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Round 2: Panthers select Kawann Short

NFL Draft Carolina Panthers

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#121 Who Said What?

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 12:03 AM

The problem with the whole "shoring up the line" theory with going with another DT in the 2nd is that very few rookie DTs come in tearing it up year one. With glaring holes in the secondary and guys that could come in and be the best at their respective positions immediately as rookies still available to be drafted, this seemed extremely stubborn and foolhardy.

This is Gettleman's first year, so it's hard to go all hater on him, but if the results don't show early, this move won't bode well for his reputation with fans. Then again, if he just drafted Dwan's successor with no drop off in production in Short and a core team guy in Star, we just amassed our greatest DL ever (outside of 2003).

Summary: I'm not a fan of the move, as-is, right now, b/c of the holes we had elsewhere and the potential we had to trade back and get more picks. I also think it was extremely arrogant of Gettleman to rule out trades yesterday. If this guy turns out to be a worthy 2nd round pick, we will be forever thankful to Gettleman. Time will tell so I'm reserving final judgement, but I'm skeptical while still holding out hope he got it right. After Hurney, there is one thing I don't have much patience for, and that is front office personnel who refuse to adapt or adjust on the fly.

Again, I hope he's right.


Very few defensive backs come in and tear it up in year one. Patrick Peterson, Kenny Phillips, Dre Kirkpatrick, Leon Hall, Prince A, and Malcolm Jenkins played looked terrible just to name a few. I thought Panther's fans were tired of Hurney trading our picks away.

There are zero players in the mid-rounds of this draft worth mortgaging future picks over. Being too rigid is one thing, and following a winning blue-print is another. We have to solidify our interior defensive line.

We had numerous games in hand that our defense lost for us, and yes a big part of that was the terrible run defense. During the Giants game, we could not get off of the field because they were gashing our DTs. This helps solidify a glaring need. Its apples and oranges. To me, defensive tackle was way more of an issue than defensive back. Our GM was right on this one as we have one plus thirty DT on a one year rental. Now we have two rookies who were extremely productive in college. What is so bad about that?

#122 Toundra

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 12:06 AM

With Short and Star, their (nfcs) road to the Superbowl is now closed, our is wide open.

#123 R0CKnR0LLA

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 12:06 AM

Really if there ever was a draft to double up at DT it's this one.

#124 The Golden Child

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 12:09 AM

I was surprised with the pick. Gettleman is planing on having a devastating DL.

#125 Proudiddy

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 12:17 AM

Very few defensive backs come in and tear it up in year one. Patrick Peterson, Kenny Phillips, Dre Kirkpatrick, Leon Hall, Prince A, and Malcolm Jenkins played looked terrible just to name a few. I thought Panther's fans were tired of Hurney trading our picks away.

There are zero players in the mid-rounds of this draft worth mortgaging future picks over. Being too rigid is one thing, and following a winning blue-print is another. We have to solidify our interior defensive line.

We had numerous games in hand that our defense lost for us, and yes a big part of that was the terrible run defense. During the Giants game, we could not get off of the field because they were gashing our DTs. This helps solidify a glaring need. Its apples and oranges. To me, defensive tackle was way more of an issue than defensive back. Our GM was right on this one as we have one plus thirty DT on a one year rental. Now we have two rookies who were extremely productive in college. What is so bad about that?

Perhaps I should have said 'it has to grow on me.' It hasn't sat well with me initially, but I hope I conveyed in my original post that it's possible that we just assembled our best DL ever wih these two picks. If that is the case, the bargain bin shopping we did for DBs in FA may prove to be genius.

To be clear though, I was suggesting to trade back so we could acquire more picks, not give any futures away. Gettleman basically said he would not trade after we drafted Star. And while it's possible we just completely plugged the middle up, freed our LBs to run like mad, and just shortened opposing QBs time standing in the pocket by seconds at a time, I'm still troubled by our patchwork secondary... That was my concern. If this assembly of talent on the DL pans out though, it could negate the need for huge talent in the secondary.

#126 Catalyst

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 12:26 AM

Remember the last time we took a guy they described as having 1st round ability, but there were motor concerns?

Yeah, Greg Hardy says hello.

#127 The Golden Child

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 12:30 AM

Remember the last time we took a guy they described as having 1st round ability, but there were motor concerns?

