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Westworld Season 2


Moorgan

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I am really curious when it comes to the Delores and Maeve characters. We saw them together for the first time in quite a while this last episode. So, it seems to be Delores has become full sentient based on the fact, among other things, that she remembers absolutely everything now and is intend on taking down the entire human world. "The beauty of the world is wasted on the living". However, Maeve has become self aware due to her programming being jacked up into God mode. She has control over the other hosts as well. Does this mean she has control over a sentient Delores? If not, why? If so, what are the repercussions? I think Maeve is still following her programming, though. To find her daughter.

 

Much of this so far as I can tell, out of two episodes this season is all the new Narrative Ford designed last season before his bitter end. I also can't help to think there is going to be an A.I. baby born for some reason. Maybe that is the reason for the harvesting of human DNA by Devos?

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37 minutes ago, Datawire said:

I am really curious when it comes to the Delores and Maeve characters. We saw them together for the first time in quite a while this last episode. So, it seems to be Delores (Wyatt) has become full sentient based on the fact, among other things, that she remembers absolutely everything now and is intend on taking down the entire human world. "The beauty of the world is wasted on the living". However, Maeve has become self aware due to her programming being jacked up into God mode. She has control over the other hosts as well. Does this mean she has control over a sentient Delores? If not, why? If so, what are the repercussions? I think Maeve is still following her programming, though. To find her daughter.

 

Much of this so far as I can tell, out of two episodes this season is all the new Narrative Ford designed last season before his bitter end. I also can't help to think there is going to be an A.I. baby born for some reason. Maybe that is the reason for the harvesting of human DNA by Devos?

Ive seen no basis that delores is sentient, it appears that she is running the narrative Ford last fed her - it includes her two histories but she still seems to be running through a script.

 

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4 minutes ago, Fryfan said:

Ive seen no basis that delores is sentient, it appears that she is running the narrative Ford last fed her - it includes her two histories but she still seems to be running through a script.

 

I believe she gained sentience a long time ago and part of the maze was for her to realize Arnold's voice is her own. She understood Ford's control and the only way she could really be free is to kill Ford. Ford's whole speech to her about the Michelangelo painting (last episode of season one) was more or less him explaining that to her in my opinion.

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18 hours ago, Datawire said:

Much of this so far as I can tell, out of two episodes this season is all the new Narrative Ford designed last season before his bitter end. I also can't help to think there is going to be an A.I. baby born for some reason. Maybe that is the reason for the harvesting of human DNA by Devos?

Are you saying that the hosts new found sentience is all prgrammed and not real? That it's all part of the narrative that Ford created? I like that idea but for whom is the narrative created? What human is it for? Man in black? I need to watch the episodes again.

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10 hours ago, Moorgan said:

Are you saying that the hosts new found sentience is all prgrammed and not real? That it's all part of the narrative that Ford created? I like that idea but for whom is the narrative created? What human is it for? Man in black? I need to watch the episodes again.

Oh my. I am saying a few things that anyone could conjure up at this point in the show. We don't know! Haha! But it's sure is fun to speculate.

So, a few things. As soon as Dolores blew Dr. Ford’s brains out in the Westworld Season 1 finale, kicking off the robot revolution, it seemed the show was telling us rather clearly that Ford's theme park (narrative?) mastermind was done. Going back to what I mentioned in regards to Ford's speech to Delores, he said “Mozart, Beethoven and Chopin never died. They just became music.” I myself took that as meaning immortality. But who's? His, Delores's, Williams, Bernards, Maeve's? These characters seem to be the centerpiece at the moment.

In season one Theresa notices that Dr. Ford is building a new host from scratch in his secret area of the park. Who was this new host going to be? Probably not your average drink slinger. When we see Dolores embrace her newfound free will to off Ford, she may have been shooting the completed host model of Ford, rather than Ford the man. After all, this is another situation like we saw with Arnold, who died and was rebuilt as a host. On the other hand we may have just been watching another classic Westworld illusion. So, maybe Ford just decided to relinquish his favorite thing, control, by ending his own life because his new Narrative is the pillar of his (or someone else's) existence.

So far, these two episodes have focused outward. We see Delores in the real world in a modern setting. In the first season, I don't recall which episode, it's mentioned she was one of the first, if not the first. Also before his death, Ford spoke often about a new phase of the game that involved his final narrative. He called it “Journey Into Night".

Yeah I went back and watched a coupe episodes.

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I am still convinced we are watching the final narrative.  Delores is following her script - her script has her killing ford (who may or may not be a host).  Her script has her starting the revolution.   

 

She is not free, she is running her programmed loop.

