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It’s not always on the offensive line! Take a deeper look…


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#1 theyhateme45

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:22 AM

Watching the games this season (especially today) I have seen a lot of post placing a lot of the blame on the O-line, stating we need new offensive lineman, they are overrated ect ect. Well I don’t think the issue is as simple as our lineman playing being garbage or over rated.


Do you remember when the patriots O-line was looking bad this season, or when Green Bay had one of the worst lines before A-Rod stepped up his play? Well over the seasons and time that talk went away. Anytime an offense looks bad, or gives up sacks a fan base first reaction is to throw the O-line under the bus (Don’t believe me, go check the message boards of some teams underperforming) everyone blames the O-line. It’s the easy way out and a lot of times not the true issues.


It’s not a coincidence teams with capable QB’s, and offensive personnel/coaches don’t have a lot of talk surrounding their O-Line. Why……?????? Because A Good QB, Good coaching, makes the Offensive line job easier and will dictate what the defense does. If you have a team bring pressure on a good offensive group the QB will get rid of the ball quick and make them pay… Some QB’s will audible to make the adjustments to attack the weakness in the pressure being brought… some WR’s run the correct option route to be on page with the QB and maybe take a short pass all the way. This is how good offenses work and take the pressure off of the line. It opens things up… it makes team think twice about what blitz packages they send at the QB.


That is what we are missing in Carolina… that well-oiled offense… one that can make teams pay for hitting us with multiple blitz packages. I am not placing blame on a single individual…. I place blame of the offensive coaches… I place blame on Cam… When you draft a Franchise QB like Cam you want him to be one who makes the offense better, one who can dictate what the defense does… You don’t want a QB with the #1 pick who needs everything to be perfect or very good to make plays… most QB’s can do that… but it’s the elite ones whose presence makes everyone that much better.. (Now as far as cam I am not saying he cannot reach that potential… but I think it’s a mix of him/coaching that it’s not moving in that direction). WR’s.. need more responsibility on the offense… need more option routes to attack weak spots in the blitz, need to get separation quicker…


I am not saying Our Offensive is great, but if the offense did all of these things I can almost guarantee the unit would be much better and not under that much pressure. When teams have no respect for your offense it makes for a long day for your offensive line and running game.

#2 Lilsmitty09

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:49 AM

Take a look or a read? Cause I'd much rather look

#3 theyhateme45

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 01:00 AM

Take a look or a read? Cause I'd much rather look


Meaning take a deeper look into the issue...

#4 Frizzy350

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 01:57 AM

Meaning take a deeper look into the issue...


Hate to say it but there is a resounding consistency with great offenses having good to great offensive lines. I really don't want to go look up the facts, but basically any incredible group of skill positions means dribble if you can't compete on the line of scrimmage.

Famous example: Brady in the superbowls vs the Giants. Did not look like himself, under constant duress, played desperate, sloppy mechanics and failing to capitalize the few times he did get protection.

#5 Herbert The Love Bug

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 02:00 AM

shitt I can't read all of that. sorry

#6 X-Clown

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 02:09 AM

Still can't get over the fact that cam is not allowed to audible

#7 JawnyBlaze

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 03:26 AM

The number of good teams with good lines far outnumber the number of good teams with bad lines....hopefully (and I know this comparison has been overused...) our offense is like the GB one of a few years ago with the bad O-line but good skill positions and QB and all we need is a competent draft pick or two (or FA pickup) to right the ship.

#8 MechaZain

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 03:54 AM

Brady's had a really good o-line for most of his career. Thus the superbowls and thus the superbowl loss last time the o-line failed.

A good coaching staff covers up the weaknesses of a team through playcalling. Rodgers and Roethlisberger overcame their bad o-lines through quick, short passes that forced defenses to keep guessing and served as confidence builders for the young quarterbacks as their careers blossomed. Cam doesn't have that luxury. Chud's idea of addressing a weak o-line is throwing and running out of the shotgun so Cam might have an extra half second to choose between running or chucking it downfield.

Cam has holes in his game but instead of doing anything to capitalize on his strengths and help him develop, we have a playbook that makes him have to be near perfect in order to win games.

Last year no one had seen anything like him before and he could carry the team to a couple of wins on that alone. Now that the league has it's up to Chud and Rivera to use their weapon properly and they haven't.

#9 theyhateme45

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 11:21 AM

Hate to say it but there is a resounding consistency with great offenses having good to great offensive lines. I really don't want to go look up the facts, but basically any incredible group of skill positions means dribble if you can't compete on the line of scrimmage.

Famous example: Brady in the superbowls vs the Giants. Did not look like himself, under constant duress, played desperate, sloppy mechanics and failing to capitalize the few times he did get protection.


Even with that so called "Bad" New England Offensive line they went 18-1 one year, and both years against arguably the best defensive line in the game the offense took the lead late in the 4th quarter before Eli had his two game winning drives.

My point is that great offenses makes their O-line looks great because of their ability to dictate defenses and make them pay for aggressiveness at times.

