MHS831

The more I think about it, I would not be surprised to see them draft Legette (WR) and Saintrisil (CB) in round 2.  I would think they will go after a LB in round 3.  After that, I expect a slot WR at 101.  A RB and maybe a C in the fifth round. 

I saw NFL Network interview Jackson Powell Johnson (C) from Oregon--and if a player like him is there, we take the C and the CB in round 2.  (After doing some thinking, I think there is something to the Panthers taking Saintrisil to start at Nickel with pick 33.  They do not want him falling to 37 for his former coach to pick...I hated the idea when I heard it, but I get it.  I never would have considered it, but I understand the pick in terms of a dawg on D and and a player who starts (at nickel) day 1.   I am not sold on Legette--are they giving the X job to Johnson and want some competition for Mingo at the Z position?  Gonna be drama.

These few days of practice will tell Canales what he needs.  If Mingo has developed and shows signs of being able to play the Z, we could go F or slot WR in the draft--there are some 4 WR sets and this is probably Thielen's last season here anyway.  We could draft 2 as well.  No guarantees Johnson returns for 2025. 

1 minute ago, mrcompletely11 said:

you think young reads this board?  We are in deep poo if he does

My post answers this question quite thoroughly.  What is the point in trashing him?  Does it make you feel better? Nobody is in disagreement about his play needing to improve and that starts with the OL, WRs, coaching, etc.  If he still can't get it done, he will be replaced.  I have been endorsing a trade down to add a second rounder in the 2025 draft so that we can move up if we need to for a QB next year.  That is covering the reality that he might not be the answer, but I also know that blaming him and ignoring the conditions he was asked to perform in is not fair to him.  Give him his tools.

7 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

you think either way will affect him?

It could, indirectly.  My question to you is, do you perform better under constant criticism or constant support?  Support him--that is not hard. If the fan base stews in negativity all year, it gets into the water and everyone starts thinking the QB is the anti-Christ based on reputation and hearsay. Do you think players do not know how the public feels about them? He has a pretty good excuse, and all players have mechanical issues they could improve.  Yes, he is short. No he did not have a good season last year.  Turn the page.  If he does not work out, we will move on---what is the point in the constant belittlement?   However, it has reached the point where Huddlers think they know more that the coaches and management--Newsflash--we don't. In toxic cultures, the first time he makes a mistake all the haters at the stadium get loud to vindicate their opinions---I was right!! in other words.  We all know the situation.  What point is there in trashing a 23-year old kid who was asked to perform in outrageous situations?   Support him.  I guess it could say more about the critic than the target. 

Most rookie QB bust.  However, as a fan, you have to decide, "Am I going to support him, or throw him under the bus?"  You have a right to do either, although I might reconsider the use of the word "fan" here.

awareness is good.  Nice plan. 

11 hours ago, 45catfan said:

Traded back from #39 got Pearsall at #44 AND added two extra picks. 

I would be partying in May if this was our draft.  For some reason, I do not think Pearsall is getting the respect he deserves.  Tampa is solid.  In my mocks, I go for 2 CBs (nickel and outside depth)--but then again, I live on the edge.

I am not sure that you can compare this draft to those of recent memory.  This is a loaded draft, and if you ever were to trade down, this would be the draft.  However, if your scouts suck and your GM is an idiot, as was the case in the past, trading back only opens the door for hindsight experts to go back in a year or two and start the "We coulda had..." process.  I think we can drop and add a third or so and do well, but until the cards start hitting the table, it is hard to say right now.

The best we could hope for would be a third, but I am not sure you get that by dropping 7 spots.  However, the long-term, smart move is to swap second round picks for a second rounder next year.  Without a second rounder next season, we are in no position to move around the first if we need to move up.  

2 minutes ago, Ricky Spanish said:

From the numerous draft profiles I have read since the DUI, said DUI was not surprising to scouts in the least.

Changing my tune--I would probably take him off my board.  MAYBE if we were a good team and there were strong, established leaders, but the leadership on the panthers (Thompson, Brown, Moton, in my view) is not vocal.  He needs a Ray Lewis to put the fear in him.

15 minutes ago, Ornias said:

3rd round would be worth a gamble depending on the board. We have to nail the 1st 2 picks though, which I have no confidence in us doing. 

Third (65) is too high for him, imo.  Maybe 101.  However, while some are saying "he needs a second chance" and I believe that because I did as well, sometimes you give a kid like that $2m per year and you know what he does with it.  I would need to know where his head is right now, and the recent DWI is not a good sign.  Is he a "dawg?"  I would not think so.

Going out on a limb here---I would not frown if we drafted a player on day 2 who could make us nasty at nickel. Our defense requires a nickel who can come up and hit you.  Secondly, he could serve as an emergency WR should we ever need one--this could allow us to keep 5 WRs on the active roster, saving us a roster spot (not to suggest that we would do that, but still, he was not bad at WR). I would then allow Troy Hill to play behind all three positions and as the fourth CB if we go dime. 

I see the logic and, after reading more on the guy, he is a dawg (alpha) and he will play day 1.  If we grabbed a WR and CB round 2 with both expected to get PT early, I would get it.

Great topic.  I would do my homework--a lot about him screams 360 lb Johnny Manziel.   But under Brown's wing, I see him growing up and worth a day 3 pick. 

