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Perspectives on NEEDS and how we fill them


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#1 MHS831

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 08:55 AM

Now that the staff is in place, it is likely that what we prioritize in free agency and the draft (and re-signing/cutting current players) has become more clear. For example, when Chud was the OC, we became TE heavy. Gettlemen, Shula, new position coaches,--all will leave an impression on Gettlemen. I still think our needs have not changed, but how we address them could be unique.

DT: Probably gone due to cap: Dwan Edwards, Ron Edwards, Andre Neblett (UFA)
That leaves Frank Kearse and Sione Fua at NT, Chandler at the 3 technique. (Scary)

I think they will go with Kearse and Fua at the NT and look for a good under tackle. Personally, they will want a veteran in free agency (due to the inexperience) and a young, developmental DT taken in the later rounds. DTs in the draft seem to fill needs, but many are asked to do too much too soon. They are not the cure alls (see Lions) people think they will be.

WR: Probably gone: Armanti Edwards, Kealoha Pilares, Louis Murphy (UFA),
That leaves Steve Smith, Brandon Lafell, David Gettis, Joe Adams, and Lamont Bryant.

I added Bryant because I think he could step up and steal a role as a third WR. He is big, fast, and raw. However, you cannot count on it, so we have to assume that we are hanging everything on Steve Smith's shoulders. Let's face it-a 34 year old WR who has admittedly lost a step and is 5 - 9 is not the ideal #1. If he gets hurt, where are we? Dead in the water. Prohel needs to make Gettis and Adams productive options, but we really need a #1 WR. It is hard to gauge the talent in the draft based on statistics due to conferences and qb play. I think the WR position, however, needs a stud. a possible nickel in the fifth or sixth rounds.

OL: Certainly gone: Hangartner, G. WIlliams, Z Williams. Possibly gone: Gross
That leaves POSSIBLY Gross, Silatolu, Kalil, Bell.

Gettlemen will watch the tape on Gross and make a decision to either trade, cut, or rework his deal. I have a feeling that reworking the deal is not going to be the popular choice. I think we are taking a Tackle because I am not sure Bell will measure up on film either. With possible needs at 3 spots on the OL, can we pay one guy like we pay Gross? Many things can happen, but one is to replace Gross with a young, cheaper talent. Another is to replace Bell with a younger, cheaper talent who would be Gross's heir apparent. The other is to extend Gross, keep Bell at RT and draft a G. That does not solve 2 problems. I think that we draft a LT in the first round and I think that T will be Lane Johnson, who will rise by mid April to mid first round status. If not, extending Gross and taking Lane to play RT over Bell is another option. I think we draft a T and a G--when depends on the front office and the Gross situation. If I were the GM, I would draft the LT (hard to find) and trade Gross (a team that needs a Lt would take a former pro bowler at a cost of only $6.8 million--we would get a fourth or so for him). With the nearly $7 million we saved in salary, I would sign a Free agent Right Guard for a one or two year contract. I would draft one to develop with the pick we got . Drafting a LT makes financial and football sense.

S: Certainly gone: Sherrod Martin, Nakamura
That leaves Charles Godfrey at FS and DJ Campbell and Colin Jones at SS.

I am not sure there is anything in the draft that can help us here and free agency is a joke, so expect a sixth rounder (we will have some comp picks) for depth. We will also add a player cut from another roster. Not a good situation, but if we get really strong up front, Godfrey and Campbell could be adequate.

So, what Gettlemen does with Gross is going to determine our path in the draft.
If Gross is reworked, then we decided to go with a #1 WR in the first round.
If Gross is traded or cut, we will take a LT in the first round and fill the G spot in free agency.
In both cases, I see CB being too rich in the second round to pass up.

1. LOT or WR
2. CB

DT is addressed in free agency (After cuts, we should have some room for a few, second tier free agents); If we lose Gross, then RG will also be addressed in free agency.

I am very interested in other opinions--the odds of this being accurate are slim.

#2 BigSyke

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 09:22 AM

oline


wr


dt

cb/s

#3 Pejorative Miscreant

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 09:28 AM

Well thought out and logical although I respectfully disagree. At least currently as my opinion may change or take shape over the next couple months. I agree we should go OL and/or WR in the first but the problem with that is that I do not see anyone being available at 14 who is not a reach or a project. I think there are a few DTs available that could be solid from day one and grow into a long term solution. I do agree we need a veteran presence no matter what.

FYI - the odds on this being accurate is also very thin

#4 IamSoClutch

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 09:34 AM

Draft:
1. WR
2. OT
4. CB/S
5. DT
6. S
6. BPA

Oline:
Keep Gross. Sign a OG in free agency. Draft a versatile OT/OG in the 2nd. Draft Gross Replacement in 1st round 2014

DT:
Address in free agency

WR:
take in 1st if obvious no brainer picks arent available anymore. we need smitty replacement now. takes time for any receiver to develop in the nfl and we are running out of time. pray that gettis/bryant make something of themselves.

