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#31 Ruff

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 10:52 AM

I really thought he played under center.


He does some, but if I had to guess, I would say that it's < 20% of the snaps in a game.

But, at the next level, Star is definitely a Ngata-comparable player. He's quick, he can shed blockers, he can bull rush. Star has a couple of questions, though. The main one being that a DT should dominate opposing college offensive lines if they're going to get drafted highly. He hasn't done that this year, at all. Against Mountain West competition. Is that because he's being double and tripled team? Maybe.

#32 KissMyConverse

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 10:55 AM

Why is it that we all think Ngata is a NT?
I feel lied to.

On that note though he causes a lot of havoc playing DE in a 3-4 and we just need a fatty to play NT (Or a well conditioned athlete in the case of Wilfork) would you draft Star to play 3-4 DE?
I know Walter has him listed as the #1 NT but if he works better playing like Ngata I'm game for whatever makes our Defense monsters.

#33 KissMyConverse

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 10:57 AM

He does some, but if I had to guess, I would say that it's < 20% of the snaps in a game.

But, at the next level, Star is definitely a Ngata-comparable player. He's quick, he can shed blockers, he can bull rush. Star has a couple of questions, though. The main one being that a DT should dominate opposing college offensive lines if they're going to get drafted highly. He hasn't done that this year, at all. Against Mountain West competition. Is that because he's being double and tripled team? Maybe.


Utah moved to the Pac-12.
And I thought the general rule of thumb is you can't judge a DT based off stats. They are really all about the eye tests and how many blocks they can eat up.

#34 Ruff

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 11:02 AM

Why is it that we all think Ngata is a NT?
I feel lied to.

On that note though he causes a lot of havoc playing DE in a 3-4 and we just need a fatty to play NT (Or a well conditioned athlete in the case of Wilfork) would you draft Star to play 3-4 DE?
I know Walter has him listed as the #1 NT but if he works better playing like Ngata I'm game for whatever makes our Defense monsters.


I'd definitely draft him to play a 34 DE, he could be a monster at the next level. He's a very high-risk/high-reward player, though, so I don't know if I would draft him in the Top 5.

As far as a NT, honestly Ron Edwards (if he can come back from two pretty severe injuries) played NT in Kansas City, so he's an option, even if he's just a rotational player. Fua was a NT in college in a 34, and could definitely player better there than in at the NT position in a 43.

However, if I was looking to draft players for a 34, I would look at players like Jackson Jeffcoat from Texas (might drop to the early 2nd because of a pectoral injury) who is very similar to a Whitney Mercilus or Ryan Kerrigan. Can be a stand-up, drop into coverage guy, can be a hand in the dirt pass-rusher, or can be a hybrid of both.

Then there's Alex Okafor, also from Texas, who is more similar to a JJ Watt style player. More suited at the DE position in a 34, but can be incredibly disruptive.

Then there's guys like Jesse Williams, from Alabama, who could dominate the game from the NT position in a 34.

#35 Doc Holiday

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 11:02 AM

camon guys... you dont want a combo of Te'o/Keek?? dude...

we dont NEED that, but thats like never ending potential right there.. like I cant even process that

The truth is, we are going to part ways with some players we are going to miss, but we will get draft picks/ players for them that will fill our needs.

..............................................Martin...................................................................Godfrey...........................................................

.......................................................................TE"O...............KEUCKLY..........................................................................................

Norman.................................Alexander...........Dwan......Ron.....Hardy..............CJ....................................Gamble.....................


I mean you could switch any of those guys around on the Dline, I dont even have Anderson and Beason on there. Anderson could be an OLB. Dont forget about draft pick/ players we traded for to come in and fill in. idk i just think the Te'o + Keukly would just be insane.. and not TOO drastic of wholes on Defense. i mean seriously compensate an open cap from released/ traded players and picks and we could be set. Dont forget Norman and Alexander were late 4th and 5th round!

that's only 10 players you have there Vince Lombardi

#36 Ruff

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 11:05 AM

Utah moved to the Pac-12.
And I thought the general rule of thumb is you can't judge a DT based off stats. They are really all about the eye tests and how many blocks they can eat up.


