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DARPA and the ARGUS-IS Drone camera.

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[quote][color=#15255B][font=Helvetica, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif][size=4]Curious as to how the Defense Department could be spying on you next? PBS checked in with DARPA about the latest in drone camera technology for the NOVA special [/size][/font][/color][i]Rise of the Drones[/i][color=#15255B][font=Helvetica, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif][size=4], including the world's highest-resolution camera. [/size][/font][/color]

[color=#15255B][font=Helvetica, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif][size=4]Actually [/size][/font][/color][i]seeing[/i][color=#15255B][font=Helvetica, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif][size=4] the sensor on ARGUS-IS, or Autonomous Real-Time Ground Ubiquitous Surveillance Imaging System, is still classified, but the basics of how it works have been deemed fit for public consumption. [/size][/font][/color]

[color=#15255B][font=Helvetica, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif][size=4]ARGUS-IS uses 368 imaging chips like those found in cell phone cameras, to stitch together a 1.8 billion pixel video. That means from 17,500 feet in the air, ARGUS-IS can see someone on the ground waving their arms. And it generates that kind of high-definition video for an area 15 square miles across. It can see a bird flying through a parking lot from more than three miles in the air. [/size][/font][/color]

[color=#15255B][font=Helvetica, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif][size=4]It can store a million terabytes of video a day, up to 5,000 hours of footage, so soon drones will not only be able to see everything that happens on the ground, but also keep that record. [/size][/font][/color]

[color=#15255B][font=Helvetica, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif][size=4]Whether or not ARGUS has been used in the field is still classified. Let's get real, though: Does this cool a toy get put in a corner?[/size][/font][/color][/quote]

http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2013-01/darpa-can-see-you-17500-feet-air

[yt]QGxNyaXfJsA#![/yt]

Remember that the US has approved these to fly over our own soil. How do you love the surveillance state?

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[b]I can't wait for all of the new reality tv programs this is gonna make!!!!!![/b]

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When this thing can see through my roof I might get worried. Until then I have to remind myself of the phrase "reasonable expectation of privacy" and not worry if this thing catches me sun tanning my scrotum in the back yard.

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This isn't much different from the capabilities of our satellites... Just cheaper.

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I'm not out doing terrorist poo so I'm not worried about it. If this helps prevent another 9/11 or helps is keep an eye on Bad guys' nuclear programs, more power to us.

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[quote name='Cary Kollins' timestamp='1359471917' post='2118015']
I'm not out doing terrorist poo so I'm not worried about it. If this helps prevent another 9/11 or helps is keep an eye on Bad guys' nuclear programs, more power to us.
[/quote]

Ohh for fug's sake.

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[quote name='Cary Kollins' timestamp='1359471917' post='2118015']
I'm not out doing terrorist poo so I'm not worried about it. If this helps prevent another 9/11 or helps is keep an eye on Bad guys' nuclear programs, more power to us.
[/quote]


NSA Goal accomplished!..

The new one is to make the public 'Buy in" to "guys we need to start increasing all our taxes to help the country" Creating an economic, publicized economic panic allows the country to sacrifice cash and economic mobility to fund expanding Military initiatives...

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[quote name='Floppin' timestamp='1359476769' post='2118113']

Ohh for fug's sake.
[/quote]
[quote name='TANTRIC-NINJA' timestamp='1359559742' post='2119004']


NSA Goal accomplished!..

The new one is to make the public 'Buy in" to "guys we need to start increasing all our taxes to help the country" Creating an economic, publicized economic panic allows the country to sacrifice cash and economic mobility to fund expanding Military initiatives...
[/quote]

OK so Ill bite.

Whats the concern over the use of this technology over US soil? Why should I be concerned? What right/privilege/freedom is in danger by these things being in the sky? And dont give me some hyperbolic slippery slope bullshit answer. Tell me why I should be concerned by this.

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Your privacy is ten thousand times more threatened by Facebook than this camera.

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[quote name='Inimicus' timestamp='1359560572' post='2119018']
OK so Ill bite.

Whats the concern over the use of this technology over US soil? Why should I be concerned? What right/privilege/freedom is in danger by these things being in the sky? And dont give me some hyperbolic slippery slope bullshit answer. Tell me why I should be concerned by this.
[/quote]

There's quite a large group of people who don't like the idea that the government, should they want to, has the ability to see, follow, and track your every move. It's totalitarian, it's big brother, it's a surveillance state. These things make people feel threatened, feel imprisoned to a overbearing, overarching power structure.