S:
i do think we could possibly sign a free agent (phillips maybe)

#5 MHS831

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 10:07 AM

Draft:


Oline:
Keep Gross. Sign a OG in free agency. Draft a versatile OT/OG in the 2nd. Draft Gross Replacement in 1st round 2014

DT:
Address in free agency

WR:
take in 1st if obvious no brainer picks arent available anymore. we need smitty replacement now. takes time for any receiver to develop in the nfl and we are running out of time. pray that gettis/bryant make something of themselves.


If we do not take a stud WR in the first round (I think we can trade down and get one) then why bother? (agreeing with you, and I think everyone has taken Smitty for granted--he is hitting the wall very soon) WR is definitely the achilles heel of my scenario. To extend gross, get free agent G and DTs, and focus on WR in the first is probably very smart.

I look at where I think players will be on draft day and I cannot help but thinking we will draft a CB in the second round.

I think we will have a better idea when we see what Gettlemen does before free agency. Thanks for this--it is a scenario I have considered, to a degree.

#6 MHS831

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 10:27 AM

Well thought out and logical although I respectfully disagree. At least currently as my opinion may change or take shape over the next couple months. I agree we should go OL and/or WR in the first but the problem with that is that I do not see anyone being available at 14 who is not a reach or a project. I think there are a few DTs available that could be solid from day one and grow into a long term solution. I do agree we need a veteran presence no matter what.

FYI - the odds on this being accurate is also very thin


I appreciate this and these thoughts have been in the back of my mind. If all players were equal, then I might go with a DT because they have the best value. I have these biases in my thinking that I cannot dismiss:

LT is a valuable player, worth more than any other player except the QB. If we have to reach, OK to reach for a LT. Not OK to reach for a WR.

DTs in the 4-3 are not as important as we think they are. Look at the Lions. However, it is a position that has been neglected here. I really appreciate Kris Jenkins. (MY CRAZY IDEA: Sign Dorsey from the chiefs--he is a bust, but maybe because the 3-4 was never his thing. ) I also fear the stat that says (forget where I saw it) that the majority of DTs taken in the first round bust. I think a middle-tier veteran and a rough late rounder would solidify our front. Since it takes DTs a few years to get good, maybe Kearse, Chandler, and Fua will step up in 2013. However, I see your point--the value at DT is undeniably better than the value at WR or OT on the surface.

WRs in this draft are weird in that I have no idea who the best are. I feel that there is hardly any dropoff from whomever is ranked #1 and the person ranked #5 or #6. If we decide to go WR, and I understand that need completely, I hope we look to drop 10-12 spots. From what I have read and heard, Allen, Patterson, Hunter, Patton, Williams (not high on), and possibly Woods will all get first round grades. In addition, I am not sure that Rogers and Hopkins do not belong on that list. Since I doubt 8 WRs go in the first round, we could trade down in the first round and end up wth a Hunter or Patton. Not bad.

The next 40 days will tell us a lot. It has been and will continue to be the most interesting Panther off season in some time.

#7 rscott94

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 11:04 AM

1. NT
2. RG
3. OT
4. WR
5. CB
6. S

*(possible) UT

#8 IamSoClutch

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 11:15 AM

i really dont see how some people see patterson as a reach. if he stayed in college on more year he would be a bonifide top 8. why not take him now at 14. he is a born playmaker. the dude is 6'3 a does kick off and punk returns. All he needs is more polished route running. Proehl and Smitty can mentor him so much in this area. i believe as a rookie he can have atleast 7 tds through just being a playmaker and redzone threat. he will go up to 10 once he polishes his route running. Gettlemen wants big guys and Touchdown scores. patterson is both of those if we pass on him and go OL i hope the dude from Clemson.

#9 MHS831

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 11:37 AM

i really dont see how some people see patterson as a reach. if he stayed in college on more year he would be a bonifide top 8. why not take him now at 14. he is a born playmaker. the dude is 6'3 a does kick off and punk returns. All he needs is more polished route running. Proehl and Smitty can mentor him so much in this area. i believe as a rookie he can have atleast 7 tds through just being a playmaker and redzone threat. he will go up to 10 once he polishes his route running. Gettlemen wants big guys and Touchdown scores. patterson is both of those if we pass on him and go OL i hope the dude from Clemson.

