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Swan

Member Since 11 Aug 2010
Last Active Mar 18 2015 12:04 AM
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#3213696 The Cam Versus Thread to End all Cam Comparison Threads!

Posted by Swan on 19 January 2015 - 06:30 PM

You asked for this, OP. Get busy.




#3208974 What does Gettleman do about Cam

Posted by Swan on 17 January 2015 - 02:58 PM

Actually he had less weapons no o-line and far to conservative play calling.  Only thing he had was he wasn't injured.  

Haha I was being sarcastic-ish. Hard to do on internet.




#3208796 What does Gettleman do about Cam

Posted by Swan on 17 January 2015 - 12:17 PM

Great question.  I think you have to factor in Cam's upside into the equation.  I also think that, if he has not progressed as much as you would like in 4 seasons, it may be time to get a more effective QB coach.  I am not blaming the QB coach, however, I am simply making adjustments to get the most out of my investment.  If I were GM, I would offer Cam a deal in the $18 per year range for five seasons. I feel that Cam and Co will want over $20.  To reach that amount, however, there would be incentive clauses in it.  Then I would only guarantee about $40 million.  This is not my area (others are smarter about contract structure and comparable contracts, but I really think a running QB carries more risk than one that doesn't in the NFL, and I think a pocket-passing QB carries more value in the NFL because WR timing and linemen are more in tune with the QB's proximity.  Timing is everything.  I think most coaches, WRs, and OL prefer a pocket passer who can run, not a runner who can throw from the pocket.   Cam has the potential to change into that and the physical talent to become great at it, but he has not shown the growth they hoped for, in my opinion, which is why Gettlemen and RR are talking about his inconsistent behavior.

 

Many people on here say stupid crap like, "If you don't pay him $25m, he will go free agent and somebody will."  Sure they will.  There are desperate teams that overpay.  But Gettlemen is building a team geared toward winning on a regular basis, and you do not do that by overpaying.  Cam is NOT a $20m per season player.  If you take the average salary at his position, and he has been about average in terms of production, then you see where his real market value is.  However, there are some variables that you must consider:

 

1. He has either been involved in a lockout (year 1) or recovering from surgery (year 4) during 50% of the offseasons.  The Cam fans have not mentioned that, but it is huge.  On both occasions, he was not familiar with any WR he would be throwing to.

2. He has had some issues on the OL. Maybe these caused him to develop bad habits, but habits are formed through repetition.  Unless he is practicing these same bad habits, I do not see how 20 throws per week would cause that.  Still, he has attempted to stay in the pocket and transform, but the OL has been inconsistent.  This is a variable to consider, not an excuse for bad play.

3.  His WRs have always been below average.  However, timing is everything,  A WR drops passes and passes are overthrown a lot when that happens.  Cam has more unforced overthrows than drops or throwaway passes, so blaming them for all things bad about Cam is stupid.   Look what Lafell and Smith did in systems where timing is perfected and the QB is a pocket passer.   Both increased production by about 30-40%.  That is a huge difference. 

 

Gettlemen will argue that if you have to bring in an elite OL, an elite backfield, and an elite WR corps, how much can you afford to pay a qb who needs studs all around him to be successful?  Cam fans are stupid if they blame these things and then insist Cam is worth a megadeal with guaranteed $$.  If that happens, can Cam win shootouts?  Because we would not be able to pay our DL or LBs.  That is called Math.

I have a question for you, and I really want you to objectively consider the answer.

 

Q:  If Gettlemen thinks giving Cam Newton a huge deal that is largely guaranteed is the only way to keep him here, does he do it?

 

I don't think he would.  I think he tags Cam until he finds a QB.  Or, even more drastic, he takes the $20m and invests it in other players and finds a QB in a year or two.  I assure you that he has peeked at the QB crop in next year's draft.  It looks to be a good one.  Then there is the fact that he has a backup who was 2-0 last year with the same players Cam had to go 5-8-1.  Sure, it was Tampa Bay, but you could then argue that Anderson rarely works with the first team in practice.  Is the difference between Anderson and Newton worth $20m?  I am just thinking out loud as I guess he might. 

 

Many people here thing the contract for Cam is a gimme, that we should give him the debit card and move on.  They do not know Dave Gettlemen, who was hired because he is the Anit-Hurney.

Really good point.




#3208456 Why does NFL media hate Cam Newton? (Bear fans take on Cam.)

