REPORT: Panthers changed the offense 3 times last season

[strato]

2 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

I think the hunger games mentality absolutely stemmed from Bryce 

Speaking of, I never watched that movie. Do I have to watch it so I can understand what they mean? I would consider it a chore. 

[NorthTryon]

A bunch of Indy fans that I knew laughed at us when we hired Frank. They were completely done with him even more so than any of us with Fox and Rivera. It was more along the line of Rhule. Frank's number one go to move was to get a dinosaur of a yesteryear QB and then try to make it work. It was a weaker version of Fox's vision. Fox just lucked into Delhomme. The talking heads were like Frank has to try with a younger QB. Bryce or CJ, Frank wasn't happy and then what a sad hodgepodge thrown together and labeled an All Star cast. What happens when you take a ton of different people with different staunchly so philosophies? No one can agree on anything. And that would have been toxic for CJ, Bryce, or Anthony R. So I get it, the kid is short and doesn't have the strongest arm. But the negativity is just out of control. I told you so doesn't make you feel better later, because I thought Reich was a stupid hire and he looked like he had zero energy from day one. That ended up being the case, but harping on it ain't gonna retroactively make Tepper give Wilks a shot. Everybody wanted the young coordinator so that "he can't be stolen away from a defensive head coach", but hate this one's enthusiasm. Last year they looked terrible in the joint practice. This year they looked much better. Huddle attitude is exactly the same though, overwhelmingly negative. I just wonder what everybody is going to say if they look halfway competent. Seriously, this is the guy that turned Geno Smith and Baker Mayfield from laughing stocks to NFL competitors. There are no t-shirts for being the guy who said we were gonna suck first. 

[strato]

23 minutes ago, NorthTryon said:

A bunch of Indy fans that I knew laughed at us when we hired Frank. They were completely done with him even more so than any of us with Fox and Rivera. It was more along the line of Rhule. Frank's number one go to move was to get a dinosaur of a yesteryear QB and then try to make it work. It was a weaker version of Fox's vision. Fox just lucked into Delhomme. The talking heads were like Frank has to try with a younger QB. Bryce or CJ, Frank wasn't happy and then what a sad hodgepodge thrown together and labeled an All Star cast. What happens when you take a ton of different people with different staunchly so philosophies? No one can agree on anything. And that would have been toxic for CJ, Bryce, or Anthony R. So I get it, the kid is short and doesn't have the strongest arm. But the negativity is just out of control. I told you so doesn't make you feel better later, because I thought Reich was a stupid hire and he looked like he had zero energy from day one. That ended up being the case, but harping on it ain't gonna retroactively make Tepper give Wilks a shot. Everybody wanted the young coordinator so that "he can't be stolen away from a defensive head coach", but hate this one's enthusiasm. Last year they looked terrible in the joint practice. This year they looked much better. Huddle attitude is exactly the same though, overwhelmingly negative. I just wonder what everybody is going to say if they look halfway competent. Seriously, this is the guy that turned Geno Smith and Baker Mayfield from laughing stocks to NFL competitors. There are no t-shirts for being the guy who said we were gonna suck first. 

I agree wholly on a lot of that but you know, Stroud is not Bryce. He is more what those guys might have had in common. Bryce is a unique puzzle by comparison. So I’m not sure at all that they would have been as dysfunctional and divided. 

[Mr Mojo Risin]

4 hours ago, CRA said:

I mean, I just think there are Bryce and Stroud differences. 

I think Stroud can be inserted into offenses in a manner you can't do with Bryce.  I think even last year, Stroud fits into Frank's O better.  I think Stroud fits into what Canales has been around better. 

I think Bryce is a unicorn.  We opted to draft a unicorn and not treat him as such.  And nothing really matters if you don't treat him as such. 

 

There is definitely some truth to what you say but Bryce was not the main reason of discord within the offensive coaching staff. Everything was thrown together without a real clue or concrete plan in place including the selection of Young. I think our offense will be better just on the fact that they will be more aligned on what its going to take to be successful on offense with the players we have versus the "throw it at the wall and see if it sticks approach" we had last year. I dont think well be top 10 but at least watchable and in more games than we were last year forsure.

Edited August 20 by Mr Mojo Risin

[PNW_PantherMan]

3 hours ago, NorthTryon said:

There are no t-shirts for being the guy who said we were gonna suck first. 