Everyone seems to think he will be a better pro than he was in college. I would speculate that if he is on the board at 14, we could take him. Somehow, however, I see the Dolphins (possibly) taking him at 12. Funny, but the Phins' situation at T could impact our draft. If they do not re-sign Long, they will have to go OT in the first, in my opinion. If they do not take Eric Fisher and he is there at 14, I think we would take him.
I do not see a top 12 WR in the draft, but if one rises, Patterson is the guy. He is no AJ Green or Julio Jones, but he is half a notch behind them. They went top 10, so you are probably spot on.

#10 koolkatluke

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 11:49 AM

Again this all depends on FA.

But right now (and how you don't have a CB on the list I don't know).

1. CB
1b. Dt

2. Ol

3. Wr

4.FS

If we lose both Edward boys DT is number 1.

If we lose Gamble and Captain CB is number 1.

#11 MHS831

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 01:04 PM

Again this all depends on FA.

But right now (and how you don't have a CB on the list I don't know).

1. CB
1b. Dt

2. Ol

3. Wr

4.FS

If we lose both Edward boys DT is number 1.

If we lose Gamble and Captain CB is number 1.


I had CB on this list---just noticed it was not on here. New computer and it is very sensitive. I must have deleted it.

We might need 2 CBs--a nickel and a #1. (to summarize what it said) I would be happy with second rounders Ryan or Trufant and a later round nickel CB like Webb from William and Mary.

#12 IamSoClutch

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 03:10 PM

Everyone seems to think he will be a better pro than he was in college. I would speculate that if he is on the board at 14, we could take him. Somehow, however, I see the Dolphins (possibly) taking him at 12. Funny, but the Phins' situation at T could impact our draft. If they do not re-sign Long, they will have to go OT in the first, in my opinion. If they do not take Eric Fisher and he is there at 14, I think we would take him.
I do not see a top 12 WR in the draft, but if one rises, Patterson is the guy. He is no AJ Green or Julio Jones, but he is half a notch behind them. They went top 10, so you are probably spot on.


Eric Fisher is probably going to the chargers. almost every mock draft i see has that same pick in common. miami could very well go reciever at 12 but i feel with all the cap space they have they will sign either jennings or bowe for their reciever spot. your right on about patterson. no a Aj green or julio yet, but once he is more polished i have no doubt he will be on that level

#13 MHS831

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 03:35 PM

Eric Fisher is probably going to the chargers. almost every mock draft i see has that same pick in common. miami could very well go reciever at 12 but i feel with all the cap space they have they will sign either jennings or bowe for their reciever spot. your right on about patterson. no a Aj green or julio yet, but once he is more polished i have no doubt he will be on that level

I have seen the Chargers ttaking Womack but that was before SR Bowl practices, but Fisher is pretty unanimous, like you say. , . Since reading your post, I watched some you tube on Patterson. I think I had never really considered WR in the first so I never researched WR like the other spots. I also think I watched some clips of Justin Hunter and in my mind, confused the two. Tennessee was loaded at WR. I would take Hunter in the second round, no doubt. Patterson, however, was very impressive. I worry that his stop and go moves, changes of direction etc. will result in a short career in the NFL, but he has some of the best moves I have ever seen for a 6-3, 200 lb WR. While I still want Johnson (who is ranked around 15 on some boards already), I would not be disappointed at all with Patterson.

#14 beach

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 06:43 PM

As of now without considering who could be where in the draft and what FA moves could be made:

1-WR Has been and still is our big need. We need more weapons on this team

2-OG (Hang'man is baaaaad, a road grader is desperately needed)

3-CB (especially if Gamble is gone; Josh Thomas is the only for sure guy imo at the position)

4-NT/DT (D'wan is good with Kearse, Chandler, & Neblett about avg.; we also rotate Alexander and Hardy inside for some of our sets...we really need help here but not necessarily rd1 priority imo)

5-OT (This will be 1 or 2 if Gross is gone)

6-S

If we keep Gross, I would seriously be down for a Johnthan Banks/Quinton Patton type combo in 1/2

#15 koolkatluke

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 07:54 PM

As of now without considering who could be where in the draft and what FA moves could be made:

1-WR Has been and still is our big need. We need more weapons on this team

2-OG (Hang'man is baaaaad, a road grader is desperately needed)

3-CB (especially if Gamble is gone; Josh Thomas is the only for sure guy imo at the position)

4-NT/DT (D'wan is good with Kearse, Chandler, & Neblett about avg.; we also rotate Alexander and Hardy inside for some of our sets...we really need help here but not necessarily rd1 priority imo)

5-OT (This will be 1 or 2 if Gross is gone)

6-S

If we keep Gross, I would seriously be down for a Johnthan Banks/Quinton Patton type combo in 1/2


1. If Josh Thomas is the only sure thing (which he really isn't a sure thing) Then how is CB not numer 1?

2. Dwan is a FA and Neblett is a RFA. DT is a way bigger need then WR.


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