Posted by Swan on 16 January 2015 - 11:03 PM

Wow this is pretty sad. The blind homerism in this thread is overwhleming. Can no one debate intellligently about the merits of Cam Newton without pursuing ad hominen attacks and a complete verbal thrashing?

 

This is a discussion board, and whether or not one has a minority opinion does not give anyone the right to completely ridicule and trash his/her argument.

 

The excuses have been given a million times, and some of the blind homerism in this thread is disturbing. Cam's not perfect, far from, and some of you act as if he were a flawless QB. He isn't. I back him, however, I recognize his flaws. Honestly, people have a "right" to be restless. Next year will be his fifth, and he has only shown marginal improvement over the last few years (last year mostly). After this year, we should have a more clear answer to that question, and hopefully without dilution from lack of players, coaches, etc. 

 

 




#3206499 Explain the Duron Carter hype to me please

Posted by Swan on 15 January 2015 - 04:18 PM

Good measurables, good highlight reel. No reason not to gamble, especially if he's not looking for a big contract. 

 

Reward> Risk at this point (given he has the right price tag). 

 

Pretty funny if he goes to the Vikings. The expectations that would be there, and the burden of having a HoF dad seems horrible. Oh well.




#3202333 Colin Cowherd actually praised Cam today

Posted by Swan on 13 January 2015 - 02:31 AM

Must've not watched Cam much if he thinks that's his best game...




#3200505 Cam's Most Important Offseason Yet

Posted by Swan on 12 January 2015 - 12:57 PM

That Cotchery drop was on Cam. Threw it late, and rocketed a ball that only travelled 10-ish yards. Just no need.




#3197526 Cam Newton

Posted by Swan on 11 January 2015 - 02:03 PM

All the Cam has no "o-line, no weapons, no coaches!!!!" needs to stop. Smitty leaves, becomes a #1 in Balt. Lafell balls out in NE after we critiqued him for so many years. The QB makes the players better. 

 

You can blame the receivers for dropping passes, not coming back to the ball, but you must blame Cam for the countless overthrows, bad reads, and decision-making. Indubitably, every time Cam progresses, he regresses very quickly. I'll give Cam top 15, not top 10 rating. 

 

I see Cam as a Stafford-esque quarterback. Strong arm, poor decision-making, just with better mobility. 

 

Give Stafford Megatron, Tate, and decent RBs, and he still can't win a playoff game.

 

I haven't lost hope in our QB yet, as I do agree must retain him for the value he provides this franchise. However, potential and probability of reaching that potential are two distinctly different things that separate the great from the middle-of-the pack. 

 

I'll stay hopeful, but I won't expect a massive transformation regarding his mechanics or his decision-making abilities. All I can hope for is that he's capable enough to get us there.

 

As others said, he's no Luck, Brady, or Manning. However, if Eli can win a Superbowl, I have faith that Cam has the potential to as well.

 

 




#3196049 Cam Newton

Posted by Swan on 11 January 2015 - 12:11 AM

BTW, you keep talking about what will the Panthers do when we have to pay Newton, and the rest of the team will crumble and there will be no money for an OL...

 

Please explain why the Panther's despite Newton being on a Rookie deal cannot surround him with talent better than Bersin, and his number one WR being a rookie?

You must be new around here...

 

unless that was sarcasm/rhetorical.




#3194739 Official Panthers at Seahawks divisional playoff GameDay Thread...

Posted by Swan on 10 January 2015 - 10:50 PM

not mad, we played well. refs were meh. team is young, much optimism for the future. 




#3193126 Official Panthers at Seahawks divisional playoff GameDay Thread...

Posted by Swan on 10 January 2015 - 09:23 PM

Getting beat by lobs. Jesus




#3192917 Official Panthers at Seahawks divisional playoff GameDay Thread...

Posted by Swan on 10 January 2015 - 09:12 PM

KB!!!!




#3191524 The Divisional round begins " Patriots vs. Ravens "

Posted by Swan on 10 January 2015 - 05:46 PM

Pats getting all the calls now.




#3191488 The Divisional round begins " Patriots vs. Ravens "

Posted by Swan on 10 January 2015 - 05:34 PM

Don't know why people wouldn't support Smith Sr. It's not like he turned his back on this franchise, rather vice-versa. I know he's made some snarky comments here and there, but I can't blame him. Hope they win.




#3153994 Cash Money Huddle League 2014

Posted by Swan on 26 December 2014 - 06:56 PM

Yo, I haven't paid yet lol. 

 

I can pay via paypal/venmo or something correct?