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What positions are the Saints supposedly lacking in 3-4?


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#25 Keep Pounding

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 05:03 PM

Big A, ranked the OL yall played and rank the OL we played.

 

Also your DEF looked horrible in the open field vs a quality OL. The positive your 1st team DEF allowed only one TD and 3 FG's, in the 1st half. (that still equates to 32 points in a full game), I know I know its preseason. 

 

I do think that your DEF will be better,  but I would say finishing 3rd best in the DIV is yall ceiling, injuries, new system and who is on yall schedule will cause Rob Ryan to lose his hair.

 

But I still see you guys making some noise, Brees is that good.  He only needs the DEF to improve slightly to win a few more games compared to last year, BUT......... Our DIV plays tougher teams then we did last year.

 

 



#26 Big A

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 05:06 PM

so the bench from the worst defense in nfl history is being promoted to the starting ranks & you're happy about that? that makes 2 of us. You sure your a saints fan?

Sent from my ADR910L using CarolinaHuddle mobile app

By bench I think you mean guys that started part time and were full time starters by end of year? Lets look at the last game of season against those mighty Panthers an see who played their best against them:

Wait how can that horrible NT Bunkley grade so well when we obviously need 83rd ranked FUA (according to rocknrolla)? How are 3 of top 4 grades from these horrible bench players against the unstoppable Panthers!? Stupid stats, when will they understand what panther fans say trumps any actual statistical data and becomes fact!?

1238733_207866299375522_595425269_n.jpg

On look who's worst graded, Will Smith again. Wonder how he ended up worst graded player on Saints for entire season when according to Panthers fans he the best defensive player?

#27 Big A

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 05:21 PM

Big A, ranked the OL yall played and rank the OL we played.

Also your DEF looked horrible in the open field vs a quality OL. The positive your 1st team DEF allowed only one TD and 3 FG's, in the 1st half. (that still equates to 32 points in a full game), I know I know its preseason.

I do think that your DEF will be better, but I would say finishing 3rd best in the DIV is yall ceiling, injuries, new system and who is on yall schedule will cause Rob Ryan to lose his hair.

But I still see you guys making some noise, Brees is that good. He only needs the DEF to improve slightly to win a few more games compared to last year, BUT......... Our DIV plays tougher teams then we did last year.


Oline ranks:

Saints Preseason Opponents Oline AVG 17th
23rd Raiders
22nd Dolphins
12th KC
10th Texans

Panthers Preseason Opponents Oline AVG 23rd
30th Bears
25th Steelers
19th Eagles
17th Ravens

https://www.profootb...ensive-lines/3/


So you're saying the fact the Saints defense put up more sacks and a lot more QB pressures than Panthers this preseason had something to do with them facing an average Oline rank of 17th while Panthers faced much easier Olines averaging 23rd. Great point, imagine if they had faced the easier Oline Panthers face how many more sacks and pressures they would have racked up!

#28 PhillyB

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 05:36 PM

heeeeeeeeeeeere chubby chubby chubby



#29 Mother Grabber

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 05:39 PM

what part of 'WORST DEFENSE IN NFL HISTORY' are you having trouble understanding?



#30 Big A

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 05:40 PM

Another fact that may be overlooked is the fact Ryan is a pressure type defense with lots of blitzes just like GW with blitzing anywhere from 45% to 60% of the plays. In this preseason, the Saint D ran 17 blitzes total! That's 3, 5, 6, and 3 blitz plays in each of the 4 games for a blitz rate around 7%.

So basically a defense that is built around blitzing more than half of the time spend 93% of the snaps sitting back and playing in base packages. That's basically the defense Spags tried to implement last year that failed, yet they did pretty well this preseason and should be much better with more blitzing.

#31 Big A

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 05:47 PM

what part of 'WORST DEFENSE IN NFL HISTORY' are you having trouble understanding?


What part of "THIS IS 2013, not 2012!" are you having trouble with? If you believe a team with 50 % different players on defense and a new coordinator with an actual HC will remain unchanged, then how about the Panthers that are under all same coaches and 85% the same team as the sub .500 2012 team. Do they make 5 or 6 win this year?

#32 Keep Pounding

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 05:48 PM

Oline ranks:

Saints Preseason Opponents Oline AVG 17th
23rd Raiders
22nd Dolphins
12th KC
10th Texans

Panthers Preseason Opponents Oline AVG 23rd
30th Bears
25th Steelers
19th Eagles
17th Ravens

https://www.profootb...ensive-lines/3/


So you're saying the fact the Saints defense put up more sacks and a lot more QB pressures than Panthers this preseason had something to do with them facing an average Oline rank of 17th while Panthers faced much easier Olines averaging 23rd. Great point, imagine if they had faced the easier Oline Panthers face how many more sacks and pressures they would have racked up!

