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Raymond Felton and Bobcats still not close to a deal


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#11 CarolinaPanthers8789

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Posted 16 July 2009 - 09:36 AM

Here are Felton's and Augustin's stats from last year. The rank is based on where they are with other point guards, not the entire NBA.

Raymond Felton Stats
Points Per Game- 14th
Field Goal %- 20th
Three Point %- 29th
Free Throw %- 20th
Offensive Rebounds- 12th
Offensive Rebounds Per Game- 11th
Defensive Rebounds- 4th
Defensive Rebounds Per Game- 4th
Rebounds- 7th
Rebounds Per Game- 8th
Assists- 8th
Assists Per Game- 11th
Steals- 5th
Steals Per Game- 5th
Blocks- 3rd
Blocks Per Game- 2nd
Double-Double's- 16th

D.J. Augustin Stats
Points Per Game- 18th
Field Goal %- NA
Three Point %- 3rd
Free Throw %- 5th
Offensive Rebounds- NA
Offensive Rebounds Per Game- 37th
Defensive Rebounds- 41st
Defensive Rebounds Per Game- 32nd
Rebounds- 42nd
Rebounds Per Game- 33rd
Assists- 36th
Assists Per Game- 31st
Steals- 45th
Steals Per Game- 34th
Blocks- NA
Blocks Per Game- 37th
Double-Double's- 30th

Stat wise it kind of looks like we need Felton. I have changed the color to red to the stats where the player ranks in the top ten, and blue if they are ranked in the top twenty.

NOTE: If you average his stats togethor it ranks him as the 10th best point guard in the NBA.

Edited by CarolinaPanthers8789, 16 July 2009 - 09:39 AM.


#12 carpanfan96

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Posted 16 July 2009 - 10:22 AM

Here are Felton's and Augustin's stats from last year. The rank is based on where they are with other point guards, not the entire NBA.

Raymond Felton Stats
Points Per Game- 14th
Field Goal %- 20th
Three Point %- 29th
Free Throw %- 20th
Offensive Rebounds- 12th
Offensive Rebounds Per Game- 11th
Defensive Rebounds- 4th
Defensive Rebounds Per Game- 4th
Rebounds- 7th
Rebounds Per Game- 8th
Assists- 8th
Assists Per Game- 11th
Steals- 5th
Steals Per Game- 5th
Blocks- 3rd
Blocks Per Game- 2nd
Double-Double's- 16th

D.J. Augustin Stats
Points Per Game- 18th
Field Goal %- NA
Three Point %- 3rd
Free Throw %- 5th
Offensive Rebounds- NA
Offensive Rebounds Per Game- 37th
Defensive Rebounds- 41st
Defensive Rebounds Per Game- 32nd
Rebounds- 42nd
Rebounds Per Game- 33rd
Assists- 36th
Assists Per Game- 31st
Steals- 45th
Steals Per Game- 34th
Blocks- NA
Blocks Per Game- 37th
Double-Double's- 30th

Stat wise it kind of looks like we need Felton. I have changed the color to red to the stats where the player ranks in the top ten, and blue if they are ranked in the top twenty.

NOTE: If you average his stats togethor it ranks him as the 10th best point guard in the NBA.


Those stats shown like that make Felton look like a top 15 PG, maybe even top 10. But alas I don't think he is or will ever be a top 10 PG. He's good just not that good.

#13 CarolinaPanthers8789

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Posted 16 July 2009 - 11:02 AM

Those stats shown like that make Felton look like a top 15 PG, maybe even top 10. But alas I don't think he is or will ever be a top 10 PG. He's good just not that good.


Oh I agree and I am a Tar Heel fan to, I just don't think he will be able to get his shot to be as smooth as Augustin's is. If Felton could get a better shot he would be a sick nasty point guard, but Augustin is just amazing when it comes to shooting the ball.

#14 Plewis

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Posted 16 July 2009 - 01:36 PM

I think he is probably looking at 8 or 9 a year, whereas the bobs are looking at more 6 to 7.
these are some guys I would consider comparable to Felton on the market and their salaries for 2009:
TJ Ford-8 mil
Devin Harris-7.8 mil
Jameer Nelson-7.7 mil

I actually just picked a couple guys who reminded me of Felton as far as talent level, age, and what they mean to their team. Their salaries are all really close, so I think this is where the negotiations end up....maybe around 7.5 since we have a little leverage with Augustin, and Felton wants to stay in Charlotte. Thoughts?


My question is what year did those guys get those contracts? Player price goes up every year... and those guys could be getting less than what they're worth.

I am a believer in DJ. I think if he progresses the way he should this year, he'll be a stud/starter the next year.

If we give Felton 8 mil he'll be getting starter pay for backup minutes in a year or so.... I think he's worth around 7 mil. and maybe we trade him after the season. If we can't sign him though, we're screwed unless something unforseen and fortuitous happens.

#15 d-run

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Posted 16 July 2009 - 04:05 PM

Those players are all substantially better than Felton. In fact, all three are all star players. Felton isn't even close.


