134 replies to this topic

[Panther_mountain]

I listened to it too. I think on balance, I still back Hurney. Yeah, there have been some missteps over the years, but on the whole I think there have been more good moves than bad. I also would rather have a hands off owner like JR than a control freak like Jerry Jones. I believe him when he says that losing eats at him as much or more than anybody else, and that he fully understands the fans' ire and the fingers pointed at him. And finally, I also agree with him that we have a ton of talent on this team. When the Panthers themselves realize it and put it to use, I still believe we're going to be delighted with the result. It's just that getting there is a painful journey.

I agree with everything except what I put in bold. I do not believe there have more good moves than bad. Hurney trading away picks every year in the draft is beyond inexcusable to me. Did you read the grantland article on Hurney? There have been way more than some missteps.

[Zaximus]

Injuries are NOT an excuse for a bad team each year. That is what a GM does, he picks the right talent to come in and play if the starters go down. Do you not think the Steelers, Patriots, Ravens, etc, are usually playoff contenders because they have 0 injuries? I can agree with the season we lost Jake, but we also had terrible backups too. But MOST positions, should have decent backups. This comes from drafting and signing the right guys. I've felt for a decade that our backups could barely make it on another team at all. Sometimes, you just need a change. Maybe hire a GM whose qualifications isn't just "beat writer".

[CatMan72]

Overall I think Hurney is a good GM... sure we've missed big on some 2nd and 3rd round picks, but his track record in the 1st round is excellent.

I understand and agree with the philosophy of building through the draft, but the key word is "building". We're not only building through the draft, we're depending on mid-to-late round draft picks to start and contribute right away at key positions.

Josh Norman is the most recent example of this, he's clearly not ready to be in a starting role and it's not fair to expect a 5th round pick from a D2 program to be able to start in the NFL right away. The guy he beat for the job was drafted in the 7th round (IIRC) and thrown to the wolves in a starting role.

I understand Ken Lucas didn't work out so well, but we went too far in the other direction. We should be building through the draft and acquiring vet FA talent to buy us some time while our drafted talent develops. We're doing this at the DT position (not by choice, but by desperation). Guys like Ron and Dwan Edwards of perfect examples of reasonably priced vet FA's who can buy us time while we develop our drafted players... we need to find some guys like this for the secondary. Nakamura doesn't count, he was a career backup and we honestly had no idea what we were getting @ FS when we signed him, both Ron and Dwan were established contributors at their position.

Under the current system, we're in constant rebuilding mode... always depending on the development of rookies at key positions. How many years of Cam's career will we waste while we fumble around trying to get rookies to contribute at key positions?

[Zaximus]

First round is fine, but what makes a consistent "build through the draft" team is the quality of people you get in the later rounds. Look at the team we "emulate", the Steelers.

[SCP]

Under the current system, we're in constant rebuilding mode... always depending on the development of rookies at key positions. How many years of Cam's career will we waste while we fumble around trying to get rookies to contribute at key positions?

This is a key point. Panthers are in perpetual rebuild mode under this current plan, which based on Marty's interview, still has about 10 years left until fruition. By that time, Cam will be gone or crippled from the beatings.

[Panther_mountain]

What about when we dont have a first round pick because Hurney traded it away the year before? We have done this twice. With each of those trades we picked up Jeff Otah and Evertte Brown. This should be factored in when evaluating first round picks.

[ShutDwn]

I can't believe there are people that think Hurney is good at drafting or working the cap. It's delusional.

In the last three drafts Hurney has picked up four starters: Cam, LaFell, Hardy and Munnerlyn.

Sure, keep thinking drafting one impact player every 3 years is doing a good job.

[thefuzz]

Awful GM.

If he thinks that the Panthers spend their money the same as other teams, he has officially lost touch with reality.

Dude has to be gone for us to move forward with this franchise.

[Panthro]

Overall I think Hurney is a good GM... sure we've missed big on some 2nd and 3rd round picks, but his track record in the 1st round is excellent.

I understand and agree with the philosophy of building through the draft, but the key word is "building". We're not only building through the draft, we're depending on mid-to-late round draft picks to start and contribute right away at key positions.

Josh Norman is the most recent example of this, he's clearly not ready to be in a starting role and it's not fair to expect a 5th round pick from a D2 program to be able to start in the NFL right away. The guy he beat for the job was drafted in the 7th round (IIRC) and thrown to the wolves in a starting role.

I understand Ken Lucas didn't work out so well, but we went too far in the other direction. We should be building through the draft and acquiring vet FA talent to buy us some time while our drafted talent develops. We're doing this at the DT position (not by choice, but by desperation). Guys like Ron and Dwan Edwards of perfect examples of reasonably priced vet FA's who can buy us time while we develop our drafted players... we need to find some guys like this for the secondary. Nakamura doesn't count, he was a career backup and we honestly had no idea what we were getting @ FS when we signed him, both Ron and Dwan were established contributors at their position.

Under the current system, we're in constant rebuilding mode... always depending on the development of rookies at key positions. How many years of Cam's career will we waste while we fumble around trying to get rookies to contribute at key positions?

Stopped reading here.

What is a bad GM?

[Kurb]

Awful GM.

If he thinks that the Panthers spend their money the same as other teams, he has officially lost touch with reality.

Dude has to be gone for us to move forward with this franchise.

You know how long I have defended him.
But the past few years have just been too much.

2009 draft.
2010 draft
2010 spending spree
2011 draft (minus Cam)
2011 ignoring of needs


I understand building through the draft, hell I am all for it.
But that doesn't mean you ignore Free Agency.
It doesn't mean you overpay your guys.

*sigh*


I feel like I am the last rat jumping off a sinking ship...

[bleys]

this was discussed quite a bit a couple years ago. he's been working without a contract for several years and part of it is because he hasn't signed the one that JR gave him and that has been sitting on his desk.

i think he said it has something to do with loyalty to JR.

there were some people who needed government surveillance as proof or else it wasn't true... to them, I scoff...

[Squirrel]

You know how long I have defended him.
But the past few years have just been too much.

2009 draft.
2010 draft
2010 spending spree
2011 draft (minus Cam)
2011 ignoring of needs


I understand building through the draft, hell I am all for it.
But that doesn't mean you ignore Free Agency.
It doesn't mean you overpay your guys.

*sigh*


I feel like I am the last rat jumping off a sinking ship...

Read my mind cant defend Hurney any more. I think this past offseason sealed it for me. Time for a new GM.

[thefuzz]

You know how long I have defended him.
But the past few years have just been too much.

2009 draft.
2010 draft
2010 spending spree
2011 draft (minus Cam)
2011 ignoring of needs


I understand building through the draft, hell I am all for it.
But that doesn't mean you ignore Free Agency.
It doesn't mean you overpay your guys.

*sigh*


I feel like I am the last rat jumping off a sinking ship...

Yes, I remember how long most folks have. I have been in more e-arguements about Hurney than I even knew were possible.

He has absolutely crippled this team, and I am glad to finally have you on board with me.

When I hear words like Core Players, Paying our Own, and We Spend like other Teams, I cringe.

[Kurb]

Yes, I remember how long most folks have. I have been in more e-arguements about Hurney than I even knew were possible.

He has absolutely crippled this team, and I am glad to finally have you on board with me.

When I hear words like Core Players, Paying our Own, and We Spend like other Teams, I cringe.

He was solid till around 2007.
Then the fuging wheels starting falling off.

[thefuzz]

Stopped reading here.

What is a bad GM?

My thoughts exactly.

If Hurney is a good GM, I would love to see some bad ones. Especially if they have been in power for over a decade.