Okay gentlemen, REAL talk...

[DeAngelo Beason]

17 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

I have no doubt whatsoever that they're going to seek a capable backup. 

I see no guarantee that player will compete for a starting role.

It is possible, but it's not a certainty.

I pretty much agree with that statement.  Unlikely but possible.  It all depends on Tepper's blind loyalty to Young.

[TLGPanthersFan]

13 hours ago, Loyalty4Life said:

Great take.  

I'm a big Bryce fan and have been since we drafted him.  My stance has always been to give him time to develop.  To have some patience.  

I look at each play and figure out where the issue was on that play and who did their job and who screwed up.  Over time you look to see if the player is improving.  Stats are a reflection of making the right decisions but depend very heavily on what the other 10 guys did or didn't do and what play Canales called and the situation.  

I hope no one would argue that the games in which Bryce plays well, he usually plays really, really well.  You can easily see on dozens of individual plays where is does things at an elite level.  We can also see how the teams talks about and responds to him, on and off the field.  We are at the point now where we know whats possible.  The question now is how to do it more consistently.  

We have a young coach.
We have a young GM.
We have young players.
We have Young.
 
Let the Panthers cook.

It may not be happening on the time table or in the exact way the fan base wants but no one can argue this is the best the team has looked from top to bottom since Watt blew up Cam's shoulder.  Front office, coaching staff and players.  

Win, lose or draw the Panthers are exciting and contending again.

He has had 3 years. He is who is. 

[Navy_football]

10 hours ago, CRA said:

Yeah, I mean if you watched the game he was.   Dude had 2 throws over 10 yards downfield and he was completely hidden.  There were 2 schizophrenic 4th down playcalls.   If you didn’t catch those 2 passes and watched her rest of the game. 

the fine line between dumb and stupid playcalls….is often just the result.  Bryce misses just one of the 4th down calls and the narrative for Bryce and Canales is an entire 180.  

If Josh Allen or Patrick Mahomes had the same stats with the same throws on 4th down, would you have the same opinion?

[mrcompletely11]

11 hours ago, Car123 said:

Same stats? He’s already hit his career high for passing tds, comp pct, passer rating..

Context goes a long way with statements like this

23 - comp % 59   Ypg 179   qbr 34  avg 5.5  epa -146 (last in nfl)

24 - comp % 60    ypg 171   qbr 50   avg 6.3   epa -13  (ranked 54)

25 - comp % 63    ypg 194   qbr 45    avg 6.4   epa -13 (ranked 55)

 

again context goes a long way when you are screaming about career highs

Kid hasnt been a good qb, like at all in his career.  

[CRA]

3 hours ago, Navy_football said:

If Josh Allen or Patrick Mahomes had the same stats with the same throws on 4th down, would you have the same opinion?

clearly, not.  Because Josh Allen and Patrick Mahomes also have a long career history and that big picture influences the small picture greatly. 

What does Bryce's big picture tell you about being hidden in games.   Would that be normal strategy Dave implements in large parts of games? Have we seen his current coach implement that strategy? The answer is yes.  We are factually talking about the worst starting QB in the NFL since 2023 here.  You seem to forget and now you want to utter about HOFers lol

folks trying way to hard here. 

[Navy_football]

2 hours ago, CRA said:

clearly, not.  Because Josh Allen and Patrick Mahomes also have a long career history and that big picture influences the small picture greatly. 

What does Bryce's big picture tell you about being hidden in games.   What that be normal strategy Dave implements in large parts of games? Have we seen his current coach implement that strategy? The answer is yes.  We are factually talking about the worst starting QB in the NFL since 2023 here.  You seem to forget and now you want to utter about HOFers lol

folks trying way to hard here. 

Actually appears that you're trying way too hard to discredit any thing positive Bryce Young does. Just said the same stats would be fine for the award if it was by another player, but because it's Bryce it isn't good enough. He was hidden all game sans a few plays. Come on. You have to see what you're doing.

Nobody here is saying Bryce is the guy yet. He's put up some absolute stinkers. But he's improving and if he has a good game, then he has a good game. If he has a bad game, then he has a bad game. Everything is either a bad game or comes with a caveat to you. What did you think about his 450 yards game against ATL? Gonna go out on a limb here and guess you'll say he only plays well against ATL and most of his yards were from YAC. Unreal...

[Mr. Scot]

13 hours ago, CRA said:

I can do it again, Bryce Young didn’t complete a single downfield pass more than 10 yards on 1st, 2nd or 3rd down for an entire game. 

Canales took 2 huge gambles on 4th down that worked out tremendously.   And these exact same type gambles have been blasted by the board this entire season as bad playcalls when they didn’t work out.  Great and dumb ain’t that far apart. 

the viewpoint of great QB play is skewed.  Or outlook and view of a QB in general.  There is a criteria used for 31 other teams and a very unique  version that only applies to Bryce.    As others have said this week, the Jaguars pass game and Trevor can be deemed as horrible….and Bryce/Carolina somehow “good” lol.  