I would agree that Nelson is far better than Felton, but I wanted three guys to compare. Ford is not far better than Felton, and I think Harris and Felton are pretty close. Looking at the 30 starting points in the league, I thought these three are the closest to Felton. Who would you substitute for comparison sake?
Augustin is not ready to take this team over, and will not be for a couple years, IMO. I think we should sign Felton to a three year deal, and then look at the pg situation after that time. If the FO feels augustin is ready to take over this team before then we can trade felton. But, look at the stats posted earlier in the thread. This team will be substaintally worse if we lose Felton. His assists, rebounds, steals, and blocks are among best in the league at the position. Augustin can't cover that loss if we lose Felton. Felton should get paid starting salary because, IMO, he will be the starter as long as he is here.

#16 pantherfan49

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Posted 16 July 2009 - 05:48 PM

I would agree that Nelson is far better than Felton, but I wanted three guys to compare. Ford is not far better than Felton, and I think Harris and Felton are pretty close. Looking at the 30 starting points in the league, I thought these three are the closest to Felton. Who would you substitute for comparison sake?


Harris put up 21 ppg last year on an equally offensively incompetent team. Ford was far better than Felton when he was awarded that contract.

For comparisons sake, try Chris Duhon. Similar stat line and a lot smarter player. He got 6 mil a year from NYK last year.

I think 6 mil a year is close to what Felton is worth. The problem with valuing Felton is that 1) he improved so much last year, is it possible that he could make a comparable leap next year?; 2) his shot selection is terrible and I doubt he will ever become a good shooter, but will his shot selection improve; and 3) just how dependent is he on Boris Diaw, take a look at his stats pre the Diaw trade and they aren't impressive?

I like some things Felton brings to the table. He was a much better player last year with LB coaching him. He is tough as nails and his teammates seem to like him. I just don't think he is worth overpaying when you have the sweet shooting and smarter DJ Augustine (possibly AI as well) waiting in the wings.

#17 CarolinaPanthers8789

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Posted 17 July 2009 - 10:08 AM

Harris put up 21 ppg last year on an equally offensively incompetent team. Ford was far better than Felton when he was awarded that contract.

For comparisons sake, try Chris Duhon. Similar stat line and a lot smarter player. He got 6 mil a year from NYK last year.

I think 6 mil a year is close to what Felton is worth. The problem with valuing Felton is that 1) he improved so much last year, is it possible that he could make a comparable leap next year?; 2) his shot selection is terrible and I doubt he will ever become a good shooter, but will his shot selection improve; and 3) just how dependent is he on Boris Diaw, take a look at his stats pre the Diaw trade and they aren't impressive?

I like some things Felton brings to the table. He was a much better player last year with LB coaching him. He is tough as nails and his teammates seem to like him. I just don't think he is worth overpaying when you have the sweet shooting and smarter DJ Augustine (possibly AI as well) waiting in the wings.


His shot selection is indeed horrible, considering he is not the smoothest shooter to play for the Bobcats. He averages 13.2 field goal attempts per game and only averages 5.4 field goals made per game. However, he is still a good point guard and the way he turned his game around at the end of the season, I would say the Bobcats are lucky that his first choice is to resign with the Bobcats and not with a playoff contender (lets face we are probably not going to make the playoffs this year). If we are going to compare Felton to some players than I would look at these guys.

Comparisons
1. Mike Bibby
2. Rodney Stuckey
3. Aaron Brooks
4. Nate Robinson
5. Baron Davis

#18 pantherfan49

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Posted 17 July 2009 - 12:15 PM

His shot selection is indeed horrible, considering he is not the smoothest shooter to play for the Bobcats. He averages 13.2 field goal attempts per game and only averages 5.4 field goals made per game. However, he is still a good point guard and the way he turned his game around at the end of the season, I would say the Bobcats are lucky that his first choice is to resign with the Bobcats and not with a playoff contender (lets face we are probably not going to make the playoffs this year). If we are going to compare Felton to some players than I would look at these guys.

Comparisons
1. Mike Bibby
2. Rodney Stuckey
3. Aaron Brooks
4. Nate Robinson
5. Baron Davis


I would agree with most of what you said, with the exception being the Baron Davis comparison.

I never said don't resign the guy. I just said pay guys at reasonable numbers. MJs history with our FAs has been to overpay at all costs. Matt Carrol and Oke come to mind.

#19 CarolinaPanthers8789

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Posted 17 July 2009 - 01:05 PM

I would agree with most of what you said, with the exception being the Baron Davis comparison.

I never said don't resign the guy. I just said pay guys at reasonable numbers. MJs history with our FAs has been to overpay at all costs. Matt Carrol and Oke come to mind.


I agree

#20 d-run

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Posted 17 July 2009 - 05:23 PM

Now that the Jazz are going to match Portland's offer to Milsap, do you think they may go after Felton? If they offer him 7-8 mil a year, would you match it? I think they should. It would be overpaying for Felton, but I still don't believe Augustin is ready to be a fulltime starter, and the depth at pg would be non-existant. Even though the team doesn't have a great shot at the playoffs, it would still be a huge step backwards losing Felton, IMO.