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WE (K)NEED 1st ROUND TALENT ON OUR O LINE. period


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#61 jungleking

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 08:55 AM

Now go back in and name all of the top round picks on OLines....

Diamonds in the rough are rare and hard to come by and are not always available every single draft.

Warmack is talented enough to justify being picked at 14. You don't ignore talent or BPA especially when this team has glaring needs on the OLine.

Warmack isn't talented enough to be picked at 14. He's not ten spots better than DeCastro was. If guard were really an impact position, a guy as good as DeCastro would have gone earlier. Teams know that they can find starters later, whether by drafting college guards or grabbing tackles and converting them. It just isn't a good place to spend those resources.

#62 Rubi

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 08:56 AM

Warmack isn't talented enough to be picked at 14. He's not ten spots better than DeCastro was. If guard were really an impact position, a guy as good as DeCastro would have gone earlier. Teams know that they can find starters later, whether by drafting college guards or grabbing tackles and converting them. It just isn't a good place to spend those resources.


To me he is and he fills a big need. Agree to disagree

#63 Rubi

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 08:59 AM

Why pass on a blue chip who's #1 at his position....at the same time filling a huge need

Just saying

#64 panthers55

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 09:13 AM

Now go back in and name all of the top round picks on OLines....

Diamonds in the rough are rare and hard to come by and are not always available every single draft.

Warmack is talented enough to justify being picked at 14. You don't ignore talent or BPA especially when this team has glaring needs on the OLine.


Why don't you do the research. I just picked the top rated lines and showed you where they all pick up guys in later rounds. It is fine to say that diamonds in the rough are rare but I just showed where they aren't that rare. The only reason that most people pick up left tackles in the draft usually high is that they cost so much in free agency. Guards on the other hand are not nearly as expensive.

I would be okay picking up a tackle at 14 to replace Gross if there were one out there worth that, but not a guard unless we had other positions already covered. We can do what we did a few years ago when we picked up Vincent, bring in a bunch of guys and separate the wheat from the chaff. Given the Giants history of drafting and Gettleman being from there, don't be surprised if we don't go o-line this year. The last time the Giants drafted an offensive linemen in the first round was 1999.

#65 panthers55

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 09:15 AM

Why pass on a blue chip who's #1 at his position....at the same time filling a huge need

Just saying


Gettleman if he follows the Giant's history won't be doing that. They don't draft o linemen high, they acquire them in later rounds or through free agency.

And guard is not a huge need just one of many.

#66 TheRumGone

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 09:42 AM

Gettleman if he follows the Giant's history won't be doing that. They don't draft o linemen high, they acquire them in later rounds or through free agency.

And guard is not a huge need just one of many.


This is probably true. And although I want Warmack badly, Gettleman apparently has a great instinct about players in later rounds. So why not pick up Oline later if Gettleman has that ability. I really have no idea which way we are going to go.

#67 Rubi

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 12:07 PM

Why don't you do the research. I just picked the top rated lines and showed you were they all pick up guys in later rounds. It is fine to say that diamonds in the rough are rare but I just showed where they aren't that rare. The only reason that most people pick up left tackles in the draft usually high is that they cost so much in free agency. Guards on the other hand are not nearly as expensive.

I would be okay picking up a tackle at 14 to replace Gross if there were one out there worth that, but not a guard unless we had other positions already covered. We can do what we did a few years ago when we picked up Vincent, bring in a bunch of guys and separate the wheat from the chaff. Given the Giants history of drafting and Gettleman being from there, don't be surprised if we don't go o-line this year. The last time the Giants drafted an offensive linemen in the first round was 1999.


Well in 2010 the 49ers used two first round picks on two OLine players. Davis and Iupati.

Sorry if I don't agree with plug and play patchwork players to protect our franchise player. And we do not have the cap flexibility to bring in quality pieces...at any position...

