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The illusion of needing another WR


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#1 goodsense83

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 09:46 AM

Alot has been said about who our 2nd/ 3rd WR will be.

This is the thing about having this kind of offense with the kind of names that we have...

This seems to be the case... it will be hard to tell how good some of these guys are because there simply is not enough balls to go around.

With Cam, Smitty, D-Will, J-Stew, Greg Olsen, and Mike Tolbert... the seemingly "weakest" position is 2nd WR. That doesnt mean that we dont have talent there... It just means that in this offense... with the way that things are going to be spread out... somebodies NOT gonna get the ball, as often.

With Cam as a quarterback that is feared as another running weapon in the passing game, there is always a mismatch. Cam's job is to recognize the mismatch and exploit it. This is actually EASIER for Cam because of his ability to run and the others he has to get the ball too.

Tom Brady is going to sit in the pocket and try to find every guy he can... simply because he has too. With Cam, he can do the same thing, but with the option to pick up 8 -10 yds with his feet. (And it works.)

Remember that Brandon Lafell had a good year last year... in a year where Steve Smith had big numbers. Cam set rookie records.

During the Regular Season... The Panthers had 3 players in the top 26 for rushing yards...

23.) D-Will 836 yds 7 TDs

25.) J. Stew 761 yds 4 TDs

26.) Cam Newton 706 yds 14 TDs

That comes to 2303 yds and 25 TD's for this offense.

(Mike Tolbert for SD had 490 yds and 8 TD'S. So we can expect alot of Cam's short yd TD's to go down.)

Steve Smith finished at #5 with 1394 rec yds and 7 TD's

Cam relied heavily on his TE's early in the season as he was getting comfortable with the offense. (Greg Olsen 5 TDs and 540 rec yds.)

The point is this... most of the guys that people are looking at trying to bring in at WR dont have significantly better numbers than Brandon Lafell (613 yds 3 TD'S) ... on teams with less weapons and less complex offenses. When you have a person like Cam Newton who changes the dynamics of your offense.... and the weapons he ALREADY has around him, it gives the illusion that we need to sign another WR. We havent seen what a healthy David Gettis can do. Pilares hasnt had an opportunity... and Joe Adams can spread a defense with his speed.

Carolina's biggest opportunity for improvement is on the defensive and on Special Teams. Adding a name at WR would make us "feel good" but it doesnt mean we'll be more productive. To win games... we have to stop late game drives and control the ball on special teams.

#2 csx

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 09:56 AM

I don't understand the thought they need another guy either. We have so many weapons as is that there simpl aren't enough plays in a season to support more production than would be provided by Gettis and Lafell. We have Pilares and Adams that they want to develop as well. The team drafted these guys because it's who they wanted to develop. Why not develop them and keep thinking somebody else's trash is who they want to develop?

#3 googoodan

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 10:08 AM

I know you're talking about WR but this is exactly the reason I think bringing Shockey back is a waste of caproom. He'll ultimately be about a 7th option in the passing game, behind Smith, Stewart, Olsen, LaFell, Tolbert and possibly Gettis.

I think Gettis is key. We know he has serious speed. It he can be the reliable deep threat we expect, then we instantly become one of the hardest teams to stop. We have numerous options in the short passing game. Other than Smith, we have no one who can force teams to play the deep ball. LaFell surprised everyone with his hands last season but he can't stretch the field.

I'd like to see some H back formations thrown in. Stewart has the speed and hands. Tolbert has hands and should be tough for DBs to take down.

#4 rayzor

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 10:08 AM

welcome to the spread offense.

after the stud WR, the favorite target is always going to be the open man. if you have a killer and relentless and untiring run game (which we have with cam, williams, stewart, and tolbert) with RBs who can all catch passes well underneath and guys who can kill you deep (i'm thinking gettis but smitty most certainly fits here and adams will also, imo) as well as a big pass catching TE and guys like smitty and lafell who can be dangerous anywhere because they're tough and can catch anything in their zip code...i'm sorry, is there a really a concern here? defenses are going to be dangerously (for them) spread out every play and are likely to get burned on any play. add to that a creative and progressive OC like chud and there is no telling what these guys are going to do.

essentially, i'm cool with who we have right now. do we need to be looking forward to a time without smitty...yep, but it's not a dire need right now. who we have and what we do will make this a dangerous offense as it is right now. it will be almost impossible to stop once they get in their groove (which should come easier this year and going forward).

#5 TheRed

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 10:43 AM

I'm going to give this new staff the benefit of the doubt that these WR's we have will become something special. I think some of you guys have blinders on a bit. Every team has a WR or two they hope will "break out", how many actually do? The whole legedu thing last year was a head scratcher too. I thought we wanted to get these young guys reps. All I'm saying is there are going to be growing pains. Unfortunately some of the very people propping these guys up will probably be among the first ones to call for their heads when they make a few mistakes.

#6 Razeyfingers

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 10:47 AM

I know you're talking about WR but this is exactly the reason I think bringing Shockey back is a waste of caproom. He'll ultimately be about a 7th option in the passing game, behind Smith, Stewart, Olsen, LaFell, Tolbert and possibly Gettis.

I think Gettis is key. We know he has serious speed. It he can be the reliable deep threat we expect, then we instantly become one of the hardest teams to stop. We have numerous options in the short passing game. Other than Smith, we have no one who can force teams to play the deep ball. LaFell surprised everyone with his hands last season but he can't stretch the field.

I'd like to see some H back formations thrown in. Stewart has the speed and hands. Tolbert has hands and should be tough for DBs to take down.


awww alright you sold me on not bringing Shock back, but . . . its Shock though, . . ahh I love brawlers, oh well.


edit: couldnt hurt depth though, he doesnt need many reps since he's older. . . damn idk, I want to justify it somehow because its the Shock.

