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Affordable Care Act


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#31 cookinwithgas

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 01:22 PM

If I go to work for a company the first thing I want to know about is what kind of benefits they offer. Having a decent health insurance plan is probably more important to people looking for stable long term jobs that just gross pay by itself. When I was a contractor I made a lot more cash so I bought a good plan. When I was hired on I made less money but got a less expensive, better, insurance package for my family. It's all in how you market it.

#32 SmokinwithWilly

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 01:27 PM

There are definitely other options out there. The original question was about the ACA so that's what I used. I still consider 50 a small business relatively speaking. I like to think that some day I will be able to franchise and be in multiple cities. I would hope that I will be able to provide insurance for my employees. Right now, that's not possible, I'm still too small. I will get to that point and when I do, I will make sure my people are taken care of. Thanks for your insight though, it gives me another perspective to look at. 



#33 Panthers_Lover

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 01:54 PM

Ok that's informative.  First though, I wouldn't call that a small business, honestly.  97% of all businesses in the country have less than 50 employees.    If it pans out like that, I guess it's a decision of maybe reinvesting a bit less for more of a salary.  Could it be possible that it's cheaper to offer some kind of insurance plans though?  I'm not sure how much that would cost but some are less than others and as long as they meet the requirements you'd be ok.  Plus it could give you a competitive advantage versus those companies with less workers that aren't offering plans.  

 

Or maybe talk with your employees about how they feel, maybe pay cuts to get a plan in there, etc.  Most companies wouldn't do that but sometimes if you just throw the truth out there, and say you'd like to reinvest in the company (which is better for everyone) and this is where it all stands, people are usually more receptive with the truth.

 

Just FYI, the Small Business Administration defines "small business" as:

 

SBA defines a small business concern as one that is independently owned and operated, is organized for profit, and is not dominant in its field. Depending on the industry, size standard eligibility is based on the average number of employees for the preceding twelve months or on sales volume averaged over a three-year period. Examples of SBA general size standards include the following:

  •     Manufacturing: Maximum number of employees may range from 500 to 1500, depending on the type of product manufactured;
  •    Wholesaling: Maximum number of employees may range from 100 to 500 depending on the particular product being provided;
  •     Services: Annual receipts may not exceed $2.5 to $21.5 million, depending on the particular service being provided;
  •     Retailing: Annual receipts may not exceed $5.0 to $21.0 million, depending on the particular product being provided;
  •     General and Heavy Construction: General construction annual receipts may not exceed $13.5 to $17 million, depending on the type of construction;
  •     Special Trade Construction: Annual receipts may not exceed $7 million; and
  •     Agriculture: Annual receipts may not exceed $0.5 to $9.0 million, depending on the agricultural product.


#34 carpantherfan84

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 02:35 PM

 

Just FYI, the Small Business Administration defines "small business" as:

 

SBA defines a small business concern as one that is independently owned and operated, is organized for profit, and is not dominant in its field. Depending on the industry, size standard eligibility is based on the average number of employees for the preceding twelve months or on sales volume averaged over a three-year period. Examples of SBA general size standards include the following:

  •     Manufacturing: Maximum number of employees may range from 500 to 1500, depending on the type of product manufactured;
  •    Wholesaling: Maximum number of employees may range from 100 to 500 depending on the particular product being provided;
  •     Services: Annual receipts may not exceed $2.5 to $21.5 million, depending on the particular service being provided;
  •     Retailing: Annual receipts may not exceed $5.0 to $21.0 million, depending on the particular product being provided;
  •     General and Heavy Construction: General construction annual receipts may not exceed $13.5 to $17 million, depending on the type of construction;
  •     Special Trade Construction: Annual receipts may not exceed $7 million; and
  •     Agriculture: Annual receipts may not exceed $0.5 to $9.0 million, depending on the agricultural product.

 

that is why there is a serious disconnect between what the public feels about corporations and what the corporations feel about themselves.

 

Most everyday people would not consider 500 employees a small-time operation regardless of what they are doing. Because of this, they have no sympathy for the business owners of companies like that and will never side with them in political debate.



#35 Happy Panther

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 04:14 PM

 

http://www.paulcraig...acare-a-primer/

 

Read.

 

When Republicans for ideological reasons blocked a single-payer health system like the rest of the developed world has and, indeed, even some developing countries have, the Obama regime, needing a victory, went to the insurance companies and told them to come up with a health care plan that the insurance lobby could get passed by Congress. Obamacare was written by the private insurance industry with the goal of raising its profits with 50 million mandated new customers. 
 
Obamacare works for the insurance companies, but not for the uninsured. The cost of using Obamacare is prohibitive for those who most need the health coverage. The cost of the premiums net of the government subsidy is large. It amounts to a substantial pay cut for people struggling to pay their bills. In addition to the premium cost, it is prohibitive for hard pressed Americans to use the policies because of the deductibles and co-pays. For the very poor, who are thrown into Medicaid systems, any assets they might have, such as a home, are subject to confiscation to cover their Medicaid bills. The only people other than the insurance companies who benefit from Obamacare are the down and out who are devoid of all assets. 
 