I asked because it ws double posted, looks like it's been cleaned up since though

[Mr. Scot]

13 hours ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

Stats have to be used as a piece in interpretation of the whole which is what I was saying. There's lots of different stats that can be used to evaluate players besides the stat line at the end of the game. 

T2G had a high completion % because he constantly checked down for short passes. A QB passing 0-5 yards is likely going to have a higher completion than one making passes 10-15 yards regularly. They're higher % passes. 

How far is RB1 getting beyond the line of scrimmage before contact? Rico is averaging 6 ypc. Jeantry has 3 ypc but is getting contacted often behind the line. What if Dowdle were getting less than a yard after contact but Jeantry was getting 2.5? Who's the better runner then?

Bryce keeps getting credited with all these games winning drives. The final drive vs Atl, Bryce get credit for a 54 yard pass when in reality, he completed a basic 5 yard pass and Tremble ran over multiple defenders for nearly 50 yards. Then he hands off 3 times to set up the field goal. Now did he put the team on his back and lead the drive, or is he the beneficiary of a statistic? Does handing the ball off once after a fumbles recovery followed by a field goal count as leading a drive? 

Multiple stats tell different parts of the story from different angles. You have to use them together to wisely interpret what it means. No one said solely depend on the stats. But if you analyze them, use them as the tools that they are, you can learn a lot and create advantages for yourself and your team. Take what's available and determine what's worth using and what's not. But don't just ignore stats because you're scared you might be wrong. 

Thing is though, you can analyze stuff from a bunch of different angles and still be wrong if the stats are your guiding force. 

I've watched enough football in my life to trust my eyes over my Excel.

Stats have their purpose, and they work for some, but I've seen too many anomalies to make a high priority of them. 

[Mr. Scot]

11 hours ago, outlaw4 said:

The crux of the issue is figuring out if he can be more consistent will cost us more. A lot more. The options as I see them now:

Trade him

Pro: We get something in return. No further financial liability. 

Con: We must find a new guy + backup via FA/draft and they may not be cheap and/or could be worse than Young (see McCarthy). Young could be the next Darnold/Mayfield on another team, which means it's an organizational issue with (lack of) QB development.

Fifth Year - No extension

Pro: Gives us more time to evaluate and build up roster. Have a natural exit plan if he doesn't pan out. 

Con: We get nothing for him in return if we let him go. We risk a Daniel Jones scenario where Bryce plays lights out, skyrocketing the cost of his extension.

Extend now

Pro: Provides stability for the near future. May be able to get a more reasonable contract number now since his stats don't scream franchise QB yet and/or structure it to where we give ourselves an out.

Con: Bryce's agent demands whatever CJ Stroud will end up getting. We're hitching our wagon to him for at least a year or two. Cost of getting out of the contract. Likely ties Canales' fate to Young.

Facebook status: It's complicated

[Mr. Scot]

4 hours ago, TLGPanthersFan said:

He has had 3 years. He is who is. 

To be fair, Jake Delhomme has more than three years under his belt when he came to us.

Bryce has shown legitimate improvement season over season. I don't think we can deny that. 

[CRA]

2 minutes ago, Navy_football said:

Actually appears that you're trying way too hard to discredit any thing positive Bryce Young does. Just said the same stats would be fine for the award if it was by another player, but because it's Bryce it isn't good enough. He was hidden all game sans a few plays. Come on. You have to see what you're doing.

Nobody here is saying Bryce is the guy yet. He's put up some absolute stinkers. But he's improving and if he has a good game, then he has a good game. If he has a bad game, then he has a bad game. Everything is either a bad game or comes with a caveat to you. What did you think about his 450 yards game against ATL? Gonna go out on a limb here and guess you'll say he only plays well against ATL and most of his yards were from YAC. Unreal...

What I am not trying to do, is search within games every week to explain why the worst QB in the NFL since he entered it.....isn't just a weak and bad QB.  This thread/convo isn't about an award.  If it is, that's not a convo I am having. 

I do not believe BY is improving.  Whatever degree is just too insignificant to matter.  The Panthers are improving.  And where they are improving this year, is really clear. 

I think about the Atlanta game the exact same thing I said about the Atlanta game last year.  If you give anyone unlimited opportunity.  Talking bad players.  They will have a random outlier here or there.   And you won't find my posts saying anything bad about his play in the 2 @ Atlanta games.   I have acknowledged those 2 singular games were the 2 actual good games by Bryce many times.....lol, sorry that is real.  

[CRA]

10 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

I asked because it ws double posted, looks like it's been cleaned up since though

yeah, mobile posting has been a bit spotty w/ the ads

[mrcompletely11]

7 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

To be fair, Jake Delhomme has more than three years under his belt when he came to us.

Bryce has shown legitimate improvement season over season. I don't think we can deny that. 

Legitimate improvement is really debatable 

[Mr. Scot]

15 minutes ago, CRA said:

yeah, mobile posting has been a bit spotty w/ the ads

The fifth word in my quoted post agrees