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Who is Jim Harbaugh?


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#151 FootballMaestro

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 02:44 PM

Again, a non-answer. And I assure you, Harbaugh does not get universally glowing reviews from everywhere. His own media generally considers him an arrogant jerk who glories in the accomplishments of his team and refuses to accept blame. I find it fascinating that my generally lucid and forthright comments on Harbaugh are written off as rapid homerism when anyone who's read through my comments generally find I make logical and defensible arguments on why I feel the way i do. You don't have to agree with me either, but to slight me by accusing me of fanaticism or homerism just shows the futility of your own arguments.


I didn't accuse you of homerism. Other people did that. I accused you of potential fanaticism.

Once we have to prove why Harbaugh is a mediocre to poor Head Coach in your mind (based off of the supposition that he's not a good Executive/Manager/Decision Maker/Leader, despite the fact that we can find numerous examples of Rivera's mistakes in those areas, but few of Harbaugh's), we've gone from the realm of a healthy football debate, spiraling into the slippery slope of vapid, self indulgent semantics.

#152 rayzor

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 02:44 PM

oh...and harbaugh getting fired in a few years? lol

if the results are there, he won't be fired.

#153 pstall

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 02:47 PM

fiery has an entire ax factory to grind over harbaugh. geez louise

#154 fieryprophet

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 02:47 PM

i left it out because it wasn't important about him running a successful program. i did say that he wasn't liked and he was arrogant, did i not? did i do anything to hide from that.

it has no bearing on his coaching, though. i'm not surprised in your grasping at straw approach to arguing that harbaugh isn't as good as people think that you'd grasp at that one.

he does what it takes to get his team better. he does what it takes to make his team dominant. that's what you look for. i don't care how "smart" or how much of an expert someone is when i'm looking for a leader. i'm looking for someone who makes the people around them the best, and that's exactly what he does.

that "pro-bowl" talent he "inherited"...how many of those guys had been selected to the probowl when he got there? how much more are the achieving as individuals and as a group compared to before he got there?


Grasping at straws? I'm pointing out that his "leadership" has apparent flaws from the get-go. I've already writeen enough on my other reasons for finding him overrated (to which no one bothers a response because they have none.)

You have no tangible proof that Harbaugh is any of the things you claim he is. None. Zero. Zilch.

We already know he presents no schematic advantages, we already know he is blessed with more talent around him than most other coaches, we already know he took over an underpeforming squad that could have improved with merely competent coaching, and we already know he has a record of being intensely disliked and of lying to suit his situations. But other than all that he's an elite coach!

#155 fieryprophet

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 02:48 PM

I didn't accuse you homerism. Other people did that. I accused you of potential fanaticism.

Once we have to prove why Harbaugh is a mediocre to poor Head Coach in your mind (based off of the supposition that he's not a good Executive/Manager/Decision Maker/Leader, despite the fact that we can find numerous examples of Rivera's mistakes in those areas, but few of Harbaugh's), we've gone from the realm of a healthy football debate, spiraling into the slippery slope of vapid, self indulgent semantics.


I'm not talking about Rivera. I'm talking about Harbaugh. Prove your case that he is a good Executive/Manager/Decision Maker/Leader.

#156 fieryprophet

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 02:50 PM

fiery has an entire ax factory to grind over harbaugh. geez louise

I have an ax to grind with you, rayzor, and whatever other goddamn moron wants to continue your lovefest for Harbaugh and slam JR for not forcing the man to come here when he clearly had no interest in doing so. He may be a better coach than Rivera, but he's not elite, he's wouldn't have done much better here, and the rest of it is typical Huddle whining that I'm sick and tired of hearing.

#157 SZ James (banned)

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 02:50 PM

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#158 pstall

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 02:54 PM

wow. i would rather debate cantrell on civil rights and living wage then Johnny Cantankerous in the friggin panther forum. wow.

