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One step forward, two steps back. The story of the Carolina Panthers.

Jan 19 2013 08:39 PM Ivan The Awesome Carolina Panthers
I know you've experienced it before. When things aren't going right. When you're in a funk. Whether it's personal or business. We've all experienced it..


Then things start to happen. From little to big things. This has been the rhetoric of the Carolina Panthers of late. Take a step forward and then two back.

Let's flashback to 2010. When everything was in a funk. A lame duck coach. Yes, Foxy was a lame duck coach. NO matter what any of you that wish he was still here say. He was a LAME DUCK COACH. Hey, it is what it is.. or what it was. Having a QB carousel, not knowing who will start the next week. A rookie QB that was thrown to the wolves. Sure he wasn't any good to begin with but eh. He was dead on arrival. The staff was as vanilla as can be. Jeff Davidson was the OC then. Remember that? Run, run, pass on 3rd and long, punt (good play man good play!). Predictable.

2011 Draft. Cam becomes our 'savior', start out bad, finish strong. the rest is history. (Lockout was the main scapegoat for this season. Injuries as well. Lack of experience from the coaching staff.)

2012 comes, high hopes on everyones minds. We start out horribly, finish strong with a 1 game improvement. What was the scapegoat this season? Coaching staff regressing? Injuries to key players? Lack of talent at certain positions? Yes on all accounts.

The Coaching staff for whatever reason did not progress like most of us would have thought. Chud went "full retard". Yes, he somehow thought it would be a great Idea that running the Read Option as a base offense would work. When the prior year it wasn't done that way. It was thrown in periodically. Was it Rivera's fault for not supervising Chud? Could be.. He shares part of the blame. But ultimately that was on Chud for even thinking about it. The running game was abandoned. Towards the end of the season we finally clicked. But again, took a step forward at the end of 2011, and took two steps back in the beginning of this season. I blame mostly Chud for this.

McDermott, who even as of last year. I thought was a moron... Really won me over. I believe that the players finally bought into his system. It works. Sure it worked for sub par teams. But let's look at the Denver Game. Take away the special teams blunders, that game was controlled by this defense for a huge chunk of the time. Keeping Manning In check. But again, Denvers special teams just steam rolled through ours. The momentum was too much. Not McD's department. Most of the season the wins can be accounted for 1 key play in the defense. That falls to lack of Talent at the players in that position.

Safety. Corner in some games. Not going to go in the 'had (Players name) made that play' game. We all know that doesn't exist.

The special teams, which was suppose to improve with a certain player from Arkansas, did not. Armanti Edwards was the person that took care of these responsibilities. Yes. He did an ok job. But being run down by the punter? Come on man.

Rivera: There's been plenty of blunders that he's committed. Time management is still a foreign concept to him. Time outs with a minute left and the ability to move up the field to get at least 3 points is a sin. Regardless, during the whole seasons progression. I did notice he took command, being under a lot of heat. I mean tremendous heat. After Hurney was fired. I believe this was the turning point of the Coaching staff. Rivera firing the special teams coach as well. Could be a scapegoat, who knows. But it took balls. In the beginning of the season where you have one of the leagues most talented backfields, and expensive, you don't feel comfortable enough to go for it on 4th and 1 to finish a game? Not even mentioning Cam Newtons 6'5 frame that could easily stretch out to get 1 freaking yard... Rivera grew some balls. Yes, testicular fortitude was acquired in the latter part of the season. There were several games we went for it. The Raiders game to go for the field goal to seal the win. It took cojones.

Ending the season with a one game improvement isn't much of an improvement. But it is an improvement regardless. I'm not condoning mediocrity. But I am promoting patience. 2008 was a long time ago. We yearn as a fan base the ability to talk poo to others that we're in the playoffs and they aren't. That we're the best team of our division but we're not. I understand that.

Take a look at this off season so far. "One step forward, two steps back.." Oh wait. Gettleman is a huge step forward. Shula is more of a lateral move to me (admittedly I though as this as a step backwards). I did not want him at first but then I soaked it in a bit. Chud won't be playing mad scientist anymore. He won't be here to abandon that running game we have. Skipper was hired again, that's another huge plus. A third year in the same system will help Cam. The draft isn't even here yet and our holes are glaring but minimal. The lines and weapons for Cam. We aren't making this team learn new systems which would set us back. If anything we'll have a more balanced attack with more use of our running backs. That's the way I see it.

So far I don't see a step backwards.





TL;DR? Patience.