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[quote name='Delhommey' timestamp='1359560929' post='2119021']
Your privacy is ten thousand times more threatened by Facebook than this camera.
[/quote]

Unless I'm mistaken, Facebook doesn't have the ability to track me with live camera. I could be wrong, but I don't believe it does.

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Well Cell phone and GPS apps that track you...its not what are they doing today but the non-opposition to what could be done. Privacy is not a bad thing or a crime.

Find my cell phone app today.....Terminator-Drone target lock tomorrow...enjoy.

Also Minority Report style technology will have commercial applications that just will be annoying.

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[img]http://static4.businessinsider.com/image/50d34188eab8ea267000000f-1726-618-/moma-blue-sky-umbrella.jpg[/img]problem solved.

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[quote name='Floppin' timestamp='1359561154' post='2119025']

There's quite a large group of people who don't like the idea that the government, should they want to, has the ability to see, follow, and track your every move. It's totalitarian, it's big brother, it's a surveillance state. These things make people feel threatened, feel imprisoned to a overbearing, overarching power structure.
[/quote]


But that presupposes that they would want to. That for some reason the US Govt would find you and your habits uniquely interesting out of the 313 million other Americans.

My guess is that without reason to look in on someone the powers that be would have little to no resources for simply watching citizens go about their mundane little lives. For that matter they probably wouldn't have the resources to watch even known or suspected criminals unless they were suspected of being involved in reasonably serious crimes.

I dont see how its any different than worrying about the fact that, if so motivated, the government could recreate every single online mouse click and see every single website I had visited in the last year or more. Can they do it? Yes. Will they? Not likely. So on my scale of worry/dont worry about it its way down in the "fug it" region.

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[quote name='Cary Kollins' timestamp='1359471917' post='2118015']
I'm not out doing terrorist poo so I'm not worried about it.
[/quote]

Neither were some of the folks in Gitmo...

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[quote name='Inimicus' timestamp='1359565795' post='2119091']


But that presupposes that they would want to. That for some reason the US Govt would find you and your habits uniquely interesting out of the 313 million other Americans.

[/quote]

One of the perhaps positive effects of developments like this is the raw amount of data that is being stored is astronomical. We are measuring information in Zetabytes and there probably isn't a Zetabyte of storgae in the world.

So one day you may have every conversation and movement I make stored on a hard drive somewhere but good luck sifting through it.

When i worked for a firm of 200 people every email was tracked and stored. People of course were worried that someone was reading through emails. The IT guy laughed and said the raw man hours to go looking for stuff would be overly prohibitive.

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Yeah, it's not the data, it's the search engines that you should be worried about.

Take FB's new Graph Search for example. I can look up "Men who like Carolina Huddle and Glee" and find all of you fugers on it.

No joke.

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[b]They can speed up the search by filtering keywords and phrases in messages. [/b]

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[quote name='Harris Aballah' timestamp='1359570764' post='2119153']
[b]They can speed up the search by filtering keywords and phrases in messages. [/b]
[/quote]

Just like if you say the word "kilo"..on the phone it triggers a few actions.

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[quote name='TANTRIC-NINJA' timestamp='1359573533' post='2119204']
Just like if you say the word "kilo"..on the phone it triggers a few actions.
[/quote]I imagine it does! lol

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[quote name='Inimicus' timestamp='1359560572' post='2119018']
OK so Ill bite.

Whats the concern over the use of this technology over US soil? Why should I be concerned? What right/privilege/freedom is in danger by these things being in the sky? And dont give me some hyperbolic slippery slope bullshit answer. Tell me why I should be concerned by this.
[/quote]

The very fact that the gov feels the need to watch it's own citizens the same way they watch 'terrorists' speaks volumes to most of us... How does this fly over your head?


Do these technologies and drones have to start firing missiles at people in the USA before they will draw a line in the sand? Only a fool could see what is coming and not feel worried about it.


There has not been a legitimate terror attack on America in almost 12 years, and the attack 12 years ago is highly questionable itself... What is the purpose for this? Why now?

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[quote name='chris999' timestamp='1359577382' post='2119273']
The very fact that the gov feels the need to watch it's own citizens the same way they watch 'terrorists' speaks volumes to most of us... How does this fly over your head?


Do these technologies and drones have to start firing missiles at people in the USA before they will draw a line in the sand? Only a fool could see what is coming and not feel worried about it.


There has not been a legitimate terror attack on America in almost 12 years, and the attack 12 years ago is highly questionable itself... What is the purpose for this? Why now?
[/quote]


It "flies over my head" because you are jumping to a couple of conclusions that I dont think are appropriate or even rational.

