156 replies to this topic

[MasterAwesome]

Let's compare apples to apples.
Since 2008 DWill has averaged 5.0 YPC, Stewart 4.7 YPC.
So Dwill is more efficient.

Very good....read past the first line lol. Stewart can make plays on his own, regularly grinding out 5 or 6 yards on each carry (I'm not referring to the YPC STAT, but to each run individually) whereas Williams benefits from the occasional big run to boost his average. They might both equate to a roughly 5.0 YPC average, but I'll take the 5 yards each time as opposed to the 7 carries for no gain followed by the 40-yarder.

[ThunderKatt]

R

40 yard plays are game changers.

[panthers55]

Actually DWill has missed 13 games to Stewarts 9... and let's skip past this "games started" talk and get a little more relevant when you compare Attempts..

with that said, I just find it funny people have actually stated they would rather have DWill/Tolbert over Stewart/Tolbert, because Stewart gets hurt a lot..

Prior to this year, Stewart missed 2 games and played through pain.

The fact that he has had all these issues with his ankle and foot is a red flag. Williams has 100 more carries over that time and has proven to be a bigger game changer. Again why keep saying prior to this year about Stewart as if it doesn't count. That is like saying other than 2010, Williams has been healthy except for 3 games in the last 5 years. They all count.

[CRA]

That was total yards which is based on yards per carry not attempts. We were 14th in carries which is what you are referencing. You can't assume we would do that well every year and this year shows that what we did in 2011 may be a fluke. Our yards per carry were lower by everyone you mentioned in your post by quite a bit.

Fact is....all 3 runners in 2011 averaged less than 10 rushes per game. Don't need to lean on one guy....they did exactly what was claimed was comical.

Our run game sucked this year bc our OL was poo. Doesn't matter who is in your backfield with crappy OL play. Carolina's G play was a joke....reason they like Stewart ideally is bc the offense is designed for runs between the tackles. Run game didn't go backwards bc of who is in the backfield.....but how sad we where between the tackles. DeAngelo didn't average 1 yard per rush against Oak or 0 against Tampa bc he sucks...or Chud sucks. OL sucked and we could run simple plays

[panthers55]

For the record, from 2008-2010 ( Double Trouble under Fox)

Stewart had more rush attempts than Williams

While were going there, if Rivera thinks that Stewart is better, then why did Williams have 328 carries to Stewart's 235 in 2011 and 2012?? Couldn't be because Williams was hurt in 2010 and Stewart was hurt in 2012.

Talk about selective skewed stats. Seriously??????

[bleys]

The fact that he has had all these issues with his ankle and foot is a red flag. Williams has 100 more carries over that time and has proven to be a bigger game changer. Again why keep saying prior to this year about Stewart as if it doesn't count. That is like saying other than 2010, Williams has been healthy except for 3 games in the last 5 years. They all count.

because people seem to think DWill hasn't missed 13 games in 4 years...

[panthers55]

Fact is....all 3 runners in 2011 averaged less than 10 rushes per game. Don't need to lean on one guy....they did exactly what was claimed was comical.

Our run game sucked this year bc our OL was poo. Doesn't matter who is in your backfield with crappy OL play. Carolina's G play was a joke....reason they like Stewart ideally is bc the offense is designed for runs between the tackles. Run game didn't go backwards bc of who is in the backfield.....but how sad we where between the tackles. DeAngelo didn't average 1 yard per rush against Oak or 0 against Tampa bc he sucks...or Chud sucks. OL sucked and we could run simple plays

Again you miss the point as usual. You assume that the running game was good by using total yard stats. When I point out that we didn't run that often so you can't assume that we will run the same next year you go to the O line. We actually ran the ball more times this year than last. Why? We had fewer bigger plays and first down runs There is no guarantee we will fare better next year than this year. You can't account for injuries and other factors that make a difference. So using 2011 numbers for anything is a small sample that may be unique and not representative of what we do next year. Plus without Williams big play potential I doubt we do as well as we did this year. So we will likely have to run more to get the same production which again will wear Stewart out. Regardless of the o line

[panthers55]

because people seem to think DWill hasn't missed 13 games in 4 years...

Your point if you can find one................

[CRA]

While were going there, if Rivera thinks that Stewart is better, then why did Williams have 328 carries to Stewart's 235 in 2011 and 2012?? Couldn't be because Williams was hurt in 2010 and Stewart was hurt in 2012.