Giving this some thought after doing some research (watching TV all day and Googling stuff). This is not my opinion---repeat--this is not my opinion, but there is some logic behind this statement that makes it rather believable.  Here are some bulleted FACTS that support a decision to draft Sainristil in round 2: 

• Apparently, Sainristil is the best nickel CB in the draft. 
• With the new offenses (According to Steve Smith) the slot or (F receiver as he called it) is playing a bigger role.  The nickel CB is now considered a starter because they are on the field most of the time.
• Sainristil is an "alpha" or "dawg" at Michigan-considered to be a team leader if not the team leader.
• He is considered a good tackler--important for a nickel.
• He has experience playing some WR at Michigan (I did not know this--see the video below)
• Right now, Troy Hill is listed as the starting nickel CB.  He will be 33 years old.  For the past three seasons, his PFF score has been just above 60 on average--serviceable, but at 33, you have lost a step.  We need 2 nickels.  The Panthers have (on paper) two starting CBs. 
• If you are looking for players who will start or play a lot in 2024, Nickel CB could be the spot where you would get more bang for the buck.  A WR, OL, LB, or even outside CB may not see the field immediately.

Here are some supportive stuffs and picture proofs for those of you not two good with words:

https://www.si.com/college/michigan/football/michigan-football-mike-sainristil-pff-jim-harbaugh-wolverines-steve-clinkscale

3 hours ago, Cavscout said:

Great, unless there is a good long snapper available at 33...

think about Rhule--what a tool.  He brings in his old players from Baylor and Temple--forget the SEC or Big 10--and then he lets his wife pick a RB on day 3 of a draft and then drafts a long snapper.  In fact, Chubba might be the best pick ever made during that era.

45 and I (among others) think this is a probability (not trying to put words in his mouth) but in THIS draft, I think it could be the thing to do--reason?  We have 3-4 pressing needs that we seem to want to address:  WR, LB, CB, and RB.  I could have added C and TE and another WR---

This would leave a QB (Nix) available at #33, and I have heard that Denver, Seattle, and some team you would not expect might be interested.

Drafted in First Round: 6 OTs,  6 WRs, 5 QBs, 5 CBs, 4 Edges, 3 OLs, 2 DLs, 1 TE.  (this might be the worst-case scenerio for Panther fans, imo)

Best Remaining  (May have missed a few)

• Jackson Powers-Johnson C
• Keon Coleman WR
• Xavier Worthy WR
• Troy Franklin WR
• Ricky Pearsall WR
• Xavier Leggette WR
• Ennis Rakestraw CB
• Mike Sainristel CB
• Zack Frazier C
• Payton Wilson LB

Before this version, he had the Panthers trading into Round 1 for Brian Thomas.  THIS IS NOT THE MOST CURRENT MOCK--THAT IS PROVIDED BELOW:

So based on this, who do you take?

Brendan Donahue, the #1 most accurate mock drafter over the past five NFL seasons according to The Huddle Report, gives you his 2024 NFL Mock Draft — making predictions for every team and every pick in the first round. 

2024 NFL Mock Draft

1 minute ago, mrcompletely11 said:

I doubt we trade back from 33 unless a qb or 2 have dropped.   I would simply go BPA at 33 if we stayed there and use 39 as a play chip after we see how the draft is going

I think the smart money is to listen, only take a great offer. 

31 minutes ago, SurvivalSloth said:

I'm not a fan of the two dimes > one quarter mindset. Take the BPA. 

When I have mocked, I do not like the trade down scenarios, but I am trying to fill that second round pick in 2025.  I think you trade to keep from reaching.

Just now, Jay Roosevelt said:

Depends entirely on the situation.

Who's on the board? How far are we trading down? What are we getting in return?

I don't have any issues with trading down, but it needs to make sense. I do think often times staying where you are and taking the better player provides more value than trading down and getting 2 or more lesser players.

And the bottom line is the talent available.  This draft should have some studs at 33 when in the past, there was a drop off.  Markets are about supply and demand, not history.

Nobody said the trade had to be franchise changing--and this draft is loaded--where the level of talent drops around 7, then again around 15 but the shelf for the next tier stays pretty flat until about 40. 

Take the last example--a fourth to move up 5 spaces.  If I did not have a player I liked, or if there were three or four on my board there, I might take that deal.

The reason there is not a lot of action is not because there is no interest.  When Marty drafted Jimmy Clausen, he actually tried to trade up to 33 with the Rams, but they turned him away.  Chances are a player with first round talent drops to #33, making it the equivalent of trading a first for a second and fourth.  That is not equal value.

The Panthers really need to replace that missing second rounder in the 2025 draft to give them capital they might need to move up in round 1 for a QB if they need to do that.

Keeping that in mind, I might consider a future second to swap 2024 second rounders. 

5 hours ago, CRA said:

yeah, and I think he clearly has had some hardships.  Losing both his parents.  His support system simply might be more Carolina based and important to him and less mobile.   I couldsee  him getting cherry picked to some random city across the country maybe being harder for him and him wanting to stay close to what he knows. 

I mean, I think it is clear he wants to play for us.  Which to me, is a positive.  I think he is playing that card. 

I personally really like Leggette.  I've been firm on that for some time.  I just don't like him at the top of round 2. 

that is exactly how I feel.  I would love him at 65.

I have seen Legette going higher in a few mocks, but for the most part, he is a mid second round guy.  I like the kid--and he WANTS to be here-that is saying something.  I remember when we signed Star Loutulei or whatever, from Utah and he said at his presser (paraphrasing):  I guess I know now where I will be living for the next four or five years."

Legette is a boom or bust pick.  Of course, that translate to bust by the time the Huddle processes it.  He is a 21 year old kid who wants to play for his home state team and he is talking it up.  Good for him.

17 minutes ago, rayzor said:

get both.

Hard to say, but It doesn't sound like this journalist thinks TE is in the cards.

Having the #1 seat at the waiver wire table could be huge if a team reluctantly has to cut a decent player.