First off you are assuming that they are going to be (or possibly already are) deployed in widespread surveillance operations over US soil. Surveillance operations of average citizens doing the banal poo that average citizens do. Dude I hate to break it to you but the government doesn't feel the need to watch you. You're just not that interesting. I'm not either so dont feel bad. And even if either of us were, there are far better ways for our government to keep tabs on us than deploying a drone that cant see me when I go into a parking deck.

Then you jump to missiles on theses recon drones and even suggest that the government would deploy those weapons against those same boring citizens. Really?

And as to the purpose for this? How about monitoring the borders, or high resolution monitoring of military base perimeters, or high resolution aerial cartography, or even monitoring of remote national parks/resources? I'm sure the list could go on for days.

Again...
Stay away from all of the hyperbole and tell me why this is a threat to me or my freedoms and Ill listen with an open mind, but when you start telling me that this is the first step to goosestepping fascists marching down main street and you just sound like the lunatic fringe.

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[quote name='Inimicus' timestamp='1359579721' post='2119321']


It "flies over my head" because you are jumping to a couple of conclusions that I dont think are appropriate or even rational.

First off you are assuming that they are going to be (or possibly already are) deployed in widespread surveillance operations over US soil. Surveillance operations of average citizens doing the banal poo that average citizens do. Dude I hate to break it to you but the government doesn't feel the need to watch you. You're just not that interesting. I'm not either so dont feel bad. And even if either of us were, there are far better ways for our government to keep tabs on us than deploying a drone that cant see me when I go into a parking deck.

Then you jump to missiles on theses recon drones and even suggest that the government would deploy those weapons against those same boring citizens. Really?

And as to the purpose for this? How about monitoring the borders, or high resolution monitoring of military base perimeters, or high resolution aerial cartography, or even monitoring of remote national parks/resources? I'm sure the list could go on for days.

Again...
Stay away from all of the hyperbole and tell me why this is a threat to me or my freedoms and Ill listen with an open mind, but when you start telling me that this is the first step to goosestepping fascists marching down main street and you just sound like the lunatic fringe.
[/quote]


I just dont understand the need for them to watch us. They work for us, if anything we should be watching them.

You say that they have no interest in watching us, if that is so, then why are they deploying all of this technology to do exactly that?

And yes, maybe we are boring and they are not watching us in particular... that doesnt always mean that things will always stay that way. We cant see the future... there could be a civil war or an uprising in the near future, or some home grown terror attack that could change our country overnight. Look how much it has changed in 12 years alone...

Why is it that I am lunatic fringe because I do not want military technology flying over my head by a government that the people trust less and less every day?

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There are a few scared people who need these things to protect them from the lunatic fringe 99% who are claiming high treason, massive fraud, money laundering and crimes against humanity. If these peasants think they're going to lock somebody up they've got another thing coming!!! Right? Right?

Pay no attention to that thing in the sky.

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[quote name='chris999' timestamp='1359581334' post='2119361']


I just dont understand the need for them to watch us. They work for us, if anything we should be watching them.

You say that they have no interest in watching us, if that is so, then why are they deploying all of this technology to do exactly that?

And yes, maybe we are boring and they are not watching us in particular... that doesnt always mean that things will always stay that way. We cant see the future... there could be a civil war or an uprising in the near future, or some home grown terror attack that could change our country overnight. Look how much it has changed in 12 years alone...

Why is it that I am lunatic fringe because I do not want military technology flying over my head by a government that the people trust less and less every day?
[/quote]

I'm not saying that you are part of the lunatic fringe, just that some of the slippery slope arguments sound like their talking points.

That the are watching us is an assumption on your part. I dont believe that is is a logical step to think that just because they have the tech means they are using it domestically. That's not to say that I think these drones have never taken pictures of US soil and US citizens but to suggest there is a sustained and comprehensive operation to monitor the citizenry is a few steps too far in my mind. And in order for it to approach the realm of violating my freedoms, the operation would need to be very close to 24/7 border to border surveillance.

And that's what this is about to me. Are they violating my freedoms and rights by using these devices domestically? I'm not concerned with some future civil conflict that might happen where having had the drones deployed would give the government some advantage. I'm concerned with my right to be free from unwarranted search, my right to freedom of association and movements, and my right to privacy where it can be reasonably expected. And in the end I dont see how this drone with this camera reduces or in any way infringes on any of those freedoms.

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