73 replies to this topic

[Bronn]

Now as for me and my beliefs, I think I have good reason to believe not only God exists, but the God of Chrisitianity exists. I want to share more of that reasoning here, but I'm also studying some things on my own, and hope to do some experimentation on a couple of hypothesis I have. For instance, I'm excited about the eventual launch of the JWST (James Webb Space Telescope). It's visual range will be greater than the Hubble telescope, and might even be able to pick up actual pictures of planets from distant solar systems. If I'm right concerning some of the hypothesis I have with creation, then there should be no asteroids/comets/meteorites in solar systems that have a star similar to our own. The JWST should be able to pick up asteroids and the like in nearby solar systems, so it can prove whether I'm right or not. Different things like that I'm looking at. I offer way more falsifiability than organizations like Answers in Genesis, which isn't all that concerned about proving the Bible is true. (Which makes me mad because they give creationists a bad name)

Creationists give themselves a bad name, by believing myths and parables to be literal truth.

[TANTRIC-NINJA]

So take the creation story as literal science..the world as flat as a metophorical human perspective but its all the work of the captial G!

That is a big chunk of Faith for one to swollow..

No wonder the Bible has God scorning Eve for seeking Knowldge(eating from the Tree of) as one of the first major lessons of the Bible..do not figure out the world around you as you will be too self aware and develop rational questions to the validity of these tales of common folklore..oops im in hell for this post.

[BBQ&Beer]

Yeah you're right about the sun orbiting the earth and it's position in the sky, unless I guess the earth rotated on it's axis as fast as the sun rotated around the earth. Yet besides all that, it is from his perspective. The sun's position in the sky does change, it does rise in the east and sets in the west. That is all that passage of Scripture is referring to. It wouldn't have said the earth stopped, because that wouldn't have made sense. The Scripture was written in a way the people could understand. Even if something similar happened in today's world, do you think people would say the earth stopped rotating? Most likely they would say the same thing that is written in Scripture, that the sun hadn't moved from it's spot in the sky. (Later scientists would explain what happened of course, but the Bible has no explanation within it's text. It just said the sun didn't move until Joshua was finished fighting)

I think if everything suddenly launched sideways at 200-1,000mph depending on where you were (& counting the more populated latitudes) they'd say the Earth stopped.

Now what scientists explained what happened & what was the explanation?

[Wanderlai]

Makes more sense to me for some higher being to tamper and manipulate DNA to get the results wanted verses random particles combining to form life or just one "magical" being creating everything. I just dont think everything happened randomly to create cosmos as we know it. There must be higher intelligence involved. Of course then you get into who created the higher intelligence...que the Twilight Zone music.

[Harris Aballah]

I guess my point goes back to the saying," how do they sleep at night". I sit here reading as you ask each other questions while insulting one anothers answers. Then I think ya know I don't care about all this crap. it boils down to me wether or not you have faith and believe in whatever you choose to believe. Those who haven't any seem to be the ones who insult the most. And say things to adjitate like go jack off on jesus. But when people perform evil deeds such as ken lay, soros or even sandusky that affect multiple lively hoods, I wonder how do they sleep at night. And I come to the conclusion that they must simply not believe in sin. or at least that they do not sin. Thats why sandusky comes up with outrageous conspiracy theories to proclaim his innocence. When a pol cheats on his cancer ridden wife and has children with his mistress and uses tax dollars to cover it. and then has the nerve to tell the public he hopes god can forgive him. I feel a true godfearring man would have never made those choices. On the inside he believes the only thing he did wrong was get caught. But the true point to me is who cares what you believe as long as it carries you to a good place. Just cause someone has done something horrible in the name of god doesn't mean they get it. They are misguided and more than likely using the religion as a cloak to justify thier horrible actions. But on the inside they only wish they had never been caught. So lets say I like to believe in god. You may not? thats your thing and I hope it serves you well. i am not gonna ridicule, judge or degrade you for your beliefs. Unless you start doing bad things in the name of.

[Bronn]

you might not, but the majority of believers do

[Matthias]

I think if everything suddenly launched sideways at 200-1,000mph depending on where you were (& counting the more populated latitudes) they'd say the Earth stopped.

Now what scientists explained what happened & what was the explanation?

If Joshua and his army suddenly launched sideways at 1000mph, they would have more problems than worrying about the position of the sun and their enemies. So there's more to it than just the earth stopping it's rotation. The point is, there was no explanation as to why the sun stayed in it's place, the Bible doesn't offer one. So we can't use this as evidence in saying the sun revolve around the earth, the Bible doesn't say that. (Yet many use this as evidence that it does)

[rodeo]

The Bible says whatever you insist it says. For thousands of years, the church taught that the Bible teaches geocintricity. When science proved them wrong, they changed their mind. This has happened on just about everything the Bible has ever taught.

