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Does anyone have a reliable source inside the organization?


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#106 MHS831

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 03:06 PM

It's not Cam's intelligence I'm questioning.


I hear your point, and on Sundays I agree with you 100%. However, Cam has been able to get by on his ability for a long time. You don't get a job as a coach if you are stupid about football. He may make dumb decisions during the game and his strategies fail, but the decision to take away audibles from the franchise QB is one that was not taken lightly.

That is much more likely than everyone except Cam is not smart. B

#107 Marguide

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 03:12 PM

I hear your point, and on Sundays I agree with you 100%. However, Cam has been able to get by on his ability for a long time. You don't get a job as a coach if you are stupid about football. He may make dumb decisions during the game and his strategies fail, but the decision to take away audibles from the franchise QB is one that was not taken lightly.

That is much more likely than everyone except Cam is not smart. B


There have been a number of QB's through the years that weren't the sharpest tools in the shed. Guys like Dan Marino and Terry Bradshaw just to name two.

Do you think they never audibled? Or do you think someone took the time to teach them the ins and outs so they could be successful?

We aren't asking Cam to perform open heart surgery. If he is deficient in reading defenses (and I don't think he is any worse in this area than typical 2nd year QB's) then damn it teach him to read defenses. Don't just say, ok, we just will do it for him. That won't work.

#108 MHS831

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 03:34 PM

There have been a number of QB's through the years that weren't the sharpest tools in the shed. Guys like Dan Marino and Terry Bradshaw just to name two.

Do you think they never audibled? Or do you think someone took the time to teach them the ins and outs so they could be successful?

We aren't asking Cam to perform open heart surgery. If he is deficient in reading defenses (and I don't think he is any worse in this area than typical 2nd year QB's) then damn it teach him to read defenses. Don't just say, ok, we just will do it for him. That won't work.


We are mixing the use of dumb/stupid a bit. I do not think Cam is a smart person, but I think he is more unntelligent as a football player. I am referring to a "sense" or "feel" but there is some intelligence behind it too. However, this coaching staff dubbed themselves as teachers, something I see no evidence of at all, so I see your point. Would Cam prosper under Harbaugh? Maybe not, because Luck and Alex Smith are very smart. However, Kaepernick is a lot like Cam, and he is doing OK. Who knows, but we are going to find out.

If I have Cam, I hire a coach who has a record of getting the most out of QBs. When I think of Bill Cowher and his success with Stewart, Maddox, Ben--I have to think he gets it.

My first choice, however, is Kelly from Oregon.

I am not sure these guys make QBs better, but they make everyone around the Qb lift the QB's game.

#109 Marguide

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Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:39 PM

We are mixing the use of dumb/stupid a bit. I do not think Cam is a smart person, but I think he is more unntelligent as a football player. I am referring to a "sense" or "feel" but there is some intelligence behind it too. However, this coaching staff dubbed themselves as teachers, something I see no evidence of at all, so I see your point. Would Cam prosper under Harbaugh? Maybe not, because Luck and Alex Smith are very smart. However, Kaepernick is a lot like Cam, and he is doing OK. Who knows, but we are going to find out.

If I have Cam, I hire a coach who has a record of getting the most out of QBs. When I think of Bill Cowher and his success with Stewart, Maddox, Ben--I have to think he gets it.

My first choice, however, is Kelly from Oregon.

I am not sure these guys make QBs better, but they make everyone around the Qb lift the QB's game.


I have seen nothing to suggest that Cam is anything other than completely normal and average in intelligence level. Don't confuse a person's vocabulary or their use of mixed metaphors as indicators of intelligence. Many southerners, for example, speak in a manner that northerners find overly simplistic. That is certainly no reflection on their intelligence.

You apparently believe that Cam has mental challenges above and beyond the norm; I certainly believe otherwise. That's okay, no one says everyone has to agree.

Give the kid good coaching and then we can talk.

#110 jarhead

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 06:43 AM

Part of Cam's problem is also what makes him special.I think he relies to much on his size and athleticism when he should be trying to make his reads and get rid of the ball.Big Ben does the same thing at times.What worries me about Cam is what he is not doing when he comes off the field. Rarely do I see him looking at the photos,talking to coaches,or talking to his wr and OL. He seems disengaged where others that are great are busy as hell making adjustments.The same could be said for our head coach who seems to be more of a spectator than the guy making adjustments

#111 Kurb

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 06:59 AM

Part of Cam's problem is also what makes him special.I think he relies to much on his size and athleticism when he should be trying to make his reads and get rid of the ball.Big Ben does the same thing at times.What worries me about Cam is what he is not doing when he comes off the field. Rarely do I see him looking at the photos,talking to coaches,or talking to his wr and OL. He seems disengaged where others that are great are busy as hell making adjustments.The same could be said for our head coach who seems to be more of a spectator than the guy making adjustments



he does this every time he comes off the field

Shula meets him like a mother hen and scoots him away

#112 jarhead

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 07:12 AM

he does this every time he comes off the field

Shula meets him like a mother hen and scoots him away



I see this as a big problem ......Cam needs to be engaged on the sidelines

#113 Kurb

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 08:31 AM

I see this as a big problem ......Cam needs to be engaged on the sidelines



First you said you were upset he didnt look at pictures and such.