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Fryfan said:

I am still convinced we are watching the final narrative.  Delores is following her script - her script has her killing ford (who may or may not be a host).  Her script has her starting the revolution.   

 

She is not free, she is running her programmed loop.

 

 

so you think Ford's masterplan was to start a robot revolution via programming and to give the illusion that true AI had developed?  Then at the end Delores be like sike, Ford told me to do this?   As the gotcha? 

So then what? Teddy shoots Delores and be like, but this ain't in the script!!  and has an I'm a real boy Pinocchio moment?  

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2 minutes ago, CRA said:

so you think Ford's masterplan was to start a robot revolution via programming and to give the illusion that true AI had developed?  Then at the end Delores be like sike, Ford told me to do this?   As the gotcha? 

So then what? Teddy shoots Delores and be like, but this ain't in the script!!  and has an I'm a real boy Pinocchio moment?  

I think Ford wanted to blow things up as he saw what Delos really was.   

The revolution is real - it just was set up by Ford to burn things to the ground.  Delores dialogue is over the top scripted, its not sentience its a script.

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Fryfan said:

I think Ford wanted to blow things up as he saw what Delos really was.   

The revolution is real - it just was set up by Ford to burn things to the ground.  Delores dialogue is over the top scripted, its not sentience its a script.

 

 

I mean I would say that definitely is a realistic take. 

in your scenario I almost prefer the Ford that was killed be a host.  With Ford actually coming back and for him to of been "hiding out" in some remote/hidden part of Westworld or something the whole time.  

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32 minutes ago, Fryfan said:

  The revolution is real - it just was set up by Ford to burn things to the ground.  Delores dialogue is over the top scripted, its not sentience its a script.

I happen to think she has been off script for some time now. That moment, for me at least, came last season when she realized the voice in her head wasn't Arnold's, but her own, that's the moment where she became sentient and self aware. She wasn't acting off a program of Arnold's anymore, she's listening to her own voice in her head and thus making her own decisions. She shot Ford by choice.

I am simply basing this assumption on what we have witnessed so far in the show that bears very compelling evidence she has become sentient. There's a million things in the "she's real" bucket and not much of anything but speculation in the other bucket.

I suppose you could argue she is following the Wyatt script but one of the problems I see with that is Ford never activated the Wyatt narrative in Dolores. Throughout her entire storyline, Dolores never once breaks from her journey through the maze (her memories) to act on Wyatt's narrative, nor does she ever even mention Wyatt. Dolores does not ever even know who "Wyatt" is because "Wyatt" is not a person to her. "Wyatt" was a narrative (a sequence of actions) Arnold wrote for Dolores. Ford specifically says Wyatt is a character they were working on but never finished.

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So Ford, not wanting the company to just take everything he has worked for, writes a script/narrative that gives the illusion of robots becoming self aware and killing everyone so that the company won't continue to pursue the AI avenue (as it's too dangerous). Meanwhile, he created a host of himself and that's who Dolores shot at the end of Season 1. Furthermore, he is sitting alone somewhere overseeing the scripted chaos he created. The big reveal (possibly revealed by Ford appearing himself) will be that the robots aren't self aware and this was all a script and then the final twist would likely be an action by a robot that gives the audience the doubt that maybe they JUST NOW became self aware (perhaps by one of them killing the newly revealed Ford as he is in shock by the action).

It's a thought. I like shows that make me think about them. So even if this is way off, I like not knowing.

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I think Ford has a heavy hand in what's happening this season. I'm not smart enough to put the dots together yet, but him teasing the MiB plus his sketchy activity last season. It seems like he had a plan. 

 

Also how on brand is the theme of collecting users data? There was a line in season one, can't remember who said it maybe Tessa Thompson's character: that the park was something different for the guests, the bosses and something entirely different for the board. 

Guests: Grand theft auto

Bosses (Ford): AI intelligence 

Board: Guest Data 

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Ok this last episode only reaffirms my idea that Delores is sentient. Why you may ask? Because of Teddy. She gave him the same choice she made that prompted her "awakening"; should I pull the trigger? Then she went to watch if he did. She wanted him to choose for "himself" and, he did.

This is the first we have heard her mention Wyatt. And I was surprised by it. However, going back to the 1st episode this season she said something to the affect, 'she's fully aware of her multiple personalities, they are all part of who she is'.

I have noticed her accents. In the war scenes I noticed she had the farm girl accent, and then sure enough, we see her father. It's also interesting how Maeve seems to have climbed the pyramid from memory through improvisation and self-interest to consciousness, whereas Dolores made it to the center of the maze and realized the narrative voice she was hearing is her own.

Another side note, in season one it was Teddy's mission to kill Wyatt. Hmm

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