The whole point here, that everyone wants to miss because they are to busy playing party cheerleader, isn't whether the government can afford this program or not, it's that the American citizenry is getting fuged by capitalistic greed. The government can afford the costs of the program and all these bullshit scripted budget hostage crap is nothing but political posturing over votes and other extraneous nonsense. No one in government cares about what this plan is really about - squeezing every last bit of money from a populace who's median income hasn't risen in 25 fuging years. The entire argument is "Ohhh nooooo, we can't increase the deficit!!!!" rather than "Ohh no, this is bad for the average citizen!!!" or "This is nothing but a corporate Healthcare and Insurance sellout!!!!"

 

 

All the people I am talking to in the industry are not looking for profits to go up but rather are worried that the restrictions on loss ratios and rate increases will hurt them significantly. This is why all the big players (Aetna, Humana and many others) are opting out of the exchanges.

 

The restrictions on how the companies can rate risks is very handcuffing.



#36 Firefox

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 04:36 PM

 

 



#37 Squirrel

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 05:35 PM

I agree but for now at least the ACA is expanding access. But if things keep going where they are going I don't see the middle class(or the former middle class) taking much more of it. The rich get richer and poor get poorer. Minimum wage has become garbage. We just physically can't keep at it forever. If you have ever read the Communist Manifesto it eerily and hauntingly foreshadows this. Not saying that we will overthrow the bourgeoisie and become pure communist but there will be a breaking point. We should be more of a social capitol gov't then what we are now with what is overrun with greed. We should have free health care. We have the right to life and to pursue happiness means to have a healthy life. Health is more than a product. It is something more innately moral than auto insurance or the alike. Some will gladly preach that the life of a fetus is special and human, yet the uninsured are SOL.
 

 

 

Very god point and I applaud you for getting to where you are in the business.  So you don't grow anymore for now.  Say down the road what would be the threshold that would make you cross 50? Say you get a contract that required you to hire 10?20? people that would cover ACA and keep the profits rolling in?  Once you crossed that threshold you could grow the company to 100-200 and make more money. 

 

Point I was trying to make earlier was you would have more small business owners popping up now as like you said 50 is a big hurdle for you.  You even pointed out you get $300k a year which I am sure you deserve (seriously) the stress of running a business and having <50 people looking up to you for leadership can be stressing. 

 

If you don't grow above 50 then another company could be started and that owner would be making $300k or some salary like that which spreads the wealth to more people.  If the supply and demand calls for it. 



#38 SmokinwithWilly

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 05:36 PM

I think the small business term is all about perspective. In a small town with 20k people, employing 50 may make you one of the largest in the town. Having a business with 50 employees in a place like LA or NYC and you are a fly on somebody else's wall. Look at your big box retailers. They have thousands of employees nationwide. I would think a non chain grocery store would employ more than 50 people and I consider that individual store a small business. With so many businesses now being on a national and even international level, I can tell you that I feel like a very tiny fish in one very big pond. Again, I think the small business term is very relative to the industry you are in and where you are located.



#39 Goondal

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 05:36 PM

I do not have health insurance because I cannot afford it.  My job pays for half but the other half is out of my price range.  I also cannot afford to get it through the exchanges as the cheapest plan has virtually the same premium and cannot get subsidies since I was told that the insurance through my job is affordable even though I cannot afford it.  If I lived somewhere else in the country with a lower cost of living and made the same amount of money then it is possible that I could afford it, of course if I lived in one of those places then I would be making less than I do now.

 

I am sure that this law does help some people, but at this point I am not one of them.  The fact that I am going to be fined for not purchasing something that I cannot afford seems silly to me.  I guess I could do what Congress does and simply borrow.  At least the fine is small the first year and I should be in a position to get 100% coverage through my job by next fall but I cannot be the only person stuck in the middle like this.  There has to be a better way of determining what someone can and cannot afford than whatever they are doing.



#40 Squirrel

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 05:43 PM

I think the small business term is all about perspective. In a small town with 20k people, employing 50 may make you one of the largest in the town. Having a business with 50 employees in a place like LA or NYC and you are a fly on somebody else's wall. Look at your big box retailers. They have thousands of employees nationwide. I would think a non chain grocery store would employ more than 50 people and I consider that individual store a small business. With so many businesses now being on a national and even international level, I can tell you that I feel like a very tiny fish in one very big pond. Again, I think the small business term is very relative to the industry you are in and where you are located.

 

 

Which brings up another point.  Usually the biggest employer in a community is the local hospital.  How will ACA effect them? 



#41 SmokinwithWilly

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 05:55 PM

Very god point and I applaud you for getting to where you are in the business.  So you don't grow anymore for now.  Say down the road what would be the threshold that would make you cross 50? Say you get a contract that required you to hire 10?20? people that would cover ACA and keep the profits rolling in?  Once you crossed that threshold you could grow the company to 100-200 and make more money. 

 

Point I was trying to make earlier was you would have more small business owners popping up now as like you said 50 is a big hurdle for you.  You even pointed out you get $300k a year which I am sure you deserve (seriously) the stress of running a business and having <50 people looking up to you for leadership can be stressing. 

