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ncfan

Bucs release 2016 1st round pick Vernon Hargreaves

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Just now, 1of10Charnatives said:

Not saying it's not possible Hargreaves couldn't be good for someone else, just saying that how willing I am to find out depends on the cost of having him play for us, and especially considering how every dollar we spend on anybody this season is dollar less we have available to pay CMC or other players down the road, I'd think long and hard about whether it's worth whatever it costs. We are all used to thinking of cap space as a use it or lose it asset year to year because until recently that's what it's always been, but we need to adjust our thinking now. Is bringing Hargreaves in to find out if he can be good and the problem was just the team he was on worth having less to pay other players next year?

Next year's money isn't going to matter as much to a GM and coach on hot seats.

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1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

Next year's money isn't going to matter as much to a GM and coach on hot seats.

Fair point.

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37 minutes ago, *FreeFua* said:

Forty-Eight is Chuck confirmed

Yeah...he is

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38 minutes ago, *FreeFua* said:

Forty-Eight is Chuck confirmed

Yeah it is. I figured it out when he started spamming the board with his ramblings 

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Just now, kungfoodude said:

Next year's money isn't going to matter as much to a GM and coach on hot seats.

Yes but it matters to me, and I always focus on me first. 

Kidding aside, one thing I dislike about the realities of the NFL is how coaches and GM's on the hot seat and who are brand new do things that are not necessarily in the team's best interests. My classic example of this is how the new GM at the time for San Diego got rid of some young qb they had named Drew Brees, who was playing damn good football, and made a trade to get his hands on Phillip Rivers, just because Brees wasn't "his guy"  Now, not knocking Rivers, because the dude has had a perfectly fine NFL career and wasn't a bust by any means, but looking back do you think the Chargers should have given up Brees for nothing in order to make way for Rivers? That's an MVP caliber, super bowl ring having qb you let go when he was playing mighty fine football for ZERO compensation because he wasn't "your guy".

GM's who do crap like this piss me off to no end.

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1 minute ago, uncfan888 said:

Yeah it is. I figured it out when he started spamming the board with his ramblings 

Plus all of his previous versions always deny it is him in very similar ways. 

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1 minute ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

Yes but it matters to me, and I always focus on me first. 

Kidding aside, one thing I dislike about the realities of the NFL is how coaches and GM's on the hot seat and who are brand new do things that are not necessarily in the team's best interests. My classic example of this is how the new GM at the time for San Diego got rid of some young qb they had named Drew Brees, who was playing damn good football, and made a trade to get his hands on Phillip Rivers, just because Brees wasn't "his guy"  Now, not knocking Rivers, because the dude has had a perfectly fine NFL career and wasn't a bust by any means, but looking back do you think the Chargers should have given up Brees for nothing in order to make way for Rivers? That's an MVP caliber, super bowl ring having qb you let go when he was playing mighty fine football for ZERO compensation because he wasn't "your guy".

GM's who do crap like this piss me off to no end.

That's actually not true. Brees was coming off of shoulder surgery. That was why they opted to move on.

A better example would be O'Brien in Houston and his selling off the franchise future to save his ass this year.

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4 minutes ago, Shocker said:

Yeah...he is

 

3 minutes ago, uncfan888 said:

Yeah it is. I figured it out when he started spamming the board with his ramblings 

I feel unloved. No one ever accuses me of being some prior guy's alt.

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8 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

That's actually not true. Brees was coming off of shoulder surgery. That was why they opted to move on.

A better example would be O'Brien in Houston and his selling off the franchise future to save his ass this year.

Even if Brees had sholder surgery, so what? he was young and had put up pretty solid to impressive numbers Rivers rookie year. I wasn't privy to the medical report on the shoulder injury but at the time it wasn't pushing 40 Drew Brees, it was young, almost certainly likely to fully recover from said injury Drew Brees, and in any event, Brees played and played very well Rivers rookie year. Releasing him for no compensation after that just isn't a very defensible move imo.

The key point is the GM went out of his way to draft Rivers when he had a perfectly capable qb already on his roster. Any injury couldn't reasonably be expected at that point to be career ending or destroying, the primary motivation for giving up on Brees was he wasn't the GM's guy.