Talk about selective skewed stats. Seriously??????

My post was in direct response to someone saying Fox didn't run Stewart.....sure there were reasons Stewart got more reps rushing but he wasn't kept on the shelf like implied.

Why did Stewart play a larger % of his teams offensive snaps than any RB in the NFCS in 2011? This ain't Foxball.

Offense was pretty good in 2011, right? That isn't a skewed stat. Stewart was the primary RB in 2011. Offense wasn't about lining up a RB and pounding him. Stewart was more diverse and he got the most playing time bc of it.

Stewart gets sidelined in 2012 with injury....Williams gets more snaps simply bc Stewart can't go. Rivera wanted Stewart on the field and officially demoted Williams.

[bleys]

Your point if you can find one................

easily stated already.. as well as in the post you quoted. take your time.

[Kevin Greene]

how can you say DWill isn't the guy when the guy you're saying is fragile is comparable.. Yet only getting older and missed more games in the last 4 years than the younger fella..

When you have your swami hat on and your trying to predict the future you do it based on all the info you can gather.
Stewart's feet issues, lack of training camps and practice time at the tender age of 25 is a huge red flag to me.
If not to you, so be it.

[bleys]

When you have your swami hat on and your trying to predict the future you do it based on all the info you can gather.
Stewart's feet issues, lack of training camps and practice time at the tender age of 25 is a huge red flag to me.
If not to you, so be it.

what you and P55 don't understand is I'm comparing one guy you keep claiming is fragile to another guy people seem to think isn't....

[teeray]

he has been healthy every year but this year and only missed 2 games prior to this year. People keep saying this while completely ignoring DWill is that guy.

Maybe I think that because he always starts training camp hurt. But you are right!! Seems like he missed more time than just 2 games.

My apologies. I was going with truthiness. Something that feels true even if it isn't.

[CRA]

Again you miss the point as usual. You assume that the running game was good by using total yard stats. When I point out that we didn't run that often so you can't assume that we will run the same next year you go to the O line. We actually ran the ball more times this year than last. Why? We had fewer bigger plays and first down runs There is no guarantee we will fare better next year than this year. You can't account for injuries and other factors that make a difference. So using 2011 numbers for anything is a small sample that may be unique and not representative of what we do next year. Plus without Williams big play potential I doubt we do as well as we did this year. So we will likely have to run more to get the same production which again will wear Stewart out. Regardless of the o line

Not missing anything.

Point I made was we were the best ground attack in the NFL in 2011 (historically good). We did so without leaning on any particular rusher......2011 supports the fact you don't need to primarily run 1
player.

Running Stewart 10 times a game won't wear him out.

Yeah, injuries happen and then can change your ideal scenarios and throw things out the window. You can work around that in your rush attack. No biggie if Stewart blows a tire and we have to adjust.....a bigger deal is if Smith blows a tire or some one at a more important position.

We simply built our roster wrong. Easy to find rushers if someone goes down....and we already have tons of talent unlike most teams if that happens. Need to worry about improving our roster and less about keeping this silly overload of talent in the backfield together

[panthers55]

My post was in direct response to someone saying Fox didn't run Stewart.....

Why did Stewart play a larger % of his teams offensive snaps than any RB in the NFCS in 2011? This ain't Foxball.

Offense was pretty good in 2011, right? That isn't a skewed stat. Stewart was the primary RB in 2011. Offense wasn't about lining up a RB and pounding him. Stewart was more diverse and he for the most playing time bc of it.

Stewart gets sidelined in 2012 with injury....Williams gets more snaps simply bc Stewart can't go

Do you seem to forget that playing a larger % of snaps might have a lot to do with who Rivera thought was a better blocker in the pass game or a better pass receiver. You seem to constantly mix all kinds of numbers and stats together to make a point but rarely present an accurate or balanced approach. What does that have to do with Fox not running Stewart? Rivera ran Williams more than Stewart in 2011.

This ain't Fox ball..... Your point???

Offense was good in 2011 but it was a new system that teams hadn't seen before. Why assume we will do it every year?
Maybe you forgot that in 2012 our running game sucked while Stewart was getting his carries. It only blossomed when Rivera changed philosophies went to a power game and featured Williams. Maybe Rivera will change his mind and stick with Williams after 2012 given they have to win in 2013. I wouldn't count on Stewart.