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Mr. Scot

Kyle Bailey suggests defense going 3-4 is an option

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I get it..

Ppl still have the Nostalgia over the 3/4..

But reality still is most of the better defenses in the league are 43.. Most of the league run a 43 base..

And with some simple tweaks we can still be a strong 43 defense..

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So here is my issue right now.  Can someone give me some name of some decent pass rushing 4-3 DE’s that we can target in the draft. There seems to be a couple really good ones at the top of the draft that will be gone by the time we pick. Then are are couple decent size guys like Zach Allen but he is good against the run, not rushing the passer. But there seems to be a ton of 3-4 DE guys that are good pass rushers that will be available.  

Give me a couple names to research.  

My concern is that there are only project 4-3 DE’s that are going to be in our range.  Which means we will have 2 more seasons of having to blitz to get to the QB.  And 2 more years watching our secondary get torched.  

People keep talking about how strong the DL is in this draft.  But the strength is interior DL and 3-4 outside from what I have seen so far.  

I would be fine sticking with a 4-3.  Show me how we are going to fix getting to the QB  next season in this draft.  Because I doubt we can afford any top 4-3 DE out there. 

Fire away!

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18 minutes ago, Black&BlueBubba said:

So here is my issue right now.  Can someone give me some name of some decent pass rushing 4-3 DE’s that we can target in the draft. There seems to be a couple really good ones at the top of the draft that will be gone by the time we pick. Then are are couple decent size guys like Zach Allen but he is good against the run, not rushing the passer. But there seems to be a ton of 3-4 DE guys that are good pass rushers that will be available.  

Give me a couple names to research.  

My concern is that there are only project 4-3 DE’s that are going to be in our range.  Which means we will have 2 more seasons of having to blitz to get to the QB.  And 2 more years watching our secondary get torched.  

People keep talking about how strong the DL is in this draft.  But the strength is interior DL and 3-4 outside from what I have seen so far.  

I would be fine sticking with a 4-3.  Show me how we are going to fix getting to the QB  next season in this draft.  Because I doubt we can afford any top 4-3 DE out there. 

Fire away!

Rashard Gary,  Celin Ferrell,  Montez Sweat, and Zach Allen

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49 minutes ago, Sub Zero said:

Rashard Gary,  Celin Ferrell,  Montez Sweat, and Zach Allen

That’s what I was looking at.  Both Gary and Ferrell are supposed to be long gone before we pick.  Based on the tape I have watched and other profiles of Allen he is good against the run.  But lacks the speed and flexibility to rushe the passer effectively.  Sweat is one of the guys I was looking at.   But is 6’6” is only 241 lbs.   He could possibly develop into a decent end over time   But I don’t think that in next year so.  

Here is a scouting film  

Sweats analytics is actually pretty good.  And we know Tepper has a hard on for analytics  

here are his analytics:

My point is that people are arguing that it will take a year or so to transition to a 3-4 defense.  Peeper’s is gone and besides Addison I don’t see us having any pass rush for a couple of years.  That’s why I am not against the transition.  

Maybe we ought to draft a bunch of secondary early next year.  We are going to need it.  

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12 minutes ago, Black&BlueBubba said:

That’s what I was looking at.  Both Gary and Ferrell are supposed to be long gone before we pick.  Based on the tape I have watched and other profiles of Allen he is good against the run.  But lacks the speed and flexibility to rushe the passer effectively.  Sweat is one of the guys I was looking at.   But is 6’6” is only 241 lbs.   He could possibly develop into a decent end over time   But I don’t think that in next year so.  

Here is a scouting film  

Sweats analytics is actually pretty good.  And we know Tepper has a hard on for analytics  

here are his analytics:

My point is that people are arguing that it will take a year or so to transition to a 3-4 defense.  Peeper’s is gone and besides Addison I don’t see us having any pass rush for a couple of years.  That’s why I am not against the transition.  

Maybe we ought to draft a bunch of secondary early next year.  We are going to need it.  

But you can draft this kid and just sign a Quality DE in FA.. That gives you pass Rush next year.. Instead of trying to change a whole scheme with little to none of the pieces needed for it. 

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Would make a lot of sense, IMO.

