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The Trump Fallacy Versus Facts

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Just another week of lies told by the pathological liar that Donald Trump always has been and always will be. Your Liar in Chief.

TRUMP: “I think that the report yesterday, maybe more importantly than anything, it totally exonerates me. There was no collusion. There was no obstruction. And if you read the report, you’ll see that. ... I think that the Mueller investigation has been totally discredited.” — remarks to reporters Friday, 6/15/2018.

THE FACTS: The report neither exonerated nor implicated Trump. It did not make any findings about collusion with Russia or obstruction of justice. It did not discredit, or give credence to, special counsel Robert Mueller’s continuing investigation into Russian interference in the election and ties between the Trump campaign and Russians. The report was about the FBI’s investigation of Hillary Clinton’s email practices.

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TRUMP on Comey: “Certainly he, they just seem like criminal acts to me. What he did was criminal. ... Should he be locked up? Let somebody make a determination.” — to Fox News on Friday, 6/15/2018.

THE FACTS: The report does not substantiate Trump’s lock-him-up rhetoric. Comey was roundly faulted by the inspector general for violating FBI practices and for insubordination in making public statements about the Clinton investigation at the height of the presidential campaign. The report also revealed communications among some FBI employees who plainly wanted Trump to lose. But it does not support Trump’s complaint that political bias influenced the conduct of the email investigation into his Democratic rival. Nor does it allege any criminal behavior by Comey, who has been accused by Clinton supporters of taking actions that hurt her election chances.

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TRUMP: “The Democrats forced that law upon our nation. I hate it. I hate to see separation of parents and children.” And: “I hate the children being taken away. The Democrats have to change their law. That’s their law.” — remarks to reporters Friday, 6/15/2018.

TRUMP: “Democrats can fix their forced family breakup at the Border by working with Republicans on new legislation, for a change! This is why we need more Republicans elected in November...” — tweet Saturday, 6/16/2018.

THE FACTS: It’s not Democrats’ law. There is no law mandating the separation of children and parents at the border.

The separations are a consequence of a Trump administration policy to maximize criminal prosecutions of people caught trying to enter the U.S. illegally. That means more adults are jailed, pending trial, so their children are removed from them. Before the policy, many people who were accused of illegal entry and did not have a criminal record were merely referred for civil deportation proceedings, which generally did not break up families.

The policy was announced April 6 and went into effect in May. From April 19 to May 31, 1,995 children were separated from 1,940 adults, according to Homeland Security statistics obtained by The Associated Press. The figures are for people who tried to enter the U.S. between official border crossings.

Trump’s repeated, but nonspecific references to a Democratic law appear to involve one enacted in 2008. It passed unanimously in Congress and was signed by Republican President George W. Bush. It was focused on freeing and otherwise helping children who come to the border without a parent or guardian. It does not call for family separation.

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TRUMP: “The economy is the best it’s ever been with employment being at an all-time high.” — tweet Wednesday, 6/13/2018.

THE FACTS: Thanks largely to population growth, the number of people with jobs is, in fact, at a record high of 155.5 million. But a more relevant measure — the proportion of Americans with jobs — isn’t even close to a record.

Last month, 60.4 percent of Americans 16 and older had jobs. That is up from the recession and its aftermath, when many Americans stopped looking for work. It bottomed out at 58.2 percent in July 2011. Both figures are far below the record high of 64.7 percent, which was briefly reached in 2000. At the beginning of the 2008-2009 recession, 62.7 percent of Americans had jobs.

Economists estimate that at least half of the decline reflects ongoing retirements by the huge baby boom generation. For Americans in their prime working years — age 25 through 54 — roughly 79 percent have jobs. That’s up substantially from the post-recession low of 74.8 percent in November 2010. But it’s below the record of 81.9 percent in April 2000.

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RUMP: “Oil prices are too high, OPEC is at it again. Not good!” — tweet Wednesday, 6/13/2018.

THE FACTS: He oversimplifies the reasons for increased prices.