#159 rayzor

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 03:05 PM

I have an ax to grind with you, rayzor, and whatever other goddamn moron wants to continue your lovefest for Harbaugh and slam JR for not forcing the man to come here when he clearly had no interest in doing so. He may be a better coach than Rivera, but he's not elite, he's wouldn't have done much better here, and the rest of it is typical Huddle whining that I'm sick and tired of hearing.

wow you're daft.

i'm not complaining about JR not hiring him. i know that the panthers had interest and he didn't. i didn't think it was likely that we'd get him because i saw no benefit to him personally by leaving the bay area.

i knew all along that he would find success as a coach in the NFL and that he'd find it quickly. nothing has changed that.

you've got the problem here because you're on this pissy homer outrage that is blinding you about him being successful.

but you know what...i would have more success talking to a doorknob about why it would be better off becoming an apple pie than trying to get you to admit you're wrong about him and it's not because you're right. it's because you're just stubborn and i'm done with it.

please continue on your mission to discredit the guy and fight us "goddamn morons" who think that harbaugh is as good of a coach as he is.

#160 Proudiddy

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 03:37 PM

Fiery, I used to think much better of your posts and post quality. Not that you care, but... Man, WTF happened?

The longer I've been on this board the more I've seen people attach themselves to one person, player, or line of thinking associated with our organization to the point that they completely meltdown when the tide turns against that person/player/ideal. It seems you're headed down that path.

You are an intelligent dude, but that doesn't mean you have all the answers.

#161 Cyberjag

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 03:37 PM

Just curious FP, who are the current "elite" coaches in the NFL, in your opinion?

#162 CCS

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 03:56 PM

While JR's "we're running a business here" mentality is infuriating, I still don't think he said that poo about Harbaugh and even if we did want Harbaugh I don't think he ever wanted us so it would have been pointless. People act like he would have signed here just because we wanted him when the 49ers were pretty much his dream job.

#163 fieryprophet

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 03:56 PM

Just curious FP, who are the current "elite" coaches in the NFL, in your opinion?


Belichick is the most creative and ingenious coach in the NFL, and despite his Super Bowl drought he's done tremendous things with Tom Brady and a lot of spare parts. His drafting acumen is pretty average, however, which is why he has to make do with so many spare parts. But of all the coaches I've ever seen he's the one who has repeatedly changed his schemes to utilize the talent avsailable, turning Brady from a game manager in the Super Bowl era, into a vertical attack QB during the Moss era, and then into a spread QB in the Gronk era.

Sean Payton is an elite offensive mastermind, and much like Belichick utilizes an elite QB and a bunch of otherwise decent players into a formidable offense. His defensive acumen is rather poor, however, as he relies almost completely on his defensive coordinator.

Rex Ryan, while by all accounts a rather basic offensive coach, is one of the league's most brilliant defensive coaches. His two playoff games against New England were masterful, especially in the way he spent the regular season showing the Patriots a lot of zone coverages before switching to man defense in the playoffs and unleashing completely unforeseen blitz packages on Brady.

Tom Coughlin is a good strategist, but his best coaching attribute is his ability to teach individual players how to beat their direct assignments rather than utilizing any schematic advantages. Coughlin doesn't try to fool you, he simply gives his players the tools to line up and beat you outright.

That's pretty much it. Tomlin, McCarthy, Reid, Fisher and Fox are in my second tier, although Fox has his well-documented issues with his conservative bent. Which is strange, because Fox has shown plenty of capability to be creative in his schemes and coaching, he just doesn't seem to trust it.

Beyond that you're picking from a lot of unknown quantities or inconsistent track records.

#164 I Mean He Was Found Guilty

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 04:01 PM

harbaugh turned down a blank check from miami to coach the 49ers

we couldn't have bought his services guys

#165 fieryprophet

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 04:02 PM

Fiery, I used to think much better of your posts and post quality. Not that you care, but... Man, WTF happened?

The longer I've been on this board the more I've seen people attach themselves to one person, player, or line of thinking associated with our organization to the point that they completely meltdown when the tide turns against that person/player/ideal. It seems you're headed down that path.

You are an intelligent dude, but that doesn't mean you have all the answers.


Look, most of my diatribe tendencies have less to do with Harbaugh than it does the people that talk him up. When I introduce evidence that may indicate he might not be as good as some people claim I get called a homer or intransigent or whatever, which is infuriating. I have said repeatedly I think he's a good coach, not an elite one. But I despise the snide remarks of "well, if JR had just hired him we'd be in the Super Bowl" and other asinine bullshit like that, and I will rightly call those goddamn morons out for being goddamn morons.


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