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Fox: Solar Energy won't work here because it's not sunny like Germany


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#25 NanuqoftheNorth

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 04:42 PM

how did she even enter Germany into the conversation then? pretty dumb

Because within another a few decades Germany is expected to obtain half its energy from renuable sources, solar being a major contributor to that goal (they are closing all their nuclear facilities too). FOX once again finds itself in a pickle, because while other nations are demonstrating it is not only possible, but practical, to reduce the world's dependence on fossil fuels, it has to tow the company line, the one not based on FACTS. FOX and the US public are captured by Big Oil and Big Oil's propaganda tries to undermine all competitive forms of energy, including solar. FOX is the propaganda arm of the GOP. The GOP is the political arm of Big Oil. Therefore any facts about alternate forms of energy are verboten on FOX. Especially if it makes our current President look smart. Germany and its national energy goals represent everything America's Big Oil companies fear, the longer they can keep the American public ignorant the better. The share of electricity produced from renewable energy in Germany has increased from 6.3 percent of the national total in 2000 to about 25 percent in the first half of 2012. http://en.wikipedia....ergy_in_Germany

#26 Niner National

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 05:04 PM

Germany entered the conversation because Germany is the world leader in solar energy. They have more solar installed than anyone despite having a relatively low amount of sunlight.

Many say that solar would be detrimental to the grid if implemented in mass, but Germany has done it successfully. There were a few days last year where Germany got 50% of all the daytime energy needs met by solar.

Solar will probably never be able to supply us with all our power needs because obviously it does not create energy at night, but it is perfect to fill the peak demand needs. It requires virtually no staff and no maintenance.

There are power plants all over the nation that sit idle for most of the year, being used only on days when peak demand is high. While the production cost of energy from those plants is low when they are running (because the fuel is cheap), there are high costs associated with keeping those plants active so they can be used only a handful of days a year.

We truly need an all of the above energy approach and our energy policies are one area where I think we've done exceedingly well the last 8-10 years. Gas and oil production are at all time highs, imports are at their lowest in decades, and the renewable sector has grown at a very fast pace and has driven the cost down significantly. In some areas of the country solar can now be installed on a utility scale at or below grid parity, without government incentives (although they'll still get them).

The next energy boom area will be the Mississippi Lime. This area was drilled for years using conventional methods, then the oil dried up. With today's technologies, the oil can again be extracted at an economical rate. What is happening in ND will soon happen across the Mississippi Lime region and will bring a lot of wealth to a poor area.

#27 stirs

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 05:11 PM

The problem with the US is that our fossil fuel costs, even though we raise cain about it, is still way lower than Euro pricing. Their fossil fuel costs make it advantageous to go toward solar while we are having to force feed it because for the most part, it and wind are more expensive.

#28 NanuqoftheNorth

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 05:13 PM

The increasing acidity of our oceans due to humans burning fossil fuels should be a great concern to everyone. So having access to relatively cheap oil and coal should not be a justification for using it. Germany remains committed to its green agenda, driven, some say, by the need to correct the world's wrongs – a sentiment that goes back to the second world war and the postwar generation who challenged their parents afterwards for just standing by.
"That has led to a very strong environmental and anti-nuclear movement," says Green party MP Hermann Ott. "It ultimately led to the foundation of the Green party and made us very strong. If something goes wrong, you have to speak up and do something otherwise your children will ask you in 20 to 30 years, 'Why didn't you do anything?'" http://www.guardian....gy-emission-co2 Torsten Albig, a Social Democrat who is governor of Schleswig-Holstein, also praised the discussions as “a considerable step forward” toward reaching a master plan by March.
His northern coastal state, along with Lower Saxony, has been criticized for expanding offshore wind energy at such a rapid pace that turbines have had to be switched off on exceptionally windy days, because they produce more energy than the grid can handle.

#29 Niner National

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 05:26 PM

The problem with the US is that our fossil fuel costs, even though we raise cain about it, is still way lower than Euro pricing. Their fossil fuel costs make it advantageous to go toward solar while we are having to force feed it because for the most part, it and wind are more expensive.


according to figures from the EIA the per megawatt hour cost of onshore wind is cheaper than coal and nuclear. Maybe natural gas too, can't remember. I'm on a phone right now and don't feel like looking it up, but it is easy enough to find.the costs in their report are reported without incentives, so it is real cost.

#30 NanuqoftheNorth

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 05:37 PM

Damn it, there go those European Socialists :growl: again, letting citizens generate their own renewable energy and sell the surplus electricity to others for a profit! :money: Oh wait, their doing what? :startle: Never mind. Posted Image Germany's renewable-energy law entitles anybody who puts in a solar panel or a windmill to sell surplus power to the grid, receiving a generous “feed-in tariff” guaranteed over 20 years. This gives renewable electricity priority over conventional power. Not surprisingly, renewables grew ten times faster than the OECD average from 1990 to 2010 and now account for 20% of electricity output (see chart). The government’s target is 35% by 2020. Germany gets more electricity from renewable sources than any other big country.
The return on capital can top 20% a year in the best spots. But do not confuse harvesters of sun and wind with electricity plutocrats. “One important goal is to break the monopoly” of the four big power companies that dominate the market, says Hermann Albers, president of the Federal Wind Energy Association. Municipal utility companies plan to boost their share of electricity production from a tenth to at least a fifth by 2020. More than 100 municipalities want to be “100% renewable”. http://www.economist.com/node/21559667

#31 Chimera

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 02:43 AM

Some cultural differences make this more viable for Germans than for us in the US. (based on the anecdotal evidence from my observations after living there 6 years)
1: your 30+ cubic ft refrigerator.. Usually Germans don't go get groceries once a week. They tend to go every day. Some people don't even keep a freezer.
2: air conditioning. Kinda pointless there for 11 months a year.
3: heating. I don't think I saw a forced air heating system the whole time I was there. Hot water radiators. They tend to run through several homes from a community boiler room.
4: 220V electrical system doesn't lose nearly as much juice down the lines. Our 110V system is inefficient to the point of stupidity.

Lower loads on average things a little easier on the entire grid. Lower overall load = more efficiency from renewable resources.

#32 Niner National

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 10:40 AM

Some cultural differences make this more viable for Germans than for us in the US. (based on the anecdotal evidence from my observations after living there 6 years)
1: your 30+ cubic ft refrigerator.. Usually Germans don't go get groceries once a week. They tend to go every day. Some people don't even keep a freezer.
2: air conditioning. Kinda pointless there for 11 months a year.
3: heating. I don't think I saw a forced air heating system the whole time I was there. Hot water radiators. They tend to run through several homes from a community boiler room.
4: 220V electrical system doesn't lose nearly as much juice down the lines. Our 110V system is inefficient to the point of stupidity.

Lower loads on average things a little easier on the entire grid. Lower overall load = more efficiency from renewable resources.

This is all very true, but it will change here over time as well.

Energy costs are very low here, so many people don't really give energy efficiency much consideration. If energy costs start to get in the .20/kWh range, opinions will change very quickly.

When I first moved to Maryland the electricity rates in the summer were .17/kWh. My 1 BR apartment (740 sq feet) cost about $200/mo to power. Fortunately rates dropped a good bit after that summer and I never paid that much again. Now I'm back in Charlotte and my 3BR 1,400sq foot town home costs me about $100/mo.

I worked for a solar company in Maryland and routinely interacted with homeowners that had power bills that were $400+ per month. Bills at that level finally push people to make a change.

#33 Zod

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 11:15 AM

Murdoch heavily invested in oil sends memo to Fox News on how solar wont work here. Fox News watchers spoonfed info while flipping back and forth between WWF.