O brien also a good example and probably easier for most people to relate to given it's recent nature.

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7 minutes ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

Even if Brees had sholder surgery, so what? he was young and had put up pretty solid to impressive numbers Rivers rookie year. I wasn't privy to the medical report on the shoulder injury but at the time it wasn't pushing 40 Drew Brees, it was young, almost certainly likely to fully recover from said injury Drew Brees, and in any event, Brees played and played very well Rivers rookie year. Releasing him for no compensation after that just isn't a very defensible move imo.

Actually the league had largely viewed him as a mild bust, especially after his 2005 drop off. He was not a terribly impressive QB in San Diego. And his shoulder injury was considered so serious that most of the league would not touch him. It was not a normal shoulder injury and was pretty serious. 

Plus, Rivers got drafted in 2004. That was directly a result of Brees extremely poor play prior to that 2004 season. It wasn't until Rivers was drafted that Brees got motivated to turn his career around, and then he had that traumatic injury. That's why the Chargers moved on and it was pretty widely viewed as a sound decision at the time. 

Edit: Seriously, Google that injury. You will see why people didn't want to sign him. Sean Peyton made a big gamble and it paid off in the biggest way.

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3 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Actually the league had largely viewed him as a mild bust, especially after his 2005 drop off. He was not a terribly impressive QB in San Diego. And his shoulder injury was considered so serious that most of the league would not touch him. It was not a normal shoulder injury and was pretty serious. 

Plus, Rivers got drafted in 2004. That was directly a result of Brees extremely poor play prior to that 2004 season. It wasn't until Rivers was drafted that Brees got motivated to turn his career around, and then he had that traumatic injury. That's why the Chargers moved on and it was pretty widely viewed as a sound decision at the time. 

Ok. I recognize this version. That first one was fiction. 

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13 minutes ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

Even if Brees had sholder surgery, so what? he was young and had put up pretty solid to impressive numbers Rivers rookie year. I wasn't privy to the medical report on the shoulder injury but at the time it wasn't pushing 40 Drew Brees, it was young, almost certainly likely to fully recover from said injury Drew Brees, and in any event, Brees played and played very well Rivers rookie year. Releasing him for no compensation after that just isn't a very defensible move imo.

The key point is the GM went out of his way to draft Rivers when he had a perfectly capable qb already on his roster. Any injury couldn't reasonably be expected at that point to be career ending or destroying, the primary motivation for giving up on Brees was he wasn't the GM's guy.

O brien also a good example and probably easier for most people to relate to given it's recent nature.

No, it really was considered career threatening. Very much so and not just by the Chargers.

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Drew Brees being considered questionable...

Boy, those were the days :)

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5 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Actually the league had largely viewed him as a mild bust, especially after his 2005 drop off. He was not a terribly impressive QB in San Diego. And his shoulder injury was considered so serious that most of the league would not touch him. It was not a normal shoulder injury and was pretty serious. 

Plus, Rivers got drafted in 2004. That was directly a result of Brees extremely poor play prior to that 2004 season. It wasn't until Rivers was drafted that Brees got motivated to turn his career around, and then he had that traumatic injury. That's why the Chargers moved on and it was pretty widely viewed as a sound decision at the time. 

Edit: Seriously, Google that injury. You will see why people didn't want to sign him. Sean Peyton made a big gamble and it paid off in the biggest way.

Maybe I wasn't paying close enough attention since it was actually an AFC team on the west coast, I just remember Brees playing quite well Rivers rookie year and then getting released for nothing. Like I said I wasn't pouring over the medical reports on the injury so if you say it was considered unusually severe and risky I'll accept that, I am still skeptical of the notion it might have been the primary determinant, but regardless the obrien situation you brought up is a better illustration of the kind of thing we're talking about anyway, so if I'm wrong, pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

*whistles innocently*

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1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

No, it really was considered career threatening. Very much so and not just by the Chargers.

If it wasn’t considered that, I wouldn’t have had to put up with Saban at Alabama for over a decade now. The medical staff in Miami wouldn’t clear him. 

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