Nic Scourton- PFF Highest Rated Rookie (Week 5)

[strato]

19 minutes ago, frankw said:

I think there are times when we sometimes have difficulty separating Morgan the GM from Morgan the player when assessing his body of work. That comes with the territory of the hire that we made because of our very limited options.

But it all boils down to just how involved are the Tepper's. This organization and front office need to run independently without their interference. I don't know that we will ever see that happen unfortunately.

But I'll let this thread get back to the initial discussion which was about Scourton playing well. Hopefully we see more of that from him and the rest of the rookie class.

You are right about us derailing it. One last thing about separating Morgan the player etx

part of that foe me is I just never believed for a minute that a guy played against QBs like Manning and Brady and all the guys in the ‘00s would buy a 5’10” 185 soaking wet qb with a below NFL average arm and throws from his tippy toes would be be a guy you took at 1.1. Just cannot buy into it. 
And If you took the gig as GM, your dream gig, and that was the QB would you not take the job or would you maybe see if you could navigate it until you might be in a position to get the qb thing reset so you could make it into what you want it to be? 
Done-  now I will return to  praising the rookies. 

[mc52beast]

Don’t worry, Morgan sucks at his job so Nic won’t be any good

[frankw]

15 minutes ago, strato said:

You are right about us derailing it. One last thing about separating Morgan the player etx

part of that foe me is I just never believed for a minute that a guy played against QBs like Manning and Brady and all the guys in the ‘00s would buy a 5’10” 185 soaking wet qb with a below NFL average arm and throws from his tippy toes would be be a guy you took at 1.1. Just cannot buy into it. 
And If you took the gig as GM, your dream gig, and that was the QB would you not take the job or would you maybe see if you could navigate it until you might be in a position to get the qb thing reset so you could make it into what you want it to be? 
Done-  now I will return to  praising the rookies. 

We won't know who specifically was fully in on him before the draft unless Reich speaks out in a couple years and that's only if he chooses to do so. Ultimately I get the sense far too much emphasis was placed on factors not pertaining to assessing the viability of his physical abilities on the field (not participating at the combine given the level of investment that was made should have been a moment of clarity) and moreso on the hype revolving around his football IQ and his personality. The word at the time was that he simply wowed everyone at that dinner before the draft which I assume included Dan Morgan along with Fitterer and Tepper. This fully lines up with how things went down with the Matt Rhule hire too where instead of an approach of due diligence it was an impulsive reaction of being caught up in a moment and deciding this is our guy we don't need to look any further or deeper.

[strato]

6 minutes ago, frankw said:

We won't know who specifically was fully in on him before the draft unless Reich speaks out in a couple years and that's only if he chooses to do so. Ultimately I get the sense far too much emphasis was placed on factors not pertaining to assessing the viability of his physical abilities on the field (not participating at the combine given the level of investment that was made should have been a moment of clarity) and moreso on the hype revolving around his football IQ and his personality. The word at the time was that he simply wowed everyone at that dinner before the draft which I assume included Dan Morgan along with Fitterer and Tepper. This fully lines up with how things went down with the Matt Rhule hire too where instead of an approach of due diligence it was an impulsive reaction of being caught up in a moment and deciding this is our guy we don't need to look any further or deeper.

Yeah I agree with that.and remember the pre draft process. 
 Reich Might talk after he is fully paid and Bryce is out of the league but I doubt it. 
Dan Morgan would have to look me in the eye and say yes I bought into Bryce for mw to believe he was all in. And only if Bryce wasn’t standing there with us. 
 

Edited 1 hour ago by strato

[frankw]

17 minutes ago, strato said:

Yeah I agree with that.and remember the pre draft process. 
 Reich Might talk after he is fully paid and Bryce is out of the league but I doubt it. 
Dan Morgan would have to look me in the eye and say yes I bought into Bryce for mw to believe he was all in. And only if Bryce wasn’t standing there with us. 

I understand where you're coming from in terms of how you feel about Morgan. I would argue that if Morgan was indeed as skeptical as you suggest at that time then he would have made a real attempt to have a legitimate fallback plan in place this year after seeing his #1 overall pick begin the regular season two (now three) consecutive years in a row playing poorly.

[BlazeCarolina]

1 hour ago, Shotgun said:

And obviously Dan was on board with Young too or he would have done more to replace him.