Now its a problem that he doesnt talk more to his teammates instead of look at pictures ?

#114 jarhead

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 08:44 AM

First you said you were upset he didnt look at pictures and such.

Now its a problem that he doesnt talk more to his teammates instead of look at pictures ?


That is not what I said nor meant.....I wish he did more of both

#115 Kurb

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 08:54 AM

That is not what I said nor meant.....I wish he did more of both



I misunderstood then

#116 Match.com

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 10:10 AM

rufus.III

#117 MHS831

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 03:58 PM

I have seen nothing to suggest that Cam is anything other than completely normal and average in intelligence level. Don't confuse a person's vocabulary or their use of mixed metaphors as indicators of intelligence. Many southerners, for example, speak in a manner that northerners find overly simplistic. That is certainly no reflection on their intelligence.

You apparently believe that Cam has mental challenges above and beyond the norm; I certainly believe otherwise. That's okay, no one says everyone has to agree.

Give the kid good coaching and then we can talk.

Agreed that we disagree. But respectfully, you say that there is nothing to suggest that Cam is anything other than "normal" and then give things to suggest he is below normal and make excuses for them. However, I am in the business of analyzing, and assessing intelligence. I speak at symposiums and seminars on the subject. Most recently: The negligence of higher education on the development of divergent thinking skills. I am taking a group of undergraduate students to present at Duke University tomorrow (Google: State of NC undergraduate research and creativity symposium at Duke University if you need verification. We present at 9:15 in the Engineering facility.) Discount that if you want, but I don't tell Mechanics about transmissions or try to explain the law to attorneys, even though I pretend to know about both. (I know people are going to comment on that, but that is the truth and sorry if it sounds arrogant-just explaining why I know what I am talking about).

Cam has done little to demonstrate inelligence. Whether it be behind a microphone or a center, I am not seeing nornal for a pro QB. Look at the QBs from this year and last: RGIII, Andy Dalton, Andrew Luck, Tannehill, C. Ponder, Gabbert, Locker, Russell Wilson, Weeden, etc --that is normal. Most on this list were picked much later than Cam, and many are outperforming him. They are learning and growing--Is Cam?

#118 Marguide

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 09:55 PM

Agreed that we disagree. But respectfully, you say that there is nothing to suggest that Cam is anything other than "normal" and then give things to suggest he is below normal and make excuses for them. However, I am in the business of analyzing, and assessing intelligence. I speak at symposiums and seminars on the subject. Most recently: The negligence of higher education on the development of divergent thinking skills. I am taking a group of undergraduate students to present at Duke University tomorrow (Google: State of NC undergraduate research and creativity symposium at Duke University if you need verification. We present at 9:15 in the Engineering facility.) Discount that if you want, but I don't tell Mechanics about transmissions or try to explain the law to attorneys, even though I pretend to know about both. (I know people are going to comment on that, but that is the truth and sorry if it sounds arrogant-just explaining why I know what I am talking about).

Cam has done little to demonstrate inelligence. Whether it be behind a microphone or a center, I am not seeing nornal for a pro QB. Look at the QBs from this year and last: RGIII, Andy Dalton, Andrew Luck, Tannehill, C. Ponder, Gabbert, Locker, Russell Wilson, Weeden, etc --that is normal. Most on this list were picked much later than Cam, and many are outperforming him. They are learning and growing--Is Cam?


So let me get this straight. You're saying that someone with a limited vocabulary and a limited mastery of the English language is by definition unintelligent? That they cannot process information as well as their peers?

If that is what is being taught today, I'm glad that my university years came a good while ago.

But good luck with the seminar.

#119 MHS831

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 10:33 PM

So let me get this straight. You're saying that someone with a limited vocabulary and a limited mastery of the English language is by definition unintelligent? That they cannot process information as well as their peers?

If that is what is being taught today, I'm glad that my university years came a good while ago.

But good luck with the seminar.


Did I say that? Let's not factor in actions and body language or his lack of maturity--all things that contribute to an educated perception. I would like to know where you went to school if you are saying that those things are characteristics of normal or average intelligence. You are not being honest with yourself.

The symposium went well. There were intelligent people there who understood our points. They respected our expertise and research, two things that should not be necessary in this rather obvious matter . Do you think that a limited vocabulary and limited mastery of the English language, Cam's mother tongue, are signs that he is smart? THere are not many better ways to judge a person's intellingence than listening to them speak, especially when his SAT scores are not available.

You have tried to twist everything in an oversimplification of my points so you can attack them. It takes no college degree to recognize a dumb quarterback. If you think Cam in smart or average, then keep him out of the same room with Luck, Brees, Brady, Both Mannings, RGIII, etc. Get Ryan Leaf and Jamarcus Russell to sit beside him and he will appear quite normal. Nice chatting.

#120 Verge

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 10:50 PM

does anyone here, legit, no joke; have a source within the panthers at all? real talk


One person in the scouting department. I'll ask him about it tomorrow.


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