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The difference between Cam 2011 and Cam 2012...


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#16 Urrymonster

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:54 PM

I like stats with more substance. Does that stat include pressures and hits? I can see that Cam gets pressured a lot just by watching the games. According to football outsiders, our pass protection is 24th in the league. They use adjusted sack rate.



http://www.footballo...rs.com/stats/ol

They also have our run blocking as 31st.

So tell me how does this help our QB?


Cam is pressured on 33.3% of drop backs which is about 9th most in the league. 1 in 4 times Cam is pressured its a sack. Those sacks take on average 3.52 seconds to land.

It takes him on average 5.46 seconds to decide to scramble. That's the fourth longest time in the NFL.

It takes him on average 3.04 seconds to throw. That's the third longest time in the NFL.

Anyway you shape it, Cam is spending a long time in the pocket, no wonder the pressures are coming thick and fast. Whether it's the routes being run, the WRs not getting seperation, the OLine allowing quick pressure Cam needs to make quicker decisions. This isn't surprising, most young players struggle with quick decisions early in their career so it's not a huge concern.

If his WRs are covered well, scramble or throw it away. Pressure in his face? Check down. Routes taking a while to develop, then roll out the pocket and keep the opposing DLine guessing. Cam needs to make quicker decisions and that will help his porous OLine out.

#17 KillerKat

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:57 PM

Cam is pressured on 33.3% of drop backs which is about 9th most in the league. 1 in 4 times Cam is pressured its a sack. Those sacks take on average 3.52 seconds to land.

It takes him on average 5.46 seconds to decide to scramble. That's the fourth longest time in the NFL.

It takes him on average 3.04 seconds to throw. That's the third longest time in the NFL.

Anyway you shape it, Cam is spending a long time in the pocket, no wonder the pressures are coming thick and fast. Whether it's the routes being run, the WRs not getting seperation, the OLine allowing quick pressure Cam needs to make quicker decisions. This isn't surprising, most young players struggle with quick decisions early in their career so it's not a huge concern.

If his WRs are covered well, scramble or throw it away. Pressure in his face? Check down. Routes taking a while to develop, then roll out the pocket and keep the opposing DLine guessing. Cam needs to make quicker decisions and that will help his porous OLine out.



Ok you just said Cam is pressured the 9th most in the league. Which means Cam is scrambling more which of course would lead to a higher time to throw because he still has the ball in his hands. QBs that are really mobile will take a longer time to sack because they're moving around also. I find that 5 seconds to decide to scramble really hard to believe. What do they consider scrambling because i see Cam moving around a lot.

#18 TheGreatestOfAllTimeCam

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 03:01 PM

Change your username and root your team on. Cam is the only reason we're in this thing right now.

I seriously can't tell if you're just a huge troll or if you actually don't understand the game.


Cam is my favorite athlete of all time but I am not blind to win he is struggling I'm sorry. He needs to be more accurate.

#19 chef17

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 03:05 PM

Change your username and root your team on. Cam is the only reason we're in this thing right now.

I seriously can't tell if you're just a huge troll or if you actually don't understand the game.


Really? Captain's pick six isn't a huge reason?

#20 KillerKat

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 03:14 PM

I should've also added that penalties put this offense in big holes every game.

#21 Urrymonster

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 03:23 PM

Ok you just said Cam is pressured the 9th most in the league. Which means Cam is scrambling more which of course would lead to a higher time to throw because he still has the ball in his hands. QBs that are really mobile will take a longer time to sack because they're moving around also. I find that 5 seconds to decide to scramble really hard to believe. What do they consider scrambling because i see Cam moving around a lot.


It'll be non-designed runs, so read options won't be counted. So anytime he drops back and then improvises with a run.

You really aren't prepared to put anything on Cam really are you? Look, pressures hits and sacks increase the longer you hold on to the ball. Anyway you shape it, Cam is holding onto the ball longer than virtually every single NFL QB in the league. He is not the most pressured QB, but he is holding onto the ball the longest.

It's not all on Cam, but you were originally making out that he had 1-2 seconds to make a decision, when in actual fact he had a lot more time than that. In addition, 1-2 seconds is all any QB ever has to make a decision.

#22 SuperMan

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 03:29 PM

Cams slow indecisive play on the option is what is ruining it!

#23 KillerKat

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 03:32 PM

It'll be non-designed runs, so read options won't be counted. So anytime he drops back and then improvises with a run.

You really aren't prepared to put anything on Cam really are you? Look, pressures hits and sacks increase the longer you hold on to the ball. Anyway you shape it, Cam is holding onto the ball longer than virtually every single NFL QB in the league. He is not the most pressured QB, but he is holding onto the ball the longest.

It's not all on Cam, but you were originally making out that he had 1-2 seconds to make a decision, when in actual fact he had a lot more time than that. In addition, 1-2 seconds is all any QB ever gets.


read options not counted? That was our base offense for half the season!