Welcome to religion.

[Matthias]

The Bible says whatever you insist it says. For thousands of years, the church taught that the Bible teaches geocintricity. When science proved them wrong, they changed their mind. This has happened on just about everything the Bible has ever taught.

Welcome to religion.

If so, geocentricity didn't come from the Bible, but from what was already thought about the world. As for me however, I'm not changing what the Bible says. I believe science actually helps us to better understand what it says on our history. Remember that if the Bible is true, if it is, it's a history account.

[beach]

I'm sorry but there's just to much in between in here

We're talking about a book comprised of a bunch of other books from different time periods by unrelated individuals that was consequentially assorted from somewhere (at the least) around 1500 b.c. to 300 a.d. from countless cultural sources eventually propped up and condensed through political institutions primarily in Rome...and whether it be historical, factually based stories eventually evolving into myths, or pure storytelling, it does not define humanity and that's the bottom line. Its a Hitchhiker's Guide to the Earth for a certain percentage of the globe. Maybe some of the tales refer to things that actually took place at some point...well cool! Let's look into it.

[rodeo]

If so, geocentricity didn't come from the Bible, but from what was already thought about the world. As for me however, I'm not changing what the Bible says. I believe science actually helps us to better understand what it says on our history. Remember that if the Bible is true, if it is, it's a history account.

If the world thought geocentric theory were true, you would be finding things in the Bible to support your views. Again, welcome to religion.

[BBQ&Beer]

If Joshua and his army suddenly launched sideways at 1000mph, they would have more problems than worrying about the position of the sun and their enemies. So there's more to it than just the earth stopping it's rotation. The point is, there was no explanation as to why the sun stayed in it's place, the Bible doesn't offer one. So we can't use this as evidence in saying the sun revolve around the earth, the Bible doesn't say that. (Yet many use this as evidence that it does)

Either they thought that the Sun revolved around the Earth & it stopped, or it's a matter of perspective & the Earth stopped.

Since we know the Sun doesn't revolve around the Earth, & we know that the army didn't plow into a mountain at super sonic speed, we're left with it was just an exaggeration in a story.

[mmmbeans]

do we really know that the army didn't plow into a mountain at super-sonic speed?

i like this idea.

[Matthias]

If the world thought geocentric theory were true, you would be finding things in the Bible to support your views. Again, welcome to religion.

So what scientific theory can I use to support the world is 7000+- years old? What theory can I use to support a global flood? These are things the Bible state about the world, and it's either true or not true. That particular argument concerning changing the Bible or finding verses to fit what we think about the world, falls short when it comes to what the Bible says about our history. So I must show scientifically, the Bible is right. I have no problem in saying, for the longest, the church has been corrupt. They even lost the true reason why Jesus came, and teach we still have to do something to be accepted by God. (That we can please God in our own strength by following their set of rules) Just for future reference, my opinion about the church after Constatine made Christianity the official religion of Rome, is not good. (Not saying there weren't true Christians during the ages after this period, I'm a result of their prayers. Yet a lot of people were made Christians by corrupt men, God never wanted this to be forced on anyone. As a result, men's traditions were added on to what Jesus taught. I could go on and on about this stuff, but I don't want to bore you on that)

When it comes to science, it is very limited. Things that were once observable, are no longer. Pretty much 70% of the universe today is not observable, and 20% is barely observable through gravitational lensing. (Talking dark matter) The quantum world seems to run on very different rules than the macro universe, so you need a new theory to unify them. These are some major, major holes in our observation, yet we think we can come to a conclusion on where we come from based on it? We pride ourselves way too much if that is the case. What I'm getting at here is the only way we will know where we came from, is if we had an account from someone who's seen everything from the very beginning. Then we prove that account by thoroughly studying it's content, and testing it out. That's what I'm doing with the Bible. I'm testing out what the account says. (Whereas scientists only test out there observations, and by it, ruled out what the Bible has said, and of course all religious texts as well for that matter. However, when you truly consider the holes in our observation, it's no wonder there's a difference between what the Bible says and what our observations tell us)

What I'm doing with my studies, is providing a true scientific theory of the creation story, to be tested and repeated. As of right now, there is none, and the picture we get about Genesis is a bedtime story, easily ruled out by science. So that is one of my goals.