#7 Leeroy Jenkins PhD

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 11:20 AM

I am going to say it and I know it is going to hurt some of your feelings. Steve Smith is not going to last forever. When he is too old to be the Smitty we all remember, who is going to be there to take his place? Adams? Gettis? Lefell? Pilares? None of these individuals are close to Smitty's skill set. This is why we need to bring in someone who can eventually be the new #1. None of these players are that. I look around our division and I see a lot of talent at WR and we have Smitty and......... a few plug and play recievers.

Smitty will not last forever. He has said himself he doesn't want to be our #1 reciever anymore. Heaven forbid (knock on wood) something were to happen to him. Our offense is great. With another serious playmaker at WR, we could be one of the greatest of all time.

#8 csx

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 11:31 AM

I am going to say it and I know it is going to hurt some of your feelings. Steve Smith is not going to last forever. When he is too old to be the Smitty we all remember, who is going to be there to take his place? Adams? Gettis? Lefell? Pilares? None of these individuals are close to Smitty's skill set. This is why we need to bring in someone who can eventually be the new #1. None of these players are that. I look around our division and I see a lot of talent at WR and we have Smitty and......... a few plug and play recievers.

Smitty will not last forever. He has said himself he doesn't want to be our #1 reciever anymore. Heaven forbid (knock on wood) something were to happen to him. Our offense is great. With another serious playmaker at WR, we could be one of the greatest of all time.


Ok, let's wait for a number one receiver to be cut. It will surely happen .

#9 Leeroy Jenkins PhD

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 11:43 AM

Ok, let's wait for a number one receiver to be cut. It will surely happen .


True.......true :(

#10 TheRed

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 11:43 AM

Ok, let's wait for a number one receiver to be cut. It will surely happen .


That makes about as much sense as waiting until steve smith retires to replace him. You are so witty.

#11 rayzor

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 11:44 AM

I am going to say it and I know it is going to hurt some of your feelings. Steve Smith is not going to last forever. When he is too old to be the Smitty we all remember, who is going to be there to take his place? Adams? Gettis? Lefell? Pilares? None of these individuals are close to Smitty's skill set. This is why we need to bring in someone who can eventually be the new #1. None of these players are that. I look around our division and I see a lot of talent at WR and we have Smitty and......... a few plug and play recievers.

Smitty will not last forever. He has said himself he doesn't want to be our #1 reciever anymore. Heaven forbid (knock on wood) something were to happen to him. Our offense is great. With another serious playmaker at WR, we could be one of the greatest of all time.

ummm...the Saints* have been using plug and play receivers for years now. it's the system and the QB that makes them prolific. there is nothing all that special about their particular skill set. the falcons have roddy and julio...ok, they're good. not as good as smitty, but still better than anyone else we have. who else do they have. though? and the bucs? THE BUCS?????? sorry...not buying anyone there being much better than lafell. with their QB i'm not sure it matters anyway.

point is...it's a lot of panic and concern for nothing. imo, i think we have the right WRs for what we do. what do we do? simply put, we dominate on offense. what more do you need?

let the WRs we have grow. let them grow in the position. grow in the system. grow with their growing QB. the talent is there, imo.

#12 rayzor

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 11:47 AM

That makes about as much sense as waiting until Steve smith retires to replade him. You are so witty.

i don't ever want to replade him. or do i? i don't know....i'm so confused.

#13 TheRed

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 11:48 AM

Rayzor you are a great poster but a huge homer.

You can put those ear muffs back on now, sorry we upset you.

#14 top dawg

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 11:58 AM

All of this is great theory, but, I want another veteran WR who I know demands the immediate respect of the opposition on the field to act as a counterbalance to keep defenses from teeing off on 89. I tend to believe my eyes for the last few years---including last year---that our offense would have been that much more effective and efficient had teams had to worry on mostly every down that any WR not named Smith would take it to the house. If you look at Smitty's stats, they were out of this world the first half of the year and very much pedestrian the second half of the season. I can hear you saying (yeah, but) that's when we won, but if you actually look at who we were winning against versus who we lost to during the later part of 2011, you will see that the teams that had viable threats at the WR1 and WR2 positions were the ones that beat us. This is not an illusion. Moreover, I can make an argument that the way that NFL offenses have evolved during the last few years, that you are not going to seal the deal with a championship without viable and respected threats at WR...You may get close, but you are just not gonna seize the Lombardi without having two down-field threats at WR who can and will break down the defensive schemes of the opposition at the end of the day in this modern era of the NFL. The team with the other guy(s) becomes champion.

Now, this is not to say, that perhaps Brandon LaFell, David Gettis, or even Joe Adams, can't become that other guy, but is it worth betting the house over, especially when Smitty's window of opportunity is closing. He isn't Superman, you know. Moreover, if Steve Smith were to get hurt, do you really believe that LaFell, Gettis, Adams, Olsen or Tolbert can effectively make up for that loss? If you do, then that's delusional. No one can make up for that loss, but adding another proven WR who defenses know that they must account for would certainly smooth things over. We all have seen a sampling of what a Smitty-less offense looks like---an offense that has a bunch of 600 and 700 yard ceiling wide-outs---and it's not pretty. This is also while having an A-grade running game, with and without a respectable presence at QB. It's like driving a performance car with a bad catalytic converter.

#15 TheRed

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 12:06 PM

Wait didn't you hear how many receivers we already have top dawg? Their practically growing on trees!

How many of them outside of Steve Smith are proven you ask? Well... umm... let's see here...


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