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38 Comments

:: before

in spite of my frustration i'm pretty well convinced we'll make the playoffs this year if we have a solid draft and pick up a decent FA or two.

what does that mean?



Too Long; Didn't Read.

I put a 'TL;DR' explanation if you thought it was too long to read. 'Patience'. Apparently that's too long to read too.
I wish we didn't need reassuring threads every year because questionable decisions were made once again.

Well I'm just going to do what every other Panther fan does and hope it works out. Seems that's all we ever have.
Finally, All of my thoughts towards what has happened thus far this offseason. But I was too lazy to post myself. We will make the playoffs this year. This is not homerism. This is not optimism. People say, "oh we only win games when it matters." Rivera's job was on the line, that is bigger than being in the playoffs. He gets it now. I believe that. We will see more confidence in Cam in his third year. We will see Keuchly lead this defense to ridiculous heights. We were what the 10th and 12th ranked offense and we were 7-9? This is the year. Not only do i believe that we will make the playoffs. But i believe we will make a deep run. I was watching Cam at Auburn during the season. The dude is the "comeback kid." Have faith fellow panther fans even when the faith seems like a retread. This is it the next year. The year we have been waiting for. The year when i can finally talk poo to my Atlanta and New Orleans friends. The year when we put it all together. The year of the Panthers. And no I am not a relative of Ryan Kalil and yes I am a little bit drunk. But I will wake up tomorrow and feel the same. GO PANTHERS!!!!!

Finally, All of my thoughts towards what has happened thus far this offseason. But I was too lazy to post myself. We will make the playoffs this year. This is not homerism. This is not optimism. People say, "oh we only win games when it matters." Rivera's job was on the line, that is bigger than being in the playoffs. He gets it now. I believe that. We will see more confidence in Cam in his third year. We will see Keuchly lead this defense to ridiculous heights. We were what the 10th and 12th ranked offense and we were 7-9? This is the year. Not only do i believe that we will make the playoffs. But i believe we will make a deep run. I was watching Cam at Auburn during the season. The dude is the "comeback kid." Have faith fellow panther fans even when the faith seems like a retread. This is it the next year. The year we have been waiting for. The year when i can finally talk poo to my Atlanta and New Orleans friends. The year when we put it all together. The year of the Panthers. And no I am not a relative of Ryan Kalil and yes I am a little bit drunk. But I will wake up tomorrow and feel the same. GO PANTHERS!!!!!


unfortunately i have felt this way every season since 2008 when we re-signed moose and inflated the offensive line and drafted jonathan stewart.

unfortunately i have felt this way every season since 2008 when we re-signed moose and inflated the offensive line and drafted jonathan stewart.


I have as well. But I havent felt this good about an offseason in a long time. With Cam, Jim Skipper coming back, Rivera ( who is an excellent coach minus what he didn't "get" in the first half of the season, and especially David Gettleman. That hire is huge. We will be reaping the benefits. Rest assured.
@Ivan

I read it.

Good summary, hopes and thoughts.

And all I'll say is: Now we'll really see, if Cam is a 6'6", 262lb walking economic stimulus plan for Football coaches. :D Cause if the offense is good to excellent next year (which I'll assume it will be, even with Shula, unless he's just horrendous), then that says a lot, not only about Cam, but the disaster Chud was, during the first half of the season, and his overall situational play calling throughout.

As far as the defense: They have a lot to prove still. Yes they were decent during the early part of the year, and got progressively better as the season rolled to an end. However, Indy in comparison had one of the worst rated defenses in 2012, but was nonetheless able to hold various multiple 4th qtr comebacks that Andrew Luck was credited for. The Panthers higher rated defense, on the other hand, couldn't hold several of their late 4th Qtr leads (even for 58 seconds to 3min, with 0 TO's, with the opposition pinned near their end zone), when Cam did the same.

Once again, the Panther players and their coaches, have to show and prove that they can produce in prime time (i.e. playoff contention or divisional and big games), when they actually count. :blink:

Stay tuned.

I know you've experienced it before. When things aren't going right. When you're in a funk. Whether it's personal or business. We've all experienced it..


Then things start to happen. From little to big things. This has been the rhetoric of the Carolina Panthers of late. Take a step forward and then two back.

