72 replies to this topic

[panther4life]

Never said that about Fiametta.

McClain is now with the out of the leauge we saw

fixed that for you.

[Squirrel]

I have a feeling McClain was cut for other reasons besides football.


Hurney also gave Jake that stupid contract.

[panther4life]

He basically has managed for lack of a better word to get us one good season every 3/4 years or so

The feelings of 03 are well behind us and 05 & 08 weren't that special minus Smitty in 05 and Double Trouble in 08. He's overly clinging onto the only guys he was successful with wasting cash, not going after FAs that can help us out at areas OF NEED, and most importantly has not produced results in well over 3 years now regardless of getting lucky enough to get Cam or not.

It's a boiling point scenario and if we finish sub .500 yet again, it may hit

He's had cam for 1.4 years after after Jerry hit the restart button in 2010. Managed to put togther a d-line that has the 3rd most sacks in the NFL and more than the mighty Giants. Which players would you prefer he let walk?

[Catweisers]

Was riding down road one day with a Jewish acquaintance and wondered based on what I had been told if I should be friends with him. Then the thought hit me "Jews were Gods Chosen folks" so if they was good enough for God they was alright with me.
Same with Hurney if he good nough for JR he good nough for me.
I really respect what JR did in bringing us the Panthers. If it wasn't for him personally they would not be here. When JR feels Hurney can be upgraded you bet your Bippy he will do it.
Sit back and enjoy the ride things gonna smoooooothe out!

Go Panthers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[panther4life]

I have a feeling McClain was cut for other reasons besides football.


Hurney also gave Jake that stupid contract.

Regardless of your feeling it does not take away from the fact that he's not a pro bowler as Zod claimed he would be. Fortunately for Panther fans everywhere we were able to find an upgrade to come in right away and make an impact.

The Delhomme contract saved us 2.5 million for the 09 season and he was subsequently cut in an uncapped year. No harm no foul.

http://blogs.charlot...apfriendly.html

[Squirrel]

Oh there was harm. I had to buy a new computer when I read about the contract.

[beach]

He's had cam for 1.4 years after after Jerry hit the restart button in 2010. Managed to put togther a d-line that has the 3rd most sacks in the NFL and more than the mighty Giants. Which players would you prefer he let walk?

I'm saying regardless of getting Cam...Hurney should have been gone when that restart button was hit.

Consider: the Delhomme contract, not grooming someone under Jake, Williams contract, signing Keyshawn, not trying to work out a way to trade Peppers (we knew he wanted out no matter what), the CJ contract, The whole Kasay to Mare fiasco, 25 mill guaranteed to Beason knowing he was having some lingering injury problems, betting on 4th-6th rounders and special teams aces to come in and start...

And then you have that continuous feeling on being at the cusp of greatness and thinking we have great players and all when its really just a mediocre product in the end.

[Cyberjag]

Hard to find a GM that bats 1.000 on draft picks. Hurney does better than most on the picks in the early rounds, which is a good thing, but he doesn't play Free Agency like he used to, which may not be. That could be on orders, no one is ever going to say.

The three biggest impacts he's had on the organization is hiring Fox, drafting Cam, and hiring Rivera.

Three biggest mistakes were Everette Brown, the whole Peppers thing, and losing Jenkins.

And he's on his own hot seat, JR's never going to fire him.

[panther4life]

I'm saying regardless of getting Cam...Hurney should have been gone when that restart button was hit.

Consider: the Delhomme contract, not grooming someone under Jake, Williams contract, signing Keyshawn, not trying to work out a way to trade Peppers (we knew he wanted out no matter what), the CJ contract, The whole Kasay to Mare fiasco, 25 mill guaranteed to Beason knowing he was having some lingering injury problems, betting on 4th-6th rounders and special teams aces to come in and start...

And then you have that continuous feeling on being at the cusp of greatness and thinking we have great players and all when its really just a mediocre product in the end.

The Williams contract was the right move imo. He was tied for 2nd on the team with Steve Smith last year for total touchdowns last year. Right now he's only 2nd to Cam in TD's so far this year as well and I mean total TD's not just rushing. As I stated earlier the Delhomme contract did not hurt us in any way. Saved us 2.5 million in 09 and then in 10 when we cut him there was no cap.

I acknowledge Hurney has made some mistakes along the way. But any GM who sticks around for 10 years is going to have some mistakes.