I think there is more of a push behind Bryce than he is allowed to overcome right now, especially given the investment has already been made.

[BlazeCarolina]

2 hours ago, frankw said:

Scott Fitterer and Dan Morgan were basically best friends by their own words. To argue Morgan was an unwitting participant in the pick is just unnecessarily silly.

We can't possibly know.  I know it is not wise to disagree with your boss.  Some suggest the Teppers were the push for Bryce.  We can't know.

I believe he is doing better now than Fitterer, that is the evidence I focus on.

[BlazeCarolina]

2 hours ago, CPcavedweller said:

Bro, Bryce was a Tepper pick. Specifically Nicole. Fitterer did what his boss wanted including moving mountains to get a QB because the ROI is typically high. Quality QB play gets you air time which sells jerseys, seats, etc.

The problem is had he just sucked for one more year we end up with Daniels, Maye, or Williams and get to retain DJ Moore while actively building a core of talent sooner. 

Tepper, screwed that up. 

You are probably right.  My point was, it wasn't Dan's fault.

[L-TownCat]

1 hour ago, Shotgun said:

And obviously Dan was on board with Young too or he would have done more to replace him.

1) the resources used to get Bryce prevent his early release.

2) the roster resources spent around the QB to make it work prevent his early release.

3) the coaching hires purely aimed at salvaging the QB prevent his early release.

4) finally, the owners foolish pride in selecting the QB prevents his early release. 

Good or bad the move to get Bryce has to play out.  It’s almost over tho so hang tight.

[SmokinwithWilly]

11 minutes ago, BlazeCarolina said:

We can't possibly know.  I know it is not wise to disagree with your boss.  Some suggest the Teppers were the push for Bryce.  We can't know.

I believe he is doing better now than Fitterer, that is the evidence I focus on.

Im of the opinion that the Teppers were the push for Bryce. Stroud fit Reich better than Bryce did and designing a brand new offense around a QB for a coach that gets to pick "his guy" doesn't make a whole lot of sense. You could see it in the body language. He lost interest when he didnt get to draft the QB that would fit what he did. Stroud just played football. Simple. Straightforward. Nothing complicated. No outlier unicorn qualities. Just your traditional NFL QB for the most part. 

[Shotgun]

8 minutes ago, L-TownCat said:

 

Good or bad the move to get Bryce has to play out.  It’s almost over tho so hang tight.

[Basbear]

Dan drafted 2024 and 2025.

Early returns have the 2025 one looking like great overall class. FYI there are 12 rookies on the roster, no one sees Bam has been a ST guy and Thorton is the first guy off the bench for either CB injury/rest. Ftiz was also a UDFA and done well with his "knuckle" KO and 57 yarder. 

The difference is brandt tillis.  

There's no wasted draft pick at RB with the 46th overall pick. 

Right now if you make me choose between Dan and Brandt, Im taking the nerd.....

[BlazeCarolina]

14 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

Im of the opinion that the Teppers were the push for Bryce. Stroud fit Reich better than Bryce did and designing a brand new offense around a QB for a coach that gets to pick "his guy" doesn't make a whole lot of sense. You could see it in the body language. He lost interest when he didnt get to draft the QB that would fit what he did. Stroud just played football. Simple. Straightforward. Nothing complicated. No outlier unicorn qualities. Just your traditional NFL QB for the most part. 

I agree.  I actually didn't look at anyone past Stroud film wise that year because I was 110% convinced Stroud was such a good fit, there was no possible way he was not the guy.

As the draft approached, I started freaking out thinking there is no way he's not the guy, right?  This is a smoke screen!  Then the articles started piling up about how they were evenly matched.

I have never done that during draft time.  I always evaluate potential fits.  I was THAT sure.

[Jackie Lee]

32 minutes ago, L-TownCat said:

1) the resources used to get Bryce prevent his early release.

2) the roster resources spent around the QB to make it work prevent his early release.

3) the coaching hires purely aimed at salvaging the QB prevent his early release.

4) finally, the owners foolish pride in selecting the QB prevents his early release. 

Good or bad the move to get Bryce has to play out.  It’s almost over tho so hang tight.

We're just gonna get political answers until they're forced to decided on the 5th year option