Let's flashback to 2010. When everything was in a funk. A lame duck coach. Yes, Foxy was a lame duck coach. NO matter what any of you that wish he was still here say. He was a LAME DUCK COACH. Hey, it is what it is.. or what it was. Having a QB carousel, not knowing who will start the next week. A rookie QB that was thrown to the wolves. Sure he wasn't any good to begin with but eh. He was dead on arrival. The staff was as vanilla as can be. Jeff Davidson was the OC then. Remember that? Run, run, pass on 3rd and long, punt (good play man good play!). Predictable.

2011 Draft. Cam becomes our 'savior', start out bad, finish strong. the rest is history. (Lockout was the main scapegoat for this season. Injuries as well. Lack of experience from the coaching staff.)

2012 comes, high hopes on everyones minds. We start out horribly, finish strong with a 1 game improvement. What was the scapegoat this season? Coaching staff regressing? Injuries to key players? Lack of talent at certain positions? Yes on all accounts.

The Coaching staff for whatever reason did not progress like most of us would have thought. Chud went "full retard". Yes, he somehow thought it would be a great Idea that running the Read Option as a base offense would work. When the prior year it wasn't done that way. It was thrown in periodically. Was it Rivera's fault for not supervising Chud? Could be.. He shares part of the blame. But ultimately that was on Chud for even thinking about it. The running game was abandoned. Towards the end of the season we finally clicked. But again, took a step forward at the end of 2011, and took two steps back in the beginning of this season. I blame mostly Chud for this.

McDermott, who even as of last year. I thought was a moron... Really won me over. I believe that the players finally bought into his system. It works. Sure it worked for sub par teams. But let's look at the Denver Game. Take away the special teams blunders, that game was controlled by this defense for a huge chunk of the time. Keeping Manning In check. But again, Denvers special teams just steam rolled through ours. The momentum was too much. Not McD's department. Most of the season the wins can be accounted for 1 key play in the defense. That falls to lack of Talent at the players in that position.

Safety. Corner in some games. Not going to go in the 'had (Players name) made that play' game. We all know that doesn't exist.

The special teams, which was suppose to improve with a certain player from Arkansas, did not. Armanti Edwards was the person that took care of these responsibilities. Yes. He did an ok job. But being run down by the punter? Come on man.

Rivera: There's been plenty of blunders that he's committed. Time management is still a foreign concept to him. Time outs with a minute left and the ability to move up the field to get at least 3 points is a sin. Regardless, during the whole seasons progression. I did notice he took command, being under a lot of heat. I mean tremendous heat. After Hurney was fired. I believe this was the turning point of the Coaching staff. Rivera firing the special teams coach as well. Could be a scapegoat, who knows. But it took balls. In the beginning of the season where you have one of the leagues most talented backfields, and expensive, you don't feel comfortable enough to go for it on 4th and 1 to finish a game? Not even mentioning Cam Newtons 6'5 frame that could easily stretch out to get 1 freaking yard... Rivera grew some balls. Yes, testicular fortitude was acquired in the latter part of the season. There were several games we went for it. The Raiders game to go for the field goal to seal the win. It took cojones.

Ending the season with a one game improvement isn't much of an improvement. But it is an improvement regardless. I'm not condoning mediocrity. But I am promoting patience. 2008 was a long time ago. We yearn as a fan base the ability to talk poo to others that we're in the playoffs and they aren't. That we're the best team of our division but we're not. I understand that.

Take a look at this off season so far. "One step forward, two steps back.." Oh wait. Gettleman is a huge step forward. Shula is more of a lateral move to me (admittedly I though as this as a step backwards). I did not want him at first but then I soaked it in a bit. Chud won't be playing mad scientist anymore. He won't be here to abandon that running game we have. Skipper was hired again, that's another huge plus. A third year in the same system will help Cam. The draft isn't even here yet and our holes are glaring but minimal. The lines and weapons for Cam. We aren't making this team learn new systems which would set us back. If anything we'll have a more balanced attack with more use of our running backs. That's the way I see it.

So far I don't see a step backwards.





TL;DR? Patience.


I agree. Keep pounding.
Just need the Falcons to lose tomorrow to kick things off.

I know you've experienced it before. When things aren't going right. When you're in a funk. Whether it's personal or business. We've all experienced it..
TL;DR? Patience.

I had another post that was eerily similar--a chronology. I had not seen this (well-written, by the way) before posting in another thread. I do not want you to think I was taking your idea---great minds...
I guess I'll say it. I do not see us making the playoffs this year. In watching other teams this post season the difference is just too great. But people forget the postseason isn't the ultimate goal and I don't see our staff able to win even if the postseason is reached. To bring it even further I do not think with the owner we have, we will ever get a championship. I see Gettleman as desperate for the position and really willing to go along with things rather than change them. Maybe he is jsut going along for now but will change if another losing season. For him it will be one losing season, for me it will be 5 and that is where I am coming from. Excuses and reasonning is getting rather old for me.

