Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

Helmet to Helmet or Clean Hit on Smith?


  • Please log in to reply
65 replies to this topic

#31 Inimicus

Inimicus

    Life is better in a kayak

  • ALL-PRO
  • 6,172 posts

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:09 AM

I suspect Barron will be fined... it was essentially a spear to Smitty's head.



Looks to me like both men dropped their heads and lead with their shoulders. The impact of shoulder pads and helmets is nearly instantaneous and is in no way shape or form a spear.

Again the only reason this is a point of discussion is because the guy with the Panther logo on his helmet is the one who was getting up off of the ground. If Smitty had run the guy over with the exact same hit we all would be singing his praises today.

#32 Lout

Lout

    Draft Guru

  • HUDDLER
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,420 posts
  • LocationTulsa, OK

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:11 AM

It was helmet to helmet, but I don't think it matters if the runner is not defenseless. Smitty definitely was not defenseless.

#33 csx

csx

    Senior Member

  • HUDDLER
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,318 posts

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:11 AM

That did not look like spearing, Spearing is when you dive at the player head first and is only illegal when you make initial contact with the head. They hit shoulders and then their helmets hit.

#34 DeAngelo's #1 Fan(CRA)

DeAngelo's #1 Fan(CRA)

    Senior Member

  • Moderators
  • 25,979 posts

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:12 AM

It was helmet to helmet, but I don't think it matters if the runner is not defenseless. Smitty definitely was not defenseless.

Watch Jonathan Stewart a full game and count the number of helmet to helmet hits. A helmet to helmet hit isn't illegal by itself. You can use your helmet to tackle a runner....which Smith was.

The emphasis on helmet to helmet is geared toward defenseless players....not tackling a runner.

#35 CatMan72

CatMan72

    KEEP POUNDING

  • HUDDLER
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 15,265 posts

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:15 AM

Well, then 80% of hits on RBs would be illegal if that hit was. The real emphasis is spearing a defenseless player....the rest is just football.


I'm not saying I agree with the rule, when I played spearing was considered a totally legit technique, but the rule is written to cover "vicious" helmet to helmet hits regardless of the situation and I think Barron's hit on Smitty under the rule could be interpreted as "vicious" and unnecessary.

I also think Barron will be fined simply because he's a rookie and they want to send a message to him early in his career that he needs to watch the helmet to helmet hits.

#36 Actionman0z

Actionman0z

    Strong Member

  • HUDDLER
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,800 posts

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:16 AM

I yelled for Helmet to Helmet, but figured because they both lowered their shoulders it was not called. Also I thought that was for protection against a defenseless receiver making a catch, Smith was getting his YAC.

#37 Greg Schiano

Greg Schiano

    MEMBER

  • HUDDLER
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 174 posts
  • LocationTampa, Florida

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:16 AM

I don't think it was a cheap shot on Smith, with sincerity. There were some good hard hits like the goal line stand when one of your guys popped Doug Martin. The players were trying to keep it clean. I think it was Cap'n M who had the fair catch hit and even that, you could see he was trying to avoid any flagrant hit.

A dirty hit against Smith would be below... which indirectly ended his NFL career unfortunately. Of course I'm talking about Clifton Smith, not Steve.



#38 mwright350

mwright350

    Thy Jimmies shall be Rustled

  • ALL-PRO
  • 1,687 posts
  • LocationChina Grove, NC

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:17 AM

That wasn't a spear. Honestly I think some of you have an odd definition of spearing or are grasping at straws for something to be mad about.

This is my understanding of what spearing is:


What does Spearing Mean?


A penalty called when a defensive player makes a tackle that leads with the crown of his helmet into the offensive player. If the initial contact occurs at the top of the helmet, the tackle is illegal. Spearing is a 15-yard penalty against the defense and an automatic first down. The penalty is considered a player safety issue, as hits that lead with the top of the helmet often result in injuries.