They consider scrambling when he actually takes off to run? Sorry, that's not what scrambling is.

They count the time to throw while Cam still has the ball and scrambling. That's just an inaccurate way of judging a QB. Mobile QBs have the ball longer because they can move around to avoid pressure. Cam has to scramble because he is getting pressured. I can see that with my own eyes. I don't need stats to tell me what I see. It just happened in this game. Cam gets hit a second after the ball is snapped. When I say he has 1-2 seconds, Im counting when the line collapses, or at least 1 of them, allowing a defender to get to Cam and pressure him Stats don't tell the whole story.

#24 Urrymonster

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 03:38 PM

read options not counted? That was our base offense for half the season!

They consider scrambling when he actually takes off to run? Sorry, that's not what scrambling is.

They count the time to throw while Cam still has the ball and scrambling. That's just an inaccurate way of judging a QB. Mobile QBs have the ball longer because they can move around to avoid pressure. Cam has to scramble because he is getting pressured. I can see that with my own eyes. I don't need stats to tell me what I see. It just happened in this game. Cam gets hit a second after the ball is snapped. When I say he has 1-2 seconds, Im counting when the line collapses, or at least 1 of them, allowing a defender to get to Cam. Stats don't tell the whole story.


You don't have a clue what a scramble is. They aren't talking about moving around to avoid pressure. They are talking about when he drops back, decides not to pass, tucks the ball and runs. That is a scramble. Read options are designed run plays so they don't count.

And stats do tell the whole story, because they are based on fact. The content of them isn't apparent at all times but in terms of how long Cam is holding onto the ball there is no way you can argue that.

#25 KillerKat

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 03:46 PM

You don't have a clue what a scramble is. They aren't talking about moving around to avoid pressure. They are talking about when he drops back, decides not to pass, tucks the ball and runs. That is a scramble. Read options are designed run plays so they don't count.

And stats do tell the whole story, because they are based on fact. The content of them isn't apparent at all times but in terms of how long Cam is holding onto the ball there is no way you can argue that.


That is not what a scramble is. A scramble is moving around to avoid pressure. That's what it always has been. Sorry, but you are dead wrong.

What does Quarterback Scramble Mean?


A tactic a quarterback uses to evade a defense's pass rush. A quarterback scramble occurs when the quarterback leaves the area protected by the offensive line and runs into the other areas of the field. A quarterback can scramble to avoid a sack, extend a play to give the downfield receivers more time to get open, or to attempt to gain yardages. Quarterback scrambles are unpredictable plays, because they tend to be unplanned and have a high risk to the quarterback, since the offensive line is not prepared to block in the new area the quarterback has entered.


http://www.sportingc...k-scramble.aspx

Quarterback Scramble: On a called passing play, when the quarterback runs from the pocket in an attempt to avoid being sacked, giving the receivers more time to get open or attempting to gain positive yards by running himself


http://www.superglos...k_Scramble.html

Like I said, stats don't tell the whole story.

#26 Urrymonster

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 03:59 PM

Fair enough, but in this instance. The 5+ seconds I am mentioning is when he finally decides to run. So this isn't rolling out etc, just when he pulls it down and runs with it.

I feel like are picking on semantics to avoid the fact that Cam takes a long time to make decisions.

#27 ZB1224

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 04:03 PM

I do think that Cam takes longer than he should to make decisions, but he could get away with it a little bit if he had a solid offensive line. I think that it's fair to say that with how long it takes for him to make decisions -- with how bad our offensive line really is, it does hurt us a little bit. It's something that he will grow out of as he learns the game imo.

#28 Urrymonster

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 04:07 PM

I do think that Cam takes longer than he should to make decisions, but he could get away with it a little bit if he had a solid offensive line. I think that it's fair to say that with how long it takes for him to make decisions -- with how bad our offensive line really is, it does hurt us a little bit. It's something that he will grow out of as he learns the game imo.


Bingo.

It's something he will improve on, but you can't say that he is only 5% responsible for the offenses failures.

#29 KillerKat

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 04:08 PM

Fair enough, but in this instance. The 5+ seconds I am mentioning is when he finally decides to run. So this isn't rolling out etc, just when he pulls it down and runs with it.

I feel like are picking on semantics to avoid the fact that Cam takes a long time to make decisions.


Well that 5 seconds is good then. Because that means he is trying to stay in the pocket and be a pocket passer instead of trying to turn into someone like Vick was with the Falcons who always ran and couldnt throw at all. Yes on some plays he could decide to run quicker, but he was taught to be a pocket passer first. Also keep in mind he's scrambling too most of the time, because our line sucks, in those 5 seconds while trying to find a receiver.

#30 KillerKat

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 04:11 PM

Bingo.

It's something he will improve on, but you can't say that he is only 5% responsible for the offenses failures.


It's hard to say its more than 5 when the line, coaches, OC, and Hurney have all led him to regress into what he has been lately.


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