Shaq at ILB could allow for him to explode and make full use of his athleticism. Kawann Short at DE in a 3-4 could also be a great fit and it usually is easier these days to find productive 3-4 edge rushers in the draft than traditional 4-3 ends.

Who knows, maybe Vernon Butler can finally emerge as a 3-4 DE.

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29 minutes ago, Sub Zero said:

But you can draft this kid and just sign a Quality DE in FA.. That gives you pass Rush next year.. Instead of trying to change a whole scheme with little to none of the pieces needed for it. 

Maybe.  I just think we have almost as many missing pieces of a 4-3 than we do a 3-4. And if we were going to make that change this would be the year.  A hybrid defense would be awesome.

To be clear, the thing that really intrigued me about this is some freshness to our old stale defense.  

 

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12 minutes ago, Black&BlueBubba said:

Maybe.  I just think we have almost as many missing pieces of a 4-3 than we do a 3-4. And if we were going to make that change this would be the year.  A hybrid defense would be awesome.

To be clear, the thing that really intrigued me about this is some freshness to our old stale defense.  

 

Cool let's be real.. The idea of seeing something different no matter how bad it is interesting.. I'd rather be good next year thoe.. 

The rest of your statement is utterly false..  We are 2 quality DE and some secondary pieces away from a good 43 defense..

We are atleast 6 players away from even playing a 3/4 let alone it being a avg. Defense..

 

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29 minutes ago, Sub Zero said:

Cool let's be real.. The idea of seeing something different no matter how bad it is interesting.. I'd rather be good next year thoe.. 

The rest of your statement is utterly false..  We are 2 quality DE and some secondary pieces away from a good 43 defense..

We are atleast 6 players away from even playing a 3/4 let alone it being a avg. Defense..

 

Your probably right.  I just want a competitive defense.  

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On 1/11/2019 at 8:24 PM, Hammerin'Cam1 said:

That's just pure speculation at this point. I don't think we view Peppers who has 159.5 career sacks the same as we see Thomas Davis who has a clear replacement in Shaq already on the team.

really? we let go of peppers too... 58 is in on more plays, def. got more going for him.

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On 1/11/2019 at 6:03 PM, Ship said:

Interesting. Definitely seems like there are a lot more OLB pass rush guys out there as prospects than true stud DEs.

DE: short

NT: poe

DE: butler

OLB: rookie

MLB: shaq

MLB: Luke

OLB: FA or someone who can covert on the team

Butler?  Better a first round DE. Wouldn't Haynes be worth a look at OLB?  Is Love behind Poe or Poe behind Love?  Are neither of our two rookie LB worthy OLB material?

DE: short/Addison

NT: poe/love

DE: rookie/Butler

OLB: Haynes

MLB: shaq

MLB: Luke

OLB: FA or LB on roster

 

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13 minutes ago, Glitchh said:

Butler?  Better a first round DE. Wouldn't Haynes be worth a look at OLB?  Is Love behind Poe or Poe behind Love?  Are neither of our two rookie LB worthy OLB material?

DE: short/Addison

NT: poe/love

DE: rookie/Butler

OLB: Haynes

MLB: shaq

MLB: Luke

OLB: FA or LB on roster

 

The reality of that situation is an awful 3-4 defense  Luke, Poe, and Short are the only ones that fit at all. And Short probably is not even a good fit 

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It would be interesting if we switched to a 3-4. Don't think we have the players to fit that scheme since we really don't have any speed rushers, but it is much easier to draw up creative blitzes with a 3-4 than a 4-3 IMO. Guessing it would be Addison, Poe, Short on the dline, Luke and Shaq as MLBs, and not sure who would be OLBs (maybe Carter and draft picks/FAs). A 3-4 would have been better when we had Star because he was a great run stuffer and drew a lot of double teams.

 

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Addison would be an OLB. Hes nowhere close to being a 3-4 DE. Those guys typically go 290 lbs on the low side 

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12 hours ago, Sub Zero said:

Cool let's be real.. The idea of seeing something different no matter how bad it is interesting.. I'd rather be good next year thoe.. 

The rest of your statement is utterly false..  We are 2 quality DE and some secondary pieces away from a good 43 defense..

We are atleast 6 players away from even playing a 3/4 let alone it being a avg. Defense..

 

For discussion sake, what 6 pieces are we away from in a 3-4 defense?

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