Damn that might be a pretty good business idea

[Mr Mojo Risin]

3 hours ago, NorthTryon said:

A bunch of Indy fans that I knew laughed at us when we hired Frank. They were completely done with him even more so than any of us with Fox and Rivera. It was more along the line of Rhule. Frank's number one go to move was to get a dinosaur of a yesteryear QB and then try to make it work. It was a weaker version of Fox's vision. Fox just lucked into Delhomme. The talking heads were like Frank has to try with a younger QB. Bryce or CJ, Frank wasn't happy and then what a sad hodgepodge thrown together and labeled an All Star cast. What happens when you take a ton of different people with different staunchly so philosophies? No one can agree on anything. And that would have been toxic for CJ, Bryce, or Anthony R. So I get it, the kid is short and doesn't have the strongest arm. But the negativity is just out of control. I told you so doesn't make you feel better later, because I thought Reich was a stupid hire and he looked like he had zero energy from day one. That ended up being the case, but harping on it ain't gonna retroactively make Tepper give Wilks a shot. Everybody wanted the young coordinator so that "he can't be stolen away from a defensive head coach", but hate this one's enthusiasm. Last year they looked terrible in the joint practice. This year they looked much better. Huddle attitude is exactly the same though, overwhelmingly negative. I just wonder what everybody is going to say if they look halfway competent. Seriously, this is the guy that turned Geno Smith and Baker Mayfield from laughing stocks to NFL competitors. There are no t-shirts for being the guy who said we were gonna suck first. 

I live in Indiana and heard about the same but was hoping they didnt know what they were talking about. Turns out they did!

[Ghostofdelhomme]

There is a very real chance the offense this year will be even worse than last

[kungfoodude]

4 minutes ago, Ghostofdelhomme said:

There is a very real chance the offense this year will be even worse than last

IDK if it's likely that they will be noticeably worse than last year. That's a very tough bar to have to squeeze under.

I am more concerned that they really won't be meaningfully better than last year.

[MtnJax]

Y’all hate Bryce so much you can’t even fathom that at least one of those changes might have happened before the draft even happened, considering you had an offensive coaching staff who had never worked together and all had different ideas and ways of playing/coaching.

[electro's horse]

1 minute ago, MtnJax said:

Y’all hate Bryce so much you can’t even fathom that at least one of those changes might have happened before the draft even happened, considering you had an offensive coaching staff who had never worked together and all had different ideas and ways of playing/coaching.

who knows? maybe the offense was changed 3 times while reich was signing his contract?

gosh us bryce bashers will stop at nothing

[strato]

Okay, really. CJ Stroud is a traditional styled QB that every one of those 2023 coaches had ‘seen’ before. 

You can interchange a different QB for him that does that style of play... it isn’t a CJ vs Bryce comp, it is standard NFL QB style, vs something else with Bryce. We still don’t know what that something else really looks like.

To think that was not difficult or challenging for the coaches to work with, how do I say it? Maybe think about a little more. 

 

[TD alt]

Speaks to the clusterfûck.

[Icege]

16 hours ago, strato said:

So what was it about do you think? If you have said so just point me there I must have missed it.

edit: something did occur to me while digesting this thought and I just happened to have a  brand new roll of tin foil. 

If someone were to leak this about Bryce (if it were true), they would never get access to anything and Tepper would buy their house and tear it down and build a Bryce statue on it. 

I think that if anything, it emphasizes the philosophical differences that we heard about taking place on the staff. Frank Reich and Thomas Brown, while both coming from west coast schemes, had very different approaches. Reich wanted a conservative, ball control reminiscent of what he experienced under Jim Caldwell (who, like Canales, was known to run very often on 1st down). Brown was coming from the Sean McVay/Mike Shanahan tree that emphasized a wide zone scheme and taking advantage of the "rules" that a defense uses to respond to a look.

Reich more than likely had an offense that he was looking to implement when he came in. Once he got Brown as his OC, they had to work together on the system that they were going to run. There's a change right there. I can see at least one of those changes being due to what they believed would be best for Bryce to succeed, but having to change the offense three times for just one player is very difficult to believe. It's just too juicy of a story for a reporter to sit on. I'm also fairly sure with all of the falling out we saw towards the end with the coaching staff that somebody would've thrown Bryce directly under the bus had he been the primary driver behind those changes.

Plus we have no real way of knowing what last year's staff went thru until one of them goes onto a former player's podcast, so I'm not concerned about it.

[strato]

It was last year. It is just interesting, I like to have some understanding wtf happened. I guess my main interest there is really pre all this musical chairs poo. The process that resulted in Fryce. Frank and Brycve.

For myself, I’ve said Canales has the advantage of a whole season, and offseason, and is not going to be surprised, he has a chance to make his plan. His underlings are probably pulling the rope in the same direction. Not expecting any of those issues.