OPEC is the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries. Members of the cartel, led by Saudi Arabia, and other big producers including Russia have contributed to reversing the plunge in crude oil prices that started in 2014. They have shown discipline in limiting production since the start of last year, helping push up the benchmark price of international crude. Then there is Iran, OPEC’s third-biggest producer. Iran boosted production after the U.S. lifted sanctions related to Iran’s nuclear program in 2016. But analysts expect output to fall when Trump’s decision to withdraw from the deal takes full effect later this year.

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TRUMP: “Fair Trade is now to be called Fool Trade if it is not Reciprocal. According to a Canada release, they make almost 100 Billion Dollars in Trade with U.S. (guess they were bragging and got caught!). Minimum is 17B. Tax Dairy from us at 270%.” — tweet June 10. Two days earlier: “Canada charges the U.S. a 270% tariff on Dairy Products! They didn’t tell you that, did they? Not fair to our farmers!”

THE FACTS: He’s not telling the whole story. While Canadian dairy tariffs average nearly 249 percent, the troubles that U.S. dairy farmers face can’t all be blamed on Canada.

Canadian trade policies have had only a “tiny impact” on America’s struggling dairy farmers, says Daniel Sumner, an agricultural economist at the University of California, Davis. Despite Canadian barriers, the United States last year ran a $474 million trade surplus in dairy with Canada, and exported $636 million in dairy products to Canada while importing $162 million, according to the U.S. Agriculture Department. Dairy is barely a blip — 0.1 percent — in U.S.-Canada trade, which amounted to $680 billion last year. As a result of the North American Free Trade Agreement, “99 percent of the trade between Canada and the U.S. is tariff-free,” said Bruce Heyman, former U.S. ambassador to Canada. Overall, the U.S. ran a nearly $3 billion surplus in trade with Canada last year.

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TRUMP, on Kim’s agreement to work to repatriate the remains of prisoners of the Korean War and those missing in action from the conflict: “He gave us the remains of our great heroes.” — remarks to reporters Friday.

THE FACTS: That’s false. No remains have been returned since the summit, as of Friday. The last time North Korea turned over remains was in 2007, when Bill Richardson, a former U.N. ambassador and New Mexico governor, secured the return of six sets.

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TRUMP: “I asked for it today. And we got it. ... So, for the thousands and thousands, I guess way over 6,000 that we know of in terms of the remains, they’ll be brought back.” — remarks Tuesday, 6/12/2018.

TRUMP: “He’s giving us back the remains of probably 7,500 soldiers.” — to Fox News on Friday, 6/15/2018.

THE FACTS: Also wrong. About 5,300 U.S. troops are still unaccounted for from North Korea.

Trump is also glossing over the surely impossible odds of locating the remains of all Americans missing from the war, more than six decades later. Several thousand are still missing in South Korea despite its close alliance and history of cooperation with the U.S. North Korea and the United States remain technically at war because the 1950-53 fighting ended with an armistice, not a peace treaty. But between 1996 and 2005, joint U.S.-North Korea military search teams conducted 33 joint recovery operations and recovered 229 sets of American remains.

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TRUMP: “I remember a nuclear event took place, 8.8 on the Richter scale, and they announced — I heard it on the radio, they announced that a massive, you know, an earthquake took place somewhere in Asia. And then they said it was in North Korea, and then they found out it was a nuclear test, I said, I never heard of a Richter scale in the high eights.” — remarks Tuesday.

THE FACTS: North Korea had no earthquake last year approaching that level of severity. This isn’t the first time he has misrepresented the episode.

North Korea tested what it called a hydrogen bomb in September, causing an underground blast so big it registered as a 6.3 magnitude earthquake. Other nuclear tests last year were associated with smaller seismic events. An 8.8 quake would be 316 times bigger — and release 5,623 times more energy — than a 6.3.

In the past 15 years there have been three earthquakes that were an 8.8 or higher: the 9.1 Fukushima earthquake and tsunami in Japan in 2011 that killed nearly 16,000 people, a 9.1 earthquake and tsunami off northern Sumatra in 2004 that killed about 250,000 people and an 8.8 earthquake off Chile in 2010 that killed 524.