Yeah, Greg Hardy says hello.


thumbs up

#128 Goondal

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 01:10 AM

I love the pick. The guys I wanted (Cyprien and Banks) were gone so this is great. He is a strong pass rusher which makes him the perfect complement to Star. I know a lot of people wanted a WR but give me guys in the trenches. We have great DE. We now potentially have great DT. LB is clearly a strength. You win in the trenches, you win the game. Gettleman knows this. Everybody loved him a few hours ago, let us give him a chance.

Nobody will confuse our DBs with a group of All-Pros but I think that our Secondary will get a lot better this year simply because our DL is better. RG still needs to be addressed but I like the way things are going.

#129 The Golden Child

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 01:16 AM

Yeah, once Cyprien and Banks were gone DT was a terrific choice.

#130 JawnyBlaze

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 02:19 AM

When Cyprien went with the 1st and Hunter went with the 2nd pick today I had a feeling our pick today would throw me for a loop. I REALLY wanted Hunter, but by the time our pick came the only guys left I wanted were Allen, Rambo and Warford. Allen fell quite far, so there must be more concern about his knee and speed than originally thought, so I'm not mad we didn't get him. Rambo is still available and we might be able to get him in the 4th, so I'm not mad we didn't take him. Warford would have also been a great pick, but positional value DT>OG, so I don't mind we went with the value.

#131 FirstRoundPick

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 06:11 AM

Very few defensive backs come in and tear it up in year one. Patrick Peterson, Kenny Phillips, Dre Kirkpatrick, Leon Hall, Prince A, and Malcolm Jenkins played looked terrible just to name a few. I thought Panther's fans were tired of Hurney trading our picks away.

There are zero players in the mid-rounds of this draft worth mortgaging future picks over. Being too rigid is one thing, and following a winning blue-print is another. We have to solidify our interior defensive line.

We had numerous games in hand that our defense lost for us, and yes a big part of that was the terrible run defense. During the Giants game, we could not get off of the field because they were gashing our DTs. This helps solidify a glaring need. Its apples and oranges. To me, defensive tackle was way more of an issue than defensive back. Our GM was right on this one as we have one plus thirty DT on a one year rental. Now we have two rookies who were extremely productive in college. What is so bad about that?


I feel like I have to say I like the pick, or some asshat will quote me saying "why I know like Gettlemen". But your year 1 argument is one that Panther fans have used against DT, WR, and QB until Cam for years and is not valid. If you have a hole at one of those positions one year and ignore it, there is a really good chance it will be a hole the next year. If you think that reason validates not to draft that position, and keep doing it, you get DT play that the Panthers had over the last 7 years. Possible infinite loop of bad position X play until you beat the odds and get lucky on a low pick, or get a FA. If a player is great at one of those positions, typically they don't hit the market, but when they do there is a lot of competition for them.

Totally agree about getting gashed by the run.

#132 Zod

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 06:17 AM

The team has been severely neglected in the DT position for years in the draft.


This was a way of ripping the band aid off quickly


Love it.

#133 4Corners

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 06:34 AM

Terrible pick.

#134 AceBoogie

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 06:43 AM

Cam has to be a little pissed off, they have done very little to help him.



Don't worry I'm with you. Since Ron Rivera came to the team, outside of Cam very little has been done to improve the offensive side of the ball. Hixon was just a swap for Murphy and Ginn has been a bust. Even when healthy our oline was a joke last year. At this point we needed oline and secondary help more than another DT.

#135 Creep59

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 06:45 AM

What scares me most is that we haven't responded to the developing events to the draft. We decided what we wanted and completely ignored the reality changing around us. Short was clearly the choice before the draft even started, and nothing changed that. That's worrisome with the level of great talent at immediate news. What's more scary is Gettleman's confidence in our corners. The giddy with which he spoke about aging, average Drayton Florence now seems a lit scarier in hindsight.. You can throw out tired cliches about not needing talented players in your secondary because of your dline, but unfortunately, those cliches don't win football games. Talented players do, and the Panthers have the worst secondary in the league by a very, very, big mile.

Gettleman came out and made a point that we wouldn't be trading back into today's round. Not only is that worrisome how definitively he said that... It really, really speaks to the fact that he has no interest in playing for this season. When you make a stubborn decision to stick closely to your board and not respond to the changing events in the draft, you are forced to make such decisions with more thought.


I hear you - Im not ready to jump off a cliff yet, but at this point in the draft I am concerned - we have done nothing to help our sketchy o line nor our mediocre and old wr core. I am less concerned with our d secondary. I said it before - Cam isnt superman in real life- he needs help to reach his potential and he has gotten almost nothing from this team since he was drafted .



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