You're right, sorry about that. Still, the level of competition isn't that great (minus Oregon, Oregon State, and USC to a degree).

But, you're right, it is hard to judge a DT from the stand-point of stats. But, if you're going to draft a guy in the Top 5 at the DT position, he needs to be like a Suh-esque player. Just unblockable. I'm not sure if Star is that player.

Can Star be great? Absolutely. But, like I said, I think he's a high-risk/high-reward player. He could boom more than any DT in a long time (with the exclusion of Suh) or he could bust like we've never seen.

#37 Ruff

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 11:06 AM

that's only 10 players you have there Vince Lombardi


No, it's 11, it's just a 52 defense which looks incredibly bad.

#38 KissMyConverse

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 11:08 AM

You're right, sorry about that. Still, the level of competition isn't that great (minus Oregon, Oregon State, and USC to a degree).

But, you're right, it is hard to judge a DT from the stand-point of stats. But, if you're going to draft a guy in the Top 5 at the DT position, he needs to be like a Suh-esque player. Just unblockable. I'm not sure if Star is that player.

Can Star be great? Absolutely. But, like I said, I think he's a high-risk/high-reward player. He could boom more than any DT in a long time (with the exclusion of Suh) or he could bust like we've never seen.


Suh honestly should have won the Heisman. I think he batted 6 balls down against VT, and only got better from there.
I guess none of this matters till we find out who is coaching the team. Right now I just want us to get some confidence installed in our young players.

#39 The Huddler

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 10:29 AM

No, it's 11, it's just a 52 defense which looks incredibly bad.

its supposed to be a 3-4. and sorry for failing at posting

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 11:27 AM

Why is everyone forgetting about beason? Before the whole Achilles tear he was easily the second best MLB behind Willis of San fransico. Even if after these 2 injuries he come back 3/4 the player he was that's still an above average linebacker.

#41 Kurb

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 11:27 AM

the 4-3 has worked wonders for us this year, but if our new staff comes in wanting a 3-4 i think we should trade james anderson and jon beason.. then solidify the front 7 with the drafting of Manti T'eo.. a front 7 of hardy, ron, dwan with cj T'eo Keek TD/Alexander is very good. yes early but its a lost season lol. go ahead and say im an idiot but just a thought



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#42 arc

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 11:46 AM

A few things:

-The game is won and lost in the trenches

-We clearly saw the effects/deja vu of a line without a decent interior beyond D'wan against a terrible KC team

-On defense, a strong high prospect interior presence is what we need to take the d to a new level. Keep building. We've got Keek, CJ, Hardy, Alexander here for sure imo so keep building from that. Having a consistent d-line and MLB here for years to come could be very smart.

-The question then is where do priorities lie and who is expendable with a new coaching staff...and that answer, no one has (yoda voice)

-This team has a lot of holes and I'll agree switching to a 3-4 doesn't seem likely at all, but its not like it can't happen. You never know in the NFL.

All of this being said, If we're in position for Star or Hankins in this upcoming draft I am ALL for it...Teo though, highly unlikely

#43 Kurb

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 11:49 AM

I hate you people.

#44 arc

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 11:51 AM

I hate you people.


that's unfortunate :)

#45 Lout

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 11:30 AM

We need to scrap this transition idea to a 3-4....

We don't have the personnel. We don't have the cap space. We can't just cut/trade these contract players without some type of cap penalty...

The new GM needs to salvage what we have right now. We are simply not in a position to undergo a defensive scheme change.

3-4 idea is nonsense right now IMO


Normally I'd agree with you, but after seeing the Colts switch to a 3-4 this year, I believe it can be done with ANY team. The colts were less prepared for the 3-4 than we are and they are having a great season. If Freeney can play in a 3-4 than CJ most definitely can.


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