#10 Peppers90 NC

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 11:23 AM

Still can't get over the fact that cam is not allowed to audible

That is troublesome. Matt Ryan was calling plays at the LOS as a rookie. I asked this in another thread, is he incapable or do they not trust him?

#11 theyhateme45

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 11:27 AM

The number of good teams with good lines far outnumber the number of good teams with bad lines....hopefully (and I know this comparison has been overused...) our offense is like the GB one of a few years ago with the bad O-line but good skill positions and QB and all we need is a competent draft pick or two (or FA pickup) to right the ship.


My question is how many of those lines are being portrayed as good because because of the QB/Skills/Coaching around them?

Take that Green Bay situation... keep everything the same but inject Blaine Gabbert into that situation instead of A-Rod... I am fairly confident the thing in Green Bay right now would be how bad their O-line is, they don't help blaine, and the teamwould not have went on the runs they went on.

For Green Bay it's A-Rods ability to move in the pocket, elude pressure and make plays down the field that makes the offense looks that much better... Same play... A-Rod eludes throws a deep pass down field... Gabbert get sacks negative yardage long down situation... Exact same team, exact same play but the QB would play a huge difference on how the O-line looks.... Take it a step farther, now with Gabbert the Defense can pin their ears back and go after him again, while with A-Rod defense has to think about how the rush and contain him.

#12 theyhateme45

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 11:38 AM

Brady's had a really good o-line for most of his career. Thus the superbowls and thus the superbowl loss last time the o-line failed.

See above on Brady... Offense still had the lead late.

A good coaching staff covers up the weaknesses of a team through playcalling. Rodgers and Roethlisberger overcame their bad o-lines through quick, short passes that forced defenses to keep guessing and served as confidence builders for the young quarterbacks as their careers blossomed. Cam doesn't have that luxury. Chud's idea of addressing a weak o-line is throwing and running out of the shotgun so Cam might have an extra half second to choose between running or chucking it downfield.

Cam has holes in his game but instead of doing anything to capitalize on his strengths and help him develop, we have a playbook that makes him have to be near perfect in order to win games.

Last year no one had seen anything like him before and he could carry the team to a couple of wins on that alone. Now that the league has it's up to Chud and Rivera to use their weapon properly and they haven't.


THis is where we sort of agree.... Like I said above the play calling, playing to Cam's strength are other items that will improve the Offensive line play by making teams play for badly time blitzes.


The truth is... In most cases (not all) I don't think we see Offensive lineman on even enough playing ground to truly understand rather the unit is good or bad. There are Soo many other factors that plays into how the offensive line will look... You say they covered up a bad O-line, I say their offense improves making things easier on the O-line so they are able to perform better... Or they make plays causing the O-line mistakes not to be noticed because of the first down or long gain down the field.


Since we just Played Denver I will use them as an example. Right now Denver is happy with their offensive line, while we are unhappy with ours. Switch our offensive line personnel and I believe Denver is still looking good because teams are not going to irrationally blitz manning, D-Thomas could take a quick blitz adjustment and got to the house, and the offense will keep the defense off guard,,, Meaning the situation will be much easier for the offense to perform.. While our offense with the Denver line will still have no respect, an inability to make an aggressive defense pay, making the game harder on the O-line and we are still having this conversation...

So if that is the case, it means we need to look deeper are what is causing the O-line to be in these situations not to succeed instead of calling them garbage and saying we need to replace them, cause right now I don't care who is here it will be bad.

#13 Jackofalltrades

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 11:46 AM

This just in: Football is still a team sport

#14 Frizzy350

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 02:12 PM

Even with that so called "Bad" New England Offensive line they went 18-1 one year, and both years against arguably the best defensive line in the game the offense took the lead late in the 4th quarter before Eli had his two game winning drives.

My point is that great offenses makes their O-line looks great because of their ability to dictate defenses and make them pay for aggressiveness at times.



...That Patriots Oline was great... wtf are you smoking? They just got owned in the superbowl, and brady suffered significantly. Jerry Jones' Cowboys generated two of the most overrated hall of famers of all time by simply having a disgustingly good Oline. Philip Rivers had his best QBing seasons while the chargers had a dominate Oline. The KC teams led by Priest Holmes, Trent Green and Larry Johnson, all generated by great Oline play. Dan Marino, Brett Favre, Steve Young, Jim Kelly - All had great lines. John Elway won his super bowls when he was finally blessed with a stud running back and great line. The ONLY exception to this I can think of is Peyton Manning in his last maybe 2 years in Indy, but when he had his best years he even had a pretty solid line.

#15 UNCrules2187

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 02:19 PM

31. Carolina Panthers (26th)

PB = 25th, RB = 31st and PEN = 16th

A big drop for the Panthers with the performance of Amini Silatolu over the past few weeks being a key factor. His abuse at the hands of the Bears will live long in the memory. With Ryan Kalil down, only Jordan Gross is making life any easier on the players around him.


https://www.profootb...week-10-update/

It's the offensive line.


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