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Are Cam and Rivera adjoined at the hip?


Best Answer DRSundrop, 21 September 2013 - 10:40 AM

I think the message the OP is trying to convey is that Gettleman could possibly view our HC and QB as one. Perhaps the OP is insuating they are linked together as in they may not be here long but I dont think the OP is saying they ARE LINKED together and should GO as some of you are flaming him for.

 

First off, I'm completely for the Carolina Panthers not any one individual on the team. I think Cam is an exceptional QB that is inevitably linked to Rivera but I'm certain Gettleman has the knowledge to assign fault for this teams failures and shortcomings and understands that Newton can be successful in this league.

 

The best comment or question I've seen on our offensive woes was the other day and I don't know who said it so I'm not sure who to give credit to but someone asked "Would you put Manning in a read option offense? ..So why you keep Cam in the pocket?"

 

The main trouble here is that we don't know the root of the problems because we as a fanbase are kept in the dark about the inner workings of this team and can only speculate.

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#101 Navy_football

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 03:58 PM

I now see the light.  Thank you.

 

"Ten of the 12 teams in the playoffs this year had true pocket passers," Gettleman said. "At the end of the day, the quarterback has to make plays from the pocket. I think the read option is an option. But at the end of the day, your quarterback has got to make plays from the pocket, and if he can't, you're going to struggle."

 

Hmmm.  Gettlemen is just giving his opinion....

 

Just a question... How many QBs in the league were not true pocket passers last year? So what percentage of "not true pocket passers" were in the playoffs?

 

Give Cam a coach that knows how to maxmize an offense, and he'll be in the playoffs too - from the pocket or anywhere else.



#102 teeray

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 04:02 PM

I am not throwing Cam to the wolves--my initial comment was that Gettlemen may decide, depending on who he hires as the next coach, that Cam is not a good fit. Cam could eliminate that conjecture with improved play, and I am not seeing the development I hoped for.

Gettlemen would not move Cam unless he was presented with a sweet deal. Gettlemen might like a QB in the draft or a coach who prefers a different-style qb. If he decides to keep Cam, and he probably will, it may impact his decisions.

I see Cam's tremendous ability. I simply would like to know--and nobody actually knows---what needs to be done to make him elite. I am pretty sure an OL and a few stud WRs would make him better, but how much better?

Gettlemen has to make a decision in a year or two, and that decision will define his career. Do you give Cam $120 million if you are not sure about his talent? We are not looking at it from that perspective. I want Cam to make that an easy decision. If Gmen had to make it right now, I think it could go either way. It is simply something worth discussing if people are interested in exploring what could be going on behind the scenes. Suggesting it does not make me a hater (not suggesting you think so) but a person who is interested in the decision-making process that they face.

That is why I am upset that Cam was not given weapons or protection this year. We may have to wait until 2014 to see how good he can actually be--

All I will say is that if we did move Cam Newton or decided to move on from Cam Newton after three years or even four years it would be the worst decision in the history of the Panthers franchise.

And that is saying a lot with the decisions we have made.

#103 mwright350

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 04:18 PM

Man did they put something in the water in Charlotte that made people suddenly decide this franchise is going to move on from a QB who in spite of (bad mechanics, poor accuracy, a fake smile, being a dick, being an alien, being a terrible passer, fuging someone's girlfriend, personally stealing the last beer in your fridge, whatever else you want to accuse him of) set a ton of records his first two years in the NFL with what can only be described as an awful cast around him?

 

Moving on from Cam before some work is given to the offensive unit around him would be one of the worst decisions we could make, no matter what the message-board superstars (clearly NFL coaches and GMs in hiding on the Huddle) say to the contrary.  All QBs have issues, even the top 2 or 3 in the league have their shortcomings.  We have a young QB with an astronomical ceiling and a staff that is either unwilling or unable to build an offense around him.  

 

We may one day move on from Cam but I can almost assure you it will not be until after the current regime is gone.