 

I'm not saying anything really, 

 

I asked you about the OL rankings, I said your DEF looked horrible vs the Texans ( but seemed to tighten up in the redzone, but still gave up 16 points in the 1st half, then I said the Saints DEF would only have to improve slightly to win some more games, then I said we play tougher DIV this year 
IMO



#33 Big A

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 06:00 PM

I'm not saying anything really,

I asked you about the OL rankings, I said your DEF looked horrible vs the Texans ( but seemed to tighten up in the redzone, but still gave up 16 points in the 1st half, then I said the Saints DEF would only have to improve slightly to win some more games, then I said we play tougher DIV this year
IMO


I was half messing with you since you actually usually pretty fair in you're posting. Not sure if you realized it, but Saints pulled their defensive starters after first two series, while Texans 1st offense played till 3rd qtr. If you look at snap counts, our defensive starters played 17-23 snaps, while Texan offense played 42 snaps including Schaub. When you consider Texans are supposed to be one of the best offenses in the league and our defensive backups didn't get run over and held them to some FGs with just 6 blitzes the entire game, that's not too bad. Vacarro did play exactly the same 42 snaps as Schaub, but he is not a starter in base package, I think he will start in nickel.

#34 Keep Pounding

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 06:22 PM

I was half messing with you since you actually usually pretty fair in you're posting. Not sure if you realized it, but Saints pulled their defensive starters after first two series, while Texans 1st offense played till 3rd qtr. If you look at snap counts, our defensive starters played 17-23 snaps, while Texan offense played 42 snaps including Schaub. When you consider Texans are supposed to be one of the best offenses in the league and our defensive backups didn't get run over and held them to some FGs with just 6 blitzes the entire game, that's not too bad. Vacarro did play exactly the same 42 snaps as Schaub, but he is not a starter in base package, I think he will start in nickel.

 

Oh okay, You forgot to use your sarcasm font.

 

How have you been though?



#35 Big A

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 06:45 PM

Oh okay, You forgot to use your sarcasm font.

How have you been though?


Ready for some football! Got my tickets for opener against Falcons and starting 1-0 with a win over Failcons is just what we need to forget 2012. Also, the Ryan "get the f off my field" crap makes me dislike him even more.

I actually didn't start this thread to claim Saints have this great defense, I was actually curious about the missing personnel issue people keep bringing up. While I agree we have young guys with not a lot of experience starting in some places, they have shown to be solid in the time they played. I think there is a big difference between having a few guys with little experience and "not having the personnel for 3-4". It's actually pretty amazing some of the UDFA talent the Saints found this preseason, it's like 6 guys on defense. Check out Glenn Foster just to name one.

At the end of the day, nobody knows how the season will turn out and Saints defense may be bad again. Luckily the team can still go far without a great defense so it doesn't need to be great. Also, something you heard over and over last year in weekly interviews when asked what was different without Payton was they said less yelling and nobody was getting pulled aside. It seems Spags didn't have the full respect of team and Payton wasn't there to hold people accountable and you noticed the difference even after the first preseason game this year.

I guess as fans all you can do is hope for the best and prepare for the worst. Kinda the same with Panthers, if offense doesn't play well this can be a 0.500 game again, yet if both sides play consistently well like they did against Saints and Falcons last year, sky's the limit, well the sky just beneath the Saints that is, lol.

#36 L-TownCat

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Posted 02 September 2013 - 08:24 PM

In Rob's near decade of running defenses, he has fielded just 1 top 10 unit. 1 unit. This was the Raiders of 06. That's 7 years since of switching team to team, failing to do the one thing he's paid to do, produce a good defensive unit.

This Saints Defense which was not just bad, they were historically bad. While running the 4-3 scheme the Saints were torched week after week. Now implementing the 3-4 scheme the Saints have brought in the "other Ryan" to lead this group while pilfering dominant players from the powerhouse teams like Dallas to attempt this switch.

Injuries, age, and lack of talent are already major hurdles for this defense and the best guy you can find to help put them in the right place is Rob Ryan? I mean at least you have Payton for the Offense.

There is literally nothing you can glean from the past 7 months that should make you feel any better about your defense. I will make a small exception for your rookie Safety but he's a rookie, you won't know till he hits the field if he's gonna be Mark Barron or Darren Sharper.

The best thing to do is wait till after Roddy White Julio Jones and Steven Jackson get done raping that defense then draw your conclusions from that.