Yea..I'll be the pessemistic, doomsdayer, chicken little, fake panthers fan...the labels created by cam fans, doesn't matter because post season or not I'll be here until the end. But, that is my morbid opinion, don't blame me...I am just going with the flow, going with history rather than hope...

If I am wrong I win. If I am right I lose.

Yea..I'll be the pessemistic, doomsdayer, chicken little, fake panthers fan...the labels created by cam fans, doesn't matter because post season or not I'll be here until the end. But, that is my morbid opinion, don't blame me...


What do those labels have to do with Cam fans? You lost me there.
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CardiacCats
Jan 19 2013 11:34 PM
tl;dr. y'all act like the hiring of shula and we're done. worst case scenario we tank next year and hire a brand new staff. holy poo i'm tired of y'all complaining.

tl;dr. y'all act like the hiring of shula and we're done. worst case scenario we tank next year and hire a brand new staff. holy poo i'm tired of y'all complaining.


We've tanked 13 seasons already.

Take that we'll get em' next year poo to Cleveland or Buffalo if that's your idea of a good time.

I wish we didn't need reassuring threads every year because questionable decisions were made once again.

Well I'm just going to do what every other Panther fan does and hope it works out. Seems that's all we ever have.

if decisions have to be defended and excuses made, it's probably warranted.

the reason for my departure from my normal, natural, and more comfortable homer posting and viewpoint is that i've just grown weary of the same old song and dance. we lose most of our games for 2/3 of the season, enough to eliminate us from playoff contention and then see the team turn around and finally get their poo together making you believe that next year things will be a continuing of the impressive play at the end of the season....only to see them make yet another regression.

i don't know that shula is any better of a play caller than chud. it's hard for me to see that we haven't taken a step backward. chud's just had more success than shula and he's had more experience doing it...even in san diego he was doing it. it's not that i think chud is all that great at play calling either, i just don't see shula as being an upgrade at all.

the most optimistic view point of any but the most blind homers will be that we maintain what was being done at the end of last year. i don't know of any actual critical thinkers who expect us to be better than we were at the end of the season. most are just thinking that we won't go backward.

i'm sorry if that's just not enough for me anymore.
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CardiacCats
Jan 19 2013 11:49 PM

We've tanked 13 seasons already.

Take that we'll get em' next year poo to Cleveland or Buffalo if that's your idea of a good time.

I'm just saying have some confidence. Shula could do an amazing job, we have the pieces to be good next year. Am I sold on the coaching staff yet? No but let's not surrender already

unfortunately i have felt this way every season since 2008 when we re-signed moose and inflated the offensive line and drafted jonathan stewart.

with the exception of 2010, yeah, i'm in the same boat. even when i started wanting fox fired in '07 i always believed that we could make it into the playoffs. i've just given up. it's not a lack of faith in cam and kuechly...it's a lack of faith in the coaches.

if decisions have to be defended and excuses made, it's probably warranted.

the reason for my departure from my normal, natural, and more comfortable homer posting and viewpoint is that i've just grown weary of the same old song and dance. we lose most of our games for 2/3 of the season, enough to eliminate us from playoff contention and then see the team turn around and finally get their poo together making you believe that next year things will be a continuing of the impressive play at the end of the season....only to see them make yet another regression.

i don't know that shula is any better of a play caller than chud. it's hard for me to see that we haven't taken a step backward. chud's just had more success than shula and he's had more experience doing it...even in san diego he was doing it. it's not that i think chud is all that great at play calling either, i just don't see shula as being an upgrade at all.

the most optimistic view point of any but the most blind homers will be that we maintain what was being done at the end of last year. i don't know of any actual critical thinkers who expect us to be better than we were at the end of the season. most are just thinking that we won't go backward.

i'm sorry if that's just not enough for me anymore.





Chud was the TE's coach in SD, he didn't do any play calling there if I'm not mistaken. Also, Chud's success was directly linked to Cam's skills.

I never said Shula is an upgrade but for what it's worth, it's not a down grade when he's been around Cam and this offense for the past two years. Like I said, I see it as a lateral move. Not backwards but not forwards, sometimes taking a side step works. Trust me I wasn't thrilled about the Shula hiring at first. Still not, but it isn't Jeff Davidson or Shurmur, which would really have put me on edge to be honest.