Sporting Charts explains Spearing



Spearing is one of the penalties that has been added in recent years to increase player safety. The intent was to decrease the number of violent downfield hits. Spearing is a particularly significant penalty as it tends to occur downfield against defenseless offensive players after a catch has been made. Ironically, spearing hits can also put the defensive player at risk of neck injury due to the angle of contact. Spearing only applies to hits where the defensive player leads with the crown of his helmet. Defensive players are taught to lead with their shoulders to limit the number of penalties.


If Smitty doesn't drop his own head there is no contact between their helmets at all. I see Barron leading with his shoulder in a hard, but legal, hit. He certain isn't leading with the crown of his helmet.

#39 CatMan72

CatMan72

    KEEP POUNDING

  • HUDDLER
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 15,265 posts

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:17 AM

Looks to me like both men dropped their heads and lead with their shoulders. The impact of shoulder pads and helmets is nearly instantaneous and is in no way shape or form a spear.

Again the only reason this is a point of discussion is because the guy with the Panther logo on his helmet is the one who was getting up off of the ground. If Smitty had run the guy over with the exact same hit we all would be singing his praises today.


I'd have to watch it again, but from what I recall Smitty dropped his head and turned away slightly to brace for impact and Barron lead with his helmet.

#40 Darth Biscuit

Darth Biscuit

    Dark Lord

  • HUDDLER
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 33,709 posts
  • LocationWilmington, NC

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:19 AM

Hey Schiano... everyone on this board agreed that the Clifton Smith hit was BS... no idea what Wesley was thinking and he deserved to be ejected and fined.

#41 CatMan72

CatMan72

    KEEP POUNDING

  • HUDDLER
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 15,265 posts

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:22 AM

Well, I just went and watched it again - had only seen it once when it actually happened - and it was pretty much 50/50. Smitty dropped his head when he saw Barron and Barron dropped his head in response, I wouldn't consider that spearing or a vicious hit.

#42 csx

csx

    Senior Member

  • HUDDLER
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,318 posts

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:22 AM

A dirty hit against Smith would be below... which indirectly ended his NFL career unfortunately. Of course I'm talking about Clifton Smith, not Steve.



His NFL career was ended by the fact your team waived him and then he got cut by the Dolphins and Browns. I believe he still plays Arena League.

#43 Greg Schiano

Greg Schiano

    MEMBER

  • HUDDLER
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 174 posts
  • LocationTampa, Florida

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:34 AM

Hey Schiano... everyone on this board agreed that the Clifton Smith hit was BS... no idea what Wesley was thinking and he deserved to be ejected and fined.


Oh I know, Panthers fans were appalled the day it happened. I know there have been plenty of dirty hits going both ways over the years as well, to include some on Steve Smith if I recall correctly. For a division game, it was intense and violent but I wouldn't say the rules were bent to risk player safety.

Excited for week 11, I hope to see a similar game in terms of physical play is in order, regardless of the outcome (win or loss)

#44 Lout

Lout

    Draft Guru

  • HUDDLER
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,420 posts
  • LocationTulsa, OK

Posted 11 September 2012 - 10:36 AM

Well, I just went and watched it again - had only seen it once when it actually happened - and it was pretty much 50/50. Smitty dropped his head when he saw Barron and Barron dropped his head in response, I wouldn't consider that spearing or a vicious hit.


Barron definitely didn't launch his body and use it as a weapon against Smith. It was a just a solid hit and tackle. Wish we were able to draft Barron like our FO wanted. But, I will settle with Kuechly.

#45 HardcoreDefense

HardcoreDefense

    Member

  • HUDDLER
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 624 posts
  • LocationGreensboro, NC

Posted 11 September 2012 - 12:37 PM

Barron definitely didn't launch his body and use it as a weapon against Smith. It was a just a solid hit and tackle. Wish we were able to draft Barron like our FO wanted. But, I will settle with Kuechly.


Barron made some great plays against us, but I believe Kuechly will have a better season/career


0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

Shop at Amazon Contact Us: info@carolinahuddle.com