Its the trendy thing to do hate Hurney but in reality most of it is done out of blind rage because of our teams slump since 08. He went full on stupid in 09 to attempt to save Fox's job and it came back to bite him. I can only assume that J.R. acknowledged Fox was soo much of the problem that he canned Fox and Fox alone. Most teams clean house from top to bottom when they do it but Richardson kept Hurney around for a reason.

[Mr. Scot]

My hopes (as expressed elsewhere)...

Hurney gets bumped up to a figurehead vice president of personnel position.

An actual nuts and bolts football guy gets the GM job and remakes the scouting department.

The team actually puts some more effort into scouting pro personnel / free agents.

Not optimistic, but that'd be my hopes.

[panther4life]

My hopes (as expressed elsewhere)...

Hurney gets bumped up to a figurehead vice president of personnel position.

An actual nuts and bolts football guy gets the GM job and remakes the scouting department.

The team actually puts some more effort into scouting pro personnel / free agents.

Not optimistic, but that'd be my hopes.

aside from everette brown trade what are your biggest complaints about him?

[Mr. Scot]

aside from everette brown trade what are your biggest complaints about him?

A few years back I posted a thread about how he has an unfortunate tendency to build around the wrong people. The context of that particular thread was his putting the 'transition tag' on DeShaun Foster. Sadly, the decision making hasn't improved much since.

And it's not just Everette Brown he traded up for. There's also Jeff Otah (more forgivable but still bad) and Armanti Edwards (pretty well unforgivable at this point).

Add in that just a few weeks ago - in a discussion about Don Gregory - I looked over the last five drafts before 2012. Here's what I found.

2011

1st Round - Cam Newton (obvious hit)
2nd Round - Traded away to get Armanti Edwards
3rd Round - DT Terrell McClain (cut)
3rd Round - DT Sione Fua (inactive)
4th Round - CB Brandon Hogan (injured, and by some accounts lazy)
5th Round - WR Kealoha Pilares (decent)
6th Round - LB Lawrence Wilson (cut because he was a dimbulb)
6th Round - OL Zack Williams (practice squad)
7th Round - OL Lee Ziemba (injured reserve)

2010

2nd Round - QB Jimmy Clausen (nuff said)
3rd Round - WR Brandon LaFell (panning out so far)
3rd Round - WR Armanti Edwards (on year 3 of a "3 year plan")
4th Round - DE Eric Norwood (gone, if he was ever really even here)
6th Round - DE Greg Hardy (up in the air, ought to be better than he seems to be)
6th Round - WR David Gettis (injured, has looked good when healthy)
6th Round - Jordan Pugh (cut, picked up by Redskins)
6th Round - QB Tony Pike (does anyone even remember we drafted him?)
7th Round - CB R.J. Stanford (cut, picked up by Dolphins)
7th Round - CB Robert McClain (cut, currently a Falcon)

2009

2nd Round - DE Everette Brown (and we traded a future first rounder to get him)
2nd Round - CB Sherrod Martin (currently a backup / special teamer)
3rd Round - DT Corvey Irvin (gone, was active for the Bucs yesterday but I don't think he had any stats)
4th Round - RB Mike Goodson (traded to the Raiders)
4th Round - FB Tony Fiammetta (cut, currently in New England)
5th Round - G Duke Robinson (cut, currently somewhere having a double cheeseburger)
7th Round - CB Captain Munnerlyn (loads of heart, but just not good enough to be a starter)

2008

1st Round - RB Jonathan Stewart (phenomenal when healthy)
1st Round - T Jeff Otah (phenomenal when it's 2008, traded back up into the first to get him)
3rd Round - S Charles Godfrey (quality is a hot debate topic, I'm a detractor)
3rd Round) - LB Dan Connor (signed with Cowboys, no longer has to tell people his last name isn't "Morgan")
5th Round - TE Gary Barnidge (another debatable one, has shown flashes but not yet a consistent contributor)
6th Round - DT Nick Hayden (uuuummm...yeah)
7th Round - DE Hilee Taylor (this will be the year he breaks ou...oh, wait he's gone)
7th Round - T Geoff Schwartz (wasn't re-signed, backup for the Vikes at the moment, teammates with Kalil's brother)
7th Round - G Mackenzy Bernadeau (with Connor in Dallas, gave up the first official sack of the 2012 season)

2007

1st Round - LB Jon Beason (missed him big-time last year)
2nd Round - WR Dwayne Jarrett (somewhere trying to pass a breathalyzer)
2nd Round - C Ryan Kalil (fantastic player, not so great as a psychic)
3rd Round - DE Charles Johnson (getting paid a lot of money)
4th Round - WR Ryne Robinson (looked good before injury)
5th Round - TE Dante Rosario (was never as good as people thought, currently a Charger, ironically enough)
5th Round - LB Tim Shaw (decent special teamer who's bounced around, currently in Tennessee)
7th Round - DB C.J. Wilson (gone, looked like he had potential but didn't pan out)

Bottom Line: If you want to build a franchise "The Steeler Way" then your drafts have to be way more hit than miss. Hurney is average at best, mediocre at worst. And the accumulation of draft day misses is starting to put us in a hole.

