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Jeremy Igo

What you have heard, and what you haven't heard .

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9 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

It may not mean much to you, but I'm pretty sure it means an awful lot to him.

And if Newton ultimately decides there's no way he's playing on that one year deal (which he genuinely could) it may come to a point of getting something over nothing.

Well, that’s the thing. Everybody wants to say it’s a business, part of the business is examining what’s best for the organization. The player does assume the risk. And you would hate to see something bad happen under a one-year deal. But, it would be the most beneficial way to go from the team’s perspective. So, there’s a whole lot of dynamics involved. 

It pretty much comes down to this: if the extension happens, then we pretty much know there’s some confidence about his ability to play at a high-level again. If the extension does not happen, that’s a pretty good indicator that the team, through their research, sees too much risk and a low margin of potential success. 

Boy, if that stupid foot injury never happened, we’d have a clearer picture on things. That damn New England turf.

Edited by ellis
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On the question of what we could get in return, I would also point out this:

Midseason when Newton was still in rehab, it was reported that at least ten teams were willing to trade for him.

What's he done since then?

No new injury issues have come to light. In fact, by the time free agency rolls around, Newton will have been given the better part of a year to do nothing but heal up. Plus he had the surgery to fix the foot issue, as was announced to anyone who cared to listen.

So what reason would there be for those teams (or others) to be less willing to talk trade now than they were then?

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This OP? Rational for the most part. Which is a hard left turn from the previous drivel that was speculating Cam was gone and passing it off as “insider info”. No one is going to argue that anything is possible, it’s possible he’s gone, it’s possible he stays. No one knows. The majority of posts around here have been inane speculation that he’s gone based on the words of morons like Joe Person at best and no one at all in many cases. That bullshit is what has gotten blowback and grief. Not saying it’s possible Cam will be gone. Saying he will be gone.  

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I think a lot of the media leaks are the result of posturing and public relations from both sides. I know Ian Rapoport is in contact with Cam's agent Bus Cook because I've seen him break news releases from Gus in the past. Agents are usually one of the  "anonymous sources" that break news leaks. 

Ultimately it comes down to what will be the best situation for both sides. And I don't think that can be answered in 3 months. That's why I think the Panthers sign Cam to a 1 year extension as a compromise. That way they can have extra time to evaluate and he won't have to assume all of the risk of playing on a lame duck deal with no guaranteed money. 

Tepper has stressed patience so I expect him to be patient in deciding who he wants his QB to be for the next 3-5 years.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, ellis said:

Well, that’s the thing. Everybody wants to say it’s a business, part of the business is examining what’s best for the organization. The player does assume the risk. And you would hate to see something bad happen under a one-year deal. But, it would be the most beneficial way to go from the team’s perspective. So, there’s a whole lot of dynamics involved. 

It pretty much comes down to this: if the extension happens, then we pretty much know there’s some confidence about his ability to play at a high-level again. If the extension does not happen, that’s a pretty good indicator that the team, through their research, sees too much risk and a low margin of potential success. 

Boy, if that stupid foot injury never happened, we’d have a clearer picture on things. That damn New England turf.

Well said. 

Dont you just know Bellicheck rigged the turf somehow?

 

unrelated: I’ll be afk for a bit, gotta run to the store, out of tinfoil for the hat. You know you have to refresh weekly with a new layer right?

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2 minutes ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

Well said. 

Dont you just know Bellicheck rigged the turf somehow?

 

unrelated: I’ll be afk for a bit, gotta run to the store, out of tinfoil for the hat. You know you have to refresh weekly with a new layer right?

gotta get the heavy duty, and not generic heavy duty.  gotta go with reynolds wrap heavy duty otherwise the elf waves can get thru

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7 minutes ago, ellis said:

Well, that’s the thing. Everybody wants to say it’s a business, part of the business is examining what’s best for the organization. The player does assume the risk. And you would hate to see something bad happen under a one-year deal. But, it would be the most beneficial way to go from the team’s perspective. So, there’s a whole lot of dynamics involved. 

It pretty much comes down to this: if the extension happens, then we pretty much know there’s some confidence about his ability to play at a high-level again. If the extension does not happen, that’s a pretty good indicator that the team, through their research, sees too much risk and a low margin of potential success. 

Boy, if that stupid foot injury never happened, we’d have a clearer picture on things. That damn New England turf.

I'll grant an extension is possible, but I have a really hard time imagining it.

Rodrigue has reported that Tepper was iffy on the idea of extending Newton at the time he bought the team. The last two years haven't exactly done a lot to bolster that idea.

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5 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

I'll grant an extension is possible, but I have a really hard time imagining it.

Rodrigue has reported that Tepper was iffy on the idea of extending Newton at the time he bought the team. The last two years haven't exactly done a lot to bolster that idea.

I believe I read somewhere that Tepper understands the cost of a quality QB1 and knows that $19M is a bit of a bargain. IF he believes Cam is healthy and can stay that way, Cam could be a bargain for the next few years. Maybe. 

I think draft position will determine a lot, as well. Drafting 9-12 doesn't necessarily provide confidence that Burrow or Tua will be available. Hard to trade away Cam if your fallback option is a Kyle Allen or an untested Will Grier. If trading Cam brings them the draft position necessary to obtain one of these two, then I could see that possibility.

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I do get annoyed with how many people have been so definitive about this issue for the better part of the season. I am pretty sure that neither Cam nor David Tepper knows if he will be a Panther next year at this point. 