The other off season moves have been forward progress. Gettleman, getting skipper back. I see that as positives. Gettleman is a football guy, this is going to be his first draft and with his knack of finding diamonds in the late rounds or off practice squads. I feel really good man. It's a process and it will take time.

The notion of making the playoffs this coming year isn't mine. It's not that I don't believe we won't make the playoffs, it's that the competition in the NFC is fierce and we may go 10-6 and miss the playoffs.

In hindsight we're a couple of positions away from the playoffs. We have our Franchise QB. Not a lot of teams can say that. That's the foundation. Now it's time to add the missing pieces.
I understand the point people are trying to make about our offense early in the season. But for some reason it is a weird pet peeve of mine when people say we ran the "read option" as a base offense. It isn't a type of offense it is a type of play.

It shouldn't annoy me, and I understand what you are trying to say, but for some reason it bugs the poo out of me.

Not really directed at you Ivan and I like the OP and agree with just about everything you said. But about 1,000 people have said this and for some reason (that I can't figure out) it makes me pull my hair out and I have so little to spare. :(

I understand the point people are trying to make about our offense early in the season. But for some reason it is a weird pet peeve of mine when people say we ran the "read option" as a base offense. It isn't a type of offense it is a type of play.

It shouldn't annoy me, and I understand what you are trying to say, but for some reason it bugs the poo out of me.

Not really directed at you Ivan and I like the OP and agree with just about everything you said. But about 1,000 people have said this and for some reason (that I can't figure out) it makes me pull my hair out and I have so little to spare. :(


How about. . .we ran the read option a lot more than necessary?

I understand the point people are trying to make about our offense early in the season. But for some reason it is a weird pet peeve of mine when people say we ran the "read option" as a base offense. It isn't a type of offense it is a type of play.

It shouldn't annoy me, and I understand what you are trying to say, but for some reason it bugs the poo out of me.

Not really directed at you Ivan and I like the OP and agree with just about everything you said. But about 1,000 people have said this and for some reason (that I can't figure out) it makes me pull my hair out and I have so little to spare. :(


Could have fooled me. Every game I viewed, I saw a lot of the cute gimmick option plays. Maybe it was more than it should have. Excessive at times. The Giants game in particular. My god...MY GOD! I was pulling my hairs out in that game seeing that JPP was figuring out everything and yet we STILL went back to that read option.

Could have fooled me. Every game I viewed, I saw a lot of the cute gimmick option plays. Maybe it was more than it should have. Excessive at times. The Giants game in particular. My god...MY GOD! I was pulling my hairs out in that game seeing that JPP was figuring out everything and yet we STILL went back to that read option.


The Giants had the perfect read option killer in that game: JPP. Having an uber-athletic lineman that can attack the mesh point directly and still be fast enough to recover to either option completely blew that play up. We actually had decent production when we ran it against Matthias Kiwanuka, but JPP wrecked it for us.

Could have fooled me. Every game I viewed, I saw a lot of the cute gimmick option plays. Maybe it was more than it should have. Excessive at times. The Giants game in particular. My god...MY GOD! I was pulling my hairs out in that game seeing that JPP was figuring out everything and yet we STILL went back to that read option.

The Giants had the perfect read option killer in that game: JPP. Having an uber-athletic lineman that can attack the mesh point directly and still be fast enough to recover to either option completely blew that play up. We actually had decent production when we ran it against Matthias Kiwanuka, but JPP wrecked it for us.


The Giants game is always an interesting game for me to look back on. We struggled offensively, there is no doubt about that, however, it also gets overlooked that we had exactly zero three and outs that game, and moved the ball quite well. We just kept shooting ourselves in the foot with turnovers and untimely penalties.

It was just a weird game.

The actual game that I thought the read option plays were completely blown up was the first Tampa game.
Agree with everything except that promoting Shula and Rodgers is a step back.

The Giants game is always an interesting game for me to look back on. We struggled offensively, there is no doubt about that, however, it also gets overlooked that we had exactly zero three and outs that game, and moved the ball quite well. We just kept shooting ourselves in the foot with turnovers and untimely penalties.

It was just a weird game.

The actual game that I thought the read option plays were completely blown up was the first Tampa game.


There was also the fact that our defense was getting wrecked as well, turning Ramses Barden and. . .I can't even remember the other guy's name, lol, into one-game megastars. In retrospect I think it's obvious that the whole team was tight and flat for their "moment in the spotlight."