#104 Mike

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 04:22 PM

The only way this team gets rid of Cam Newton is in one of two scenarios: 

 

1. He doesn't sign a new contract. 

 

2. Some team this season or next off season offers a deal that is too good to turn down. For me, the deal the Redskins gave the Rams in order to draft RIII - i.e. 3 x first round picks and a second round pick - would be the least that Gettleman should get in return for a QB of Cam's ability. 

 

Personally, though, I can't see any new head coach wanting to get rid of Cam Newton as his QB. Cam has made a big impact on the league so far. He's thrown for over 8,000 yards, 43 TDs, and a 1,500 rushing yards and 22 TDs. I don't know many QBs that can account for 65 TDs over their first 34 games in the league except for Dan Marino. So personally I can't see any head coach or general manager wanting to get rid of a QB with the ability and sheer potential of Cam Newton. 

 

Cam might have his flaws, but when he gets a better supporting cast, and improves his all round game, then he could be the type of guy that could lead this team back to the Super Bowl [and hopefully this time win it!]. 

 



#105 MHS831

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 04:29 PM

It's kind of hard being a pocket passer when your sacked 6x hit 12 and pressured all games.

 

I don't know any pocket passer who thrives in that situation.
 

 

I agree-one of my points was that we will never know what we have until we surround him with weapons and protection.  However, from Gettlemen''s perspective, which is what I offered, he (apparently) thinks Cam has the weapons and protection---chicken or egg kinda thing.



#106 carolinarolls

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 04:33 PM

Everyone talks about the "#2 receiver"

I did not know there were any 9-foot free agents out there.

That's what it looks like we would need.

#107 MHS831

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 04:44 PM

I don't see anything there about moving on from Cam.

First order of business if our GM wants this offense to be successful is to fix this shitty o line. That hasn't happened.

 

I agree, but I was not offering my opinion, something conveniently missed here.  I was offering Gettlemen's.  Let's look at it from his--not your's, not mine, based on what we know:

 

1. Gettlemen has cash but has not brought in much on the OL....He said they need to develop chemistry and that takes time.  You think he needs to do more, I think he needs to do more--but Gettlemen seems to disagree with us.

 

2. Gettlemen has cash and brought in 2 borderline WRs. There have not been rumors of a trade or a free agent signing, as there were with Wharton and Mikell.  I want a stud WR to add to the mix, you want a stud WR to add to the mix.  Gettlemen has not seemed too interested.   It matters not what we think.

 

3. Gettlemen told Cam that it is time to Win---not 2014---now.  That is the bottom line. 

 

4.  Cam has been more of a pocket passer during the first 2 games.  He has had pressure, but when he has not, he has been indecisive and his accuracy is off.   Gettlemen does not care about Cam '11 or '12.  He wants to see what Cam '13 is going to do.  Cam has displayed some things that make intelligent football experts question his ability to be that QB-that is a common opinion.  He flashes and has great plays, but some defenses are able to shut him down.  He seems confused and frustrated by them.  The fact that Gettlemen thinks pocket passers are the way to go and the fact that Shula has Cam in the pocket is not a coincidence.  This could be Cam's audition for the Gettlemen blueprint.  Are the W's rolling in?  Has he been effective in the pocket?  After 2 games, I would say "no." 

 

5.  Gettlemen has been true to his core, and one of his philosophical foundations is that pocket passing QBs are the winners.  If Cam is struggling in the pocket and the Panthers are losing, I wonder what Gettlemen would think?  Give Cam $20 million per season for the next 5 year? 

 

That does not sound like a 5-year, $110 m extension to me.  It does not mean that Cam is gone either--it means what I said--there is room for speculation. Cam will have to improve, in my opinion, to get a big deal from Gettlemen.  As it stands now, I am not sure he is the future.  I don't care what Richardson said after 16 games.   I am pretty sure you didn't read this far.



#108 MHS831

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 04:54 PM

All I will say is that if we did move Cam Newton or decided to move on from Cam Newton after three years or even four years it would be the worst decision in the history of the Panthers franchise.

And that is saying a lot with the decisions we have made.

 

I think that Cam will be dealt if he cannot become the pocket passer Gettlemen wants-and that could be a mistake.  I think you could be 100% correct, but I also think, in the wrong system, giving Cam $120 million could be equally as tragic. 