 

If you don't grow above 50 then another company could be started and that owner would be making $300k or some salary like that which spreads the wealth to more people.  If the supply and demand calls for it.

 I don't make 300k, I was just using that breakdown as an example. I don't employ near 50 either. Down the road there may be a point that I get offered a contract that would make me exceed the limit. This year there was one that was pretty close to pushing me there but I felt it was too much growth too fast and I didn't want to put my employees into a bad situation when the ACA rolled out. I took a wait and see how it all unfolds approach. I don't know what the contract would have to be to get me to get in the middle of all of that. 

 

The point I was really trying to make was when growing a business there are always obstacles that have to be faced. Being required by law to obtain insurance and pay for it while your competition does not is an extremely scary reality. For some people, owning a catering truck might be their dream. Others may want to build a software consulting firm. I do landscape maintenance and installation. Each individual is different. My industry is 95% small time companies and a couple larger one. I've never been one to dream small. I guess when I get to that point where I'm actually at that threshold, I'll decide. At that point I may already be able to provide private insurance for my employees. Time will tell. 



#42 Firefox

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Posted 05 October 2013 - 05:11 PM

The U.S. Chamber of Commerce view:

 

You have to see this one for yourself. Yesterday, Senator Harry Reid took to the Senate floor to claim that the health care law “doesn’t hurts jobs at all.”

 

You can’t make it up. He actually cites a New York times article to reinforce his claim that the law doesn’t impact the job market. Read a bit further down though and the same article references our recent small business survey showing 75% of small businesses say the health care law has made it harder to hire. Direct quote: “Of those affected by the employer mandate, half said they would cut employees’ hours or replace full-time workers with part-time.”

It’s time for Harry Reid to live in the world of reality. Uncertainty from Obamacare and penalties for not providing coverage are creating a nation of part-time workers.  Last month's job report shows the lowest workforce participation rate in 35 years. Employers across the country are scaling back and battening down the hatches in anticipation for the law’s implementation.

But don’t take it from me. Below is just a sampling of recent headlines about the health care law:

 

  • The Wall Street Journal Abstracts: “Obamacare vs. Small Businesses.”
  • The Star Tribune: “Obamacare Now Begins To Reveal Itself; Expect Some Businesses To Stop Hiring And Others To Drop Health Coverage.”
  • The Baltimore Sun: “Lost Jobs, Higher Costs; Obamacare Hits Home.”
  • The Boston Herald: “Experts: Obamacare Could Hit Paycheck.”
  • The Australian Financial Review: “Exporters Reluctant To Hire Full-Timers As Obamacare Obligations Loom.”
  • The Chicago Tribune: “The Part-Timing Of America/ Obamacare Will Push Workers - Not Just Employers – To Cut Hours.”
  • The Orange County Register: “Health Law May Chill Hiring.”
  • The Kansas City Star: “Involuntary Part Time Jobs Are Growing.”
  • The Columbus Dispatch: “Unhealthy Side Effects; Employers Seek Ways To Avoid Health-Care Law’s Burdens.”
  • The Columbus Dispatch: Unintended Consequences; Thanks To Health-Care Law, Many Employees Are Seeing Hours Cut.”
  • The New York Times: “Surge In Part-Time Work.”
  • The Orlando Sentinel: “Workers’ Hours Cut – Obamacare Blamed.”
  • The Atlanta Journal-Constitution: “The Obamacare Economy: 35 Part-Time Jobs For Every New Full-Time Job.”
  • Investor’s Business Daily: “Obamacare Spurs Shift Away From 30-40 Hour Work Week.”
  • The Washington Post: “Health-Care Law Is Tied To New Caps On Work Hours For Part-Timers.”
  • WJFW News: “Obamacare Forces Trig’s To Limit Workers’ Hours.”
  • The Los Angeles Times: “Small Businesses To Cut Hours And Workers Due To Obama Health Care Law, Survey Says.”
  • The Indianapolis Star: “Health-Care Tax Plan Threatens Hoosier Jobs.”
  • The Arizona Republic: “Obama Agenda Crushing Employment.”

Instead of engaging in political theatre, we need leaders who will work to fix the most burdensome provisions of Obamacare and start focusing on free enterprise policies that remove the burdens of big government and allow our entrepreneurs and free market to grow. And those members of Congress who voted to make the health care bill law should be held accountable for their vote in 2014.

 

Rob Engstrom
SVP and National Political Director
U.S. Chamber of Commerce

 

http://www.friendsof...urt-jobs-at-all



#43 cookinwithgas

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Posted 05 October 2013 - 05:45 PM

Paying workers affects how many people businesses can hire let's do away with that job killer

#44 cookinwithgas

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Posted 05 October 2013 - 05:47 PM

What's great is that these yahoos are the one screaming about entitlements but will want to keep things in the ACA they like and don't cost anyone anything then complain about how obummer care is not paying for itself

#45 GOOGLE RON PAUL

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Posted 05 October 2013 - 10:39 PM

if we can get enough dipshit teapartiers willing to ignore the insurance lobby in favor of their dumb, fat guts, maybe they'll repeal the mandate but leave in the pre-existing conditions part and destroy the industry entirely




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