[SIGCHI222]

Just wanted to post so that my sig is seen more than once a week.

[panther4life]

A few years back I posted a thread about how he has an unfortunate tendency to build around the wrong people. The context of that particular thread was his putting the 'transition tag' on DeShaun Foster. Sadly, the decision making hasn't improved much since.

And it's not just Everette Brown he traded up for. There's also Jeff Otah (more forgivable but still bad) and Armanti Edwards (pretty well unforgivable at this point).

Add in that just a few weeks ago - in a discussion about Don Gregory - I looked over the last five drafts before 2012. Here's what I found.



Bottom Line: If you want to build a franchise "The Steeler Way" then your drafts have to be way more hit than miss. Hurney is average at best, mediocre at worst. And the accumulation of draft day misses is starting to put us in a hole.

You mentioned the Steelers. and our 07-11 drafts. Heres what the Steelers have done in the same time frame.





POSITION SCHOOL 1 31 Cameron Heyward DE Ohio State 2 63 Marcus Gilbert T Florida 3 95 Curtis Brown DB Texas 4 128 Cortez Allen DB The Citadel 5 162 Chris Carter LB Fresno State 6 196 Keith Williams G Nebraska 7 232 Baron Batch RB Texas Tech 2010 - PITTSBURGH STEELERS RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL 1 18 Maurkice Pouncey C Florida 2 52 Jason Worilds LB Virginia Tech 3 82 Emmanuel Sanders WR Southern Methodist 4 116 Thaddeus Gibson LB Ohio State 5 151 Chris Scott T Tennessee 5 164 Crezdon Butler DB Clemson 5 166 Stevenson Sylvester LB Utah 6 188 Jonathan Dwyer RB Georgia Tech 6 195 Antonio Brown WR Central Michigan 7 242 Doug Worthington DE Ohio State 2009 - PITTSBURGH STEELERS RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL 1 32 Ziggy Hood DT Missouri 3 79 Kraig Urbik T Wisconsin 3 84 Mike Wallace WR Mississippi 3 96 Keenan Lewis DB Oregon State 5 168 Joe Burnett DB Central Florida 5 169 Frank Summers RB Nevada-Las Vegas 6 205 Ra'Shon Harris DT Oregon 7 226 A.Q. Shipley C Penn State 7 241 David Johnson TE Arkansas State 2008 - PITTSBURGH STEELERS RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL 1 23 Rashard Mendenhall RB Illinois 2 53 Limas Sweed WR Texas 3 88 Bruce Davis LB UCLA 4 130 Tony Hills T Texas 5 156 Dennis Dixon QB Oregon 6 188 Mike Humpal OLB Iowa 6 194 Ryan Mundy FS West Virginia 2007 - PITTSBURGH STEELERS RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL 1 15 Lawrence Timmons LB Florida State 2 46 LaMarr Woodley LB Michigan 3 77 Matt Spaeth TE Minnesota 4 112 Daniel Sepulveda P Baylor 4 132 Ryan McBean DE Oklahoma State 5 156 Cameron Stephenson G Rutgers 5 170 William Gay CB Louisville 7 227 Dallas Baker WR Florida

http://www.nfl.com/d...=3900&type=team (use the link its much more legible).

Does that list really look much better?
Theirs is highlighted by Timmons,Woodley, Mendenhall,Mike Wallace,A. Brown and Pouncey

VS. Beason,Kalil,Johnson,Stewart,Lafell, Hardy and Cam. we managed this in spite of wasting a 2nd on Edwards and a first on Brown..and don't forget we got Olsen for a 3rd too.

and for good measure heres how their entire roster was complied. https://docs.google....d=3&output=html

[Floppin]

Never said that about Fiametta.

McClain is now with the Pats. We will see.

Hate to break it to you, but McClain was cut from the pats about three days ago.