 

For Cam to be great, he needs weapons, protection, and the option to run.  I am not sure Gettlemen sees football that way--he sees them multi-threat QBs as gimmicks.  I could be wrong, but we all have to piece it together.
 

Cam is not being handled right at the moment, if you ask me.  If Gettlemen bases a decision on a player with no protection, weapons, and coaching--dealing Cam could be the lowest point--like when the Steelers sent Unitas to Baltimore.  You remember that, don't you?  :) 

 

I



#109 MHS831

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 04:56 PM

Just a question... How many QBs in the league were not true pocket passers last year? So what percentage of "not true pocket passers" were in the playoffs?

 

Give Cam a coach that knows how to maxmize an offense, and he'll be in the playoffs too - from the pocket or anywhere else.

 

Gettlemen answers your question in the quote I posted.

 

I agree with the second statement.  I wonder if Gettlemen does.



#110 TheRed

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Posted 21 September 2013 - 04:59 PM

I agree, but I was not offering my opinion, something conveniently missed here.  I was offering Gettlemen's.  Let's look at it from his--not your's, not mine, based on what we know:

 

1. Gettlemen has cash but has not brought in much on the OL....He said they need to develop chemistry and that takes time.  You think he needs to do more, I think he needs to do more--but Gettlemen seems to disagree with us.

 

2. Gettlemen has cash and brought in 2 borderline WRs. There have not been rumors of a trade or a free agent signing, as there were with Wharton and Mikell.  I want a stud WR to add to the mix, you want a stud WR to add to the mix.  Gettlemen has not seemed too interested.   It matters not what we think.

 

3. Gettlemen told Cam that it is time to Win---not 2014---now.  That is the bottom line. 

 

4.  Cam has been more of a pocket passer during the first 2 games.  He has had pressure, but when he has not, he has been indecisive and his accuracy is off.   Gettlemen does not care about Cam '11 or '12.  He wants to see what Cam '13 is going to do.  Cam has displayed some things that make intelligent football experts question his ability to be that QB-that is a common opinion.  He flashes and has great plays, but some defenses are able to shut him down.  He seems confused and frustrated by them.  The fact that Gettlemen thinks pocket passers are the way to go and the fact that Shula has Cam in the pocket is not a coincidence.  This could be Cam's audition for the Gettlemen blueprint.  Are the W's rolling in?  Has he been effective in the pocket?  After 2 games, I would say "no." 

 

5.  Gettlemen has been true to his core, and one of his philosophical foundations is that pocket passing QBs are the winners.  If Cam is struggling in the pocket and the Panthers are losing, I wonder what Gettlemen would think?  Give Cam $20 million per season for the next 5 year? 

 

That does not sound like a 5-year, $110 m extension to me.  It does not mean that Cam is gone either--it means what I said--there is room for speculation. Cam will have to improve, in my opinion, to get a big deal from Gettlemen.  As it stands now, I am not sure he is the future.  I don't care what Richardson said after 16 games.   I am pretty sure you didn't read this far.

 

When I first heard his comments about Cam "winning", I was taken aback a bit until I read it in the context that it was conveniently taken out of. If you are going to present that quote it is important to do so in it's entirety.

 

I very much like that we brought in Ginn, who at this point is outplaying Lafell.

 

As for Hixon, I had high hopes, but I'm not sure he will ever be a viable healthy weapon for us this season. It kind of disappoints me because Gettleman knew of his injury history from his days working for the Giants.

 

On this "pocket passer" talk. If that's what we have planned, shoehorning Cam into an offense that doesn't fit him, then not only are we wasting our time, we are wasting his. I seriously hope that isn't what our GM is doing.

 

If this franchise is dumb enough to move on from a talent like Cam, without giving him the benefit of playing in a system that fits his strengths, or giving him a chance with a competent staff. That may be my breaking point.

 

I've tolerated the lame duck season in 2010, we're doing it again just three years later. I won't tolerate much more. I hope that JR and Gettleman are not that shortsighted to make a disastrous mistake. Time will tell.




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