The level of uncertainty has increased since the coach firing and announcement of the FO overhaul, not decreased. 

We will know what happens when it comes closer to the time for that decision to actually be made. Everything up to this point has just been idle speculation or reports of casual discussions from either camp. 

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OP predicted that Joe Burrow would slide to the panthers. That should say it all to anyone that pays attention to the NFL.

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2 hours ago, Jeremy Igo said:

"Cam is our guy. We are committed to him and will build around him."

Or perhaps...

"Cam is the starting QB of the Carolina Panthers, period."

These were the sentiments of the past 8 off seasons. There has never been a single hint of waivering on Cam, until now.

The latest statement of "Yes we prefer a healthy Cam Newton to start but remains open to trade offers" falls well short of the statements above. It is the first time in Cam's career that it has ever been said. Cam hasn't been fully healthy at the start of the season in quite a while, yet he has always been the unquestioned starter, point blank. 

Like it or not, what we are hearing now is a deviation from what has been the norm in the franchise's stance on Cam, historically. These nuances in language are significant. A "healthy" qualifier. Open to trade? That's new. 

Will Cam be a Panther in 2020? Possibly

Will he be traded? Possibly

Could he fail a physical? Possibly

Could he hold out? Possibly

This is the entire point. Cam's circumstances in Carolina are a complete unknown for the first time in his entire career. There are so many variables at play that absolutely nothing would surprise me. To pretend otherwise is just wishful thinking.

 

  Hide contents

 

This thread will be full of irrational and emotional hatred to anyone that says cam may not be here next year.

 

 

The point your trying to make seems like a well duh and not in the favor of the point your trying to make. "for the first time ever Cam isnt being endorsed as the franchise qb". Well duh.. coming off these injuries not finishing the season twice add in being 30 plus this shoulder injuries nature why would they lock in to that? Not to mention that on top of a new owner and head coach with no ties to him. Well duh...

The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence though. You cant use the lack of commitment to push the narrative he is being pushed out and all but gone. Or that the team is set on moving on. It could be they are keeping all options on the table as they should in light of what I spoke on earlier. However that doesn't mean barring some news we dont know about they aren't considering keeping him. Could he be wearing thin on second chances? Absolutely. 

That doesn't mean we are moving on. What your leaving off and will write off is,that tepper on two separate occasions months ago and recently said he has spoken to Newton and talks were positive and on good terms. Like they are in a good place. A angry disgruntled player out the door wouldn't be all happy about it I assume. Unless a team is willing to give up a first or a Jalen ramsey type bounty a second round pick doesn't get a trade done.

In light of the kyle Allen show the sentiment around the league has been. Maybe we should rethink this trade cam thing, 19 million isnt that bad. It's a deal actually. No team is gonna surrender the return on the investment for Newton that it would take to move him. Your most likely stuck with him at least for a year till teams can see what he can do and is he healthy. But keep this fire and brimstone approach and the idea we fall into burrow which if we could land I'm all for moving on. But that is extremely unlikely.

Edited by micnificent28
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1 hour ago, NAS said:

Good post. I think it also matters that we haven’t heard from Cam that he is willing to play without an extension, and one year left on his contract, and prove he can still play and stay healthy.  That is the biggest wildcard in all of this. Anything else and Panthers have no choice but to move on.

I mean honestly Cam should play without an extension. I mean this season was supposed to be his prove it year. We didnt get that. He needs to show he can string a healthy season together before he gets a big check. Also it would be good for him. One good year would make him millions more on his next contract.

Edited by TheMaulClaw
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1 hour ago, Mr. Scot said:

We've thought Newton was fully or at least mostly healthy a couple of times before. 

It's a mistake to think that just because a guy looks healthy in Week 1 he's still going to look equally healthy around week 10.

Who thought that? Most used the luck time table as a reference. That was suppose to be this season and not before. Of course Cam will always want to play through injuries.. its who he is. Coaching staff has to say no.

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1 hour ago, ellis said:

That’s a fair point. And that’s the risk. I’ve said in the past and I’ll say it again, this is not a slam dunk decision. I just think many folks are understating his value beyond throwing the ball, while at the same time overstating the amount of capital you would get in return via trade. 

His ability to read defenses is highly undervalued. Also: Over 40% of his career runs, designed or otherwise, lead to a fresh set of downs. Think of how many red zone (Goalline) opportunities this team has missed on in his absence. And while I understand his shoulder could take a brutal hit in the open field, that’s just part of his game and where ever he plays next, that won’t change. I think he’s far more likely to get hurt standing in a messy pocket trying to deliver on a deep route. 

Turner did a good job of reinventing Newton’s game. More WCO concepts from the route tree, less vertical volume. But, no: at no time was he told to stop running. In fact, he was still running with great success well into last season.

My understanding regarding the shoulder is that some of this damage is irreversible, and will limit his career by a few years. And I definitely understand the arthritis portion of it. But considering he’s just now 30, my suggestion has been to give him at least a few more years to see what he can do with these very talented skill players.

I see this ALL THE TIME around here.  "He only gets hurt in the pocket"....which is simply not true.

Cam's worst injuries have been outside the pocket.  Chases INT down for the 1st shoulder injury, concussion in ATL, broken back in his truck, scrambling (in the pocket, but didn't need to scramble) in the preseason.  The TJ Watt hit took place in the pocket, but that initial injury was already there.

 

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