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He’s lied thousands of times since he’s been in office. He’s protected and insulated by the R’s. It’s unacceptable and I hope enough people show up when it’s time to vote. 

Who would’ve thought that in the years 2016, 2017 and 2018 we would allow this behavior to become normalized in the WH

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"There's no doubt that the images that we've seen of children, and children being separated from their parents, are heartbreaking. They were heartbreaking when Obama was president," Cruz told reporters Saturday after speaking at the Texas Republican convention. "I visited the Obama camps that he set up to detain little boys and little girls who crossed the border illegally. Illegal immigration produces human tragedies that are wrong."

His minions are happy to parrot his lies. It's pure propaganda. it is scary.

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3 hours ago, Happy Panther said:

"There's no doubt that the images that we've seen of children, and children being separated from their parents, are heartbreaking. They were heartbreaking when Obama was president," Cruz told reporters Saturday after speaking at the Texas Republican convention. "I visited the Obama camps that he set up to detain little boys and little girls who crossed the border illegally. Illegal immigration produces human tragedies that are wrong."

His minions are happy to parrot his lies. It's pure propaganda. it is scary.

it's a manipulative half-truth. obama did have facilities to house unaccompanied minors until a place could be found for them. that's completely irrelevant to the brand new trump policy of stealing children from their families.

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2 hours ago, rodeo said:

it's a manipulative half-truth. obama did have facilities to house unaccompanied minors until a place could be found for them. that's completely irrelevant to the brand new trump policy of stealing children from their families.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/mexican-kids-held-for-months-as-punishment-for-border-crossing/2015/03/10/311d319a-b2f2-11e4-bf39-5560f3918d4b_story.html?utm_term=.b66015a0e3c8

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and the only people they whatabout to defend their people are the people they say are the worst people ever. And don't see anything odd with that.

 

HILLARY IS A CRIMINAL LOCK HER UP

ITS OK FOR TRUMP TO DO THAT SINCE TRUMP TOLD US HILLARY DID IT TOO

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Nah, just pointing out the hypocrisy of screaming "concentration camp" when we've been there and done that.

Not defending nor endorsing the moves at the border.  Did not say anything when Obama did it, not saying anything now.

Please proceed

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5 minutes ago, stirs said:

Nah, just pointing out the hypocrisy of screaming "concentration camp" when we've been there and done that.

Not defending nor endorsing the moves at the border.  Did not say anything when Obama did it, not saying anything now.

Please proceed

The fact that you shared a link reporting on it happening shows that it was indeed a story and people cared about it. You care more about pointing out both sides that what actually happens. 

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2 minutes ago, ImaginaryKev said:

The fact that you shared a link reporting on it happening shows that it was indeed a story and people cared about it. You care more about pointing out both sides that what actually happens. 

My true thoughts are a bit cynical.

I feel that just like many other things, this can be used to raise money and get votes. Perfect for a politician in an election year.

I don't think the pols care one crap.  But some pretty nice "banging on doors" photos will go well to their base and the campaign trail.

Pols care a lot about a lot of things, just before an election.  Not so much afterwards

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Family separation is child abuse point blank.

There are politicians that care about this issue that is why Laura Bush, Melania Trump and others have all called this out.  Calling people that are pointing out child abuse being a matter of USA policy as election year politics is despicable and compete head in the sand tactic.  

 

---http://thehill.com/latino/392790-american-academy-of-pediatrics-president-trumps-family-separation-policy-is-child

The president of the American Academy of Pediatrics on Monday said President Trump's “zero tolerance” policy separating families at the U.S.-Mexico border “amounts to child abuse.” 

Dr. Colleen Kraft in an appearance on CNN described the many ways Trump’s policy emotionally harms children and laid out in detail what she witnessed when she toured an immigration detention center. 

“I can’t describe to you the room I was in with the toddlers,” Kraft said. “Normally toddlers are rambunctious and running around. We had one child just screaming and crying, and the others were really silent. And this is not normal activity or brain development with these children.”

 

Kraft added that the emotional strain the children in these facilities are under produces a condition called “toxic stress” and that it inhibits the development of their brains. 