#68 Rubi

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 12:11 PM

I think limiting who you pick based on perceived value at a particular slot in the draft is a mistake. The number 1 need for this team right now is creating a strong offensive line. Just so happens probably the BPA may be Warmack at 14. It will open up the entire offense and it will make the team that much better. We are in a position to either draft the best guard in the draft or trade down, acquire another pick, and then select him (if he's available).

The 1st selection needs to be G or T.

#69 csx

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 12:24 PM

We don't have to have first round talent, we have to have talent that produces regardless of where it is found. What we need is a plan to build a good line, its not something that happens in one draft.

Iupati was regarded as one of the best guards to come along in a decade and he went 17th. I don't think there is chance we take one at 14 and think that would be quite foolish considering that an impact DT or Safety should be there.

#70 Captain Morgan

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 12:43 PM

good discussion in this thread.

if Warmack is as good as they say, I'd take him as long as there is no OT of value available at that pick.
I think it's too risky to trade back 5 spots or so and think he will still be there. I wouldn't mind Cooper
in the second if he falls that far.

But this thread has convinced me we should go O line in the first, and maybe even the second as well.
I've said before, we should get some really good value in the second.

#71 panthers55

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 01:36 PM

Have we ever spent a first round pick on a guard?? The answer is a resounding no. And we surely have had some good lines. Unless it is an offensive tackle to replace Gross, going O line in the first would be a waste of a top 15 pick.

We have gone O line- each time a tackle- 3 times in our history. Blake Brockermeyer (29) when we had 3 first round picks, Gross in 2003 at 8, and Otah in 2008 at 19. Of those only Gross really worked out well. Drafting a guard in the first is only a good idea if you don't have a lot of other pressing needs. That is clearly not us.........

#72 Kurb

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 01:42 PM

Defensive Tackle or Offensive Tackle would be prime picks at 14.


THAT SAID,

Warmack looks better than DeCastro, who was labeled "perfect" by so many draftniks last season.
If you can pick a player in the first that you believe can transform a unit (Offense/Defense) you pick that player.

I don't know if Warmack is that good, BUT having a middle of Warmack/Kalil/Almini could be pretty magical.


In my ideal world, Warmack is out target, but we trade back to say...21ish gain a extra pick in either 2/3 or more and still get a dominate player.

#73 AceMan

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 01:48 PM

Well in 2010 the 49ers used two first round picks on two OLine players. Davis and Iupati.

Sorry if I don't agree with plug and play patchwork players to protect our franchise player. And we do not have the cap flexibility to bring in quality pieces...at any position...


Funny...we gave the 49ers that pick to choose Everette Brown and Mike Goodson

All-Pro 1st team vs Two guys who aren't on our team anymore

#74 Rubi

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 03:23 PM

Funny...we gave the 49ers that pick to choose Everette Brown and Mike Goodson

All-Pro 1st team vs Two guys who aren't on our team anymore


Yea. Great pick in the first and he's a guard. Yet people on the huddle say "you can find guards in the 4-5 rounds"

If a dominant player is there. You take him.

#75 Rubi

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Posted 15 January 2013 - 03:29 PM

Have we ever spent a first round pick on a guard?? The answer is a resounding no. And we surely have had some good lines. Unless it is an offensive tackle to replace Gross, going O line in the first would be a waste of a top 15 pick.

We have gone O line- each time a tackle- 3 times in our history. Blake Brockermeyer (29) when we had 3 first round picks, Gross in 2003 at 8, and Otah in 2008 at 19. Of those only Gross really worked out well. Drafting a guard in the first is only a good idea if you don't have a lot of other pressing needs. That is clearly not us.........


So based on our history u suggest that we hand cuff ourselves and select another player or position based on past experiences and "value". What exactly is draft value and why does it matter that much to where it prevents a team from building itself by selecting quality players?

We aren't picking in the top 10 this year. Just an example...Warmack is a dominant SEC, monster, power guard. A mauler. Also a collegiate champion. We have issues with our line and protection. So because he's a guard this disqualifies him from being selected at 14??


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