws is that (unlike a handful of voters that don't want to take the time to get an id) voters in DC and the territories actually are disenfranchised. The constitution should be changed so that they get representatives in Congress and all the territories get electoral votes.


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