“It disrupts their brain architecture and keeps them from developing language and social, emotional bonds, and gross motor skills, and the development that they could possibly have,” she said.

Kraft stated that Trump’s policy amounts to “government-sanctioned child abuse” when asked by CNN host Kate Bolduan, saying that the U.S. government is taking away the one constant in these children’s lives. 

 

 

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19 hours ago, stirs said:

Nah, just pointing out the hypocrisy of screaming "concentration camp" when we've been there and done that.

Not defending nor endorsing the moves at the border.  Did not say anything when Obama did it, not saying anything now.

Please proceed

Stirs, you swallowed the Trump fallacy. And all you needed to do was research some facts instead of assuming what Trump told you was true.

Critics of the Trump administration’s separating of families illegally crossing the U.S. border with Mexico have characterized the practice as a distinctly cruel feature of Donald Trump’s presidency.

But some Republican commentators argue the policy is essentially a continuation of previous administrations.

"You know what's ironic? It's the same way Barack Obama did it," conservative commentator Matt Schlapp said during the June 15 broadcast of Fox News' America's Newsroom. "This is the problem with all of these things, the outrage you see coming from the left. There wasn't outrage over Barack Obama separating kids from adults."

While the Obama administration's immigration approach was not without controversy, it’s simply untrue to say he had a policy of separating families.

Trump policy

Let’s recap what the Trump administration is doing, before turning to Obama’s handling of immigration.

Attorney General Jeff Sessions in April announced a "zero-tolerance" policy, meaning every person caught crossing the border illegally would be referred for federal prosecution.

A good number of these people are adult migrants traveling with children. By law, when adults are detained and criminally prosecuted, their children cannot be housed with them in jail. Instead, kids are placed in a Department of Health and Human Services shelter until they can be released to a legal guardian.

Some 2,000 children have been separated from the adults they were traveling with across the U.S. border, according to the latest figures from the Department of Homeland Security. The children were separated from 1,940 adults from April 19 through May 31 as a result of border-crossing prosecutions.

Obama policy

Immigration experts we spoke to said Obama-era policies did lead to some family separations, but only relatively rarely, and nowhere near the rate of the Trump administration. (A Department of Homeland Security spokeswoman said the Obama administration did not count the number of families separated at the border.)

"Obama generally refrained from prosecution in cases involving adults who crossed the border with their kids," said Peter Margulies, an immigration law and national security law professor at Roger Williams University School of Law. "In contrast, the current administration has chosen to prosecute adult border-crossers, even when they have kids. That's a choice — one fundamentally different from the choice made by both Obama and previous presidents of both parties."

Denise Gilman, a law professor who directs the immigration clinic at the University of Texas School of Law, said immigration attorneys "occasionally" saw separated families under the Obama administration.

"However, these families were usually reunited quite quickly once identified," she said, "even if that meant release of a parent from adult detention."

In Trump’s case, family separations are a feature, not a bug, of the administration’s border policies, said David Fitzgerald, who co-directs the Center for Comparative Immigration Studies.

"The family separations are not the small-scale collateral consequences of a border policy, but rather, a deliberate initiative," he added.

Former Obama officials in recent interviews drew sharp distinctions between Trump’s policy and that of his predecessors.

The Trump administration's current approach is modeled after Operation Streamline, a 2005 program under the administration of George W. Bush, according to Obama spokesman Eric Schultz. The key difference, he said, is that while the 2005 program referred all illegal immigrants for prosecution, it made exceptions for adults traveling with children.

Jeh Johnson, Obama’s Homeland Security secretary from 2013 to the end of his presidency, said such separations occurred in rare cases, but never as a matter of policy.

"I can't say that it never happened. There may have been some exigent situation, some emergency," Johnson told NPR June 9. "There may have been some doubt about whether the adult accompanying the child was in fact the parent of the child. I can't say it never happened — but not as a matter of policy or practice. It's not something that I could ask our Border Patrol or our immigration enforcement personnel to do."

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2018/jun/19/matt-schlapp/no-donald-trumps-separation-immigrant-families-was/

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