saints4life25

Being that a pie is generally made of crust and filling, any ratio under 60:40 filling to crust importance is unacceptable. I would say 50:50 myself.

Sometimes, things are bigger than football. I think Greg Hardy was treated unfairly by the league, along with AP, but JR has his name stamped next to this logo. What kind of message is he sending to his daughters or granddaughters by allowing Hardy to be on the team?

Don't necessarily agree with everything said about Hardy by Holder, but I can understand why JR doesn't want him around. I think his thought process was backed up by the vast majority of the league.

Saints4life25.

Dudes the best poster here.

One pie?!? I call shenanigans on this whole thread.

Fug those Seahawks though!

So, does this work for me too?

Not exactly.

The Saints would be responsible for the dead money from his prorated signing bonus. Guaranteed salary can be traded.

If another team was willing to assume his salary and to guarantee it the Saints could theoretically save cap space by trading him.

I always assumed the Saints would continue to push cap charges down the road until Brees retired. At that point they would probably be really bad anyway and they could clear up the cap while getting some high draft choices.

Seems to me they are hitting the reset button early.

The Saints dead money/cap hit for trading or cutting Drew Brees this year is $33 million. He is, untradeable.

Brees wants out Saints trying to calm him down and make him happy . Difficult to trade he won't go to Tennessee

4:33pm - 10 Mar 15

ProFootballCentral#

Bree's doesn't have a no-trade clause and the Titans can't be happy with just Mettenberg (smokescreen if they say otherwise.) The Titans have the cap cash to do this and it's mighty convenient that New Orleans is just merrily trading away any and all players to rebuild.

Mariota to Cooks is a pretty nice combo. not to mention the pro bowl caliber players they are signing starting up the middle for a pro bowl center.

As I've said, Drew is untradeable right now. His salary became fully guaranteed in February. It would cost the Saints $7 million to cut or trade him. It's simply impossible to do this year, even if they wanted to. Which they don't.

Seattle fans are thinking more like 800-900. I like Graham but he is soft as a baby's butt as a football player. Vacarro shows up as a rookie and smacked him around like a bitch in his first camp. Graham never got over his "don't foul" basketball mentality. Yes he's great because he has such physical dominance over pretty much all other players but he could have been so much greater if he wasn't such a puss. He's on the decline now at age 29. Good news is those tough SEA defenders will beat and rag on him so much in practice that hopefully they make him pull his skirt up, grab his balls, and be a man. If so he might have good value in his past-his-prime years like Witten and Gonzales gave their teams as past-their-prime TEs

Fair enough. I don't agree that Jimmy is soft, but it certainly is a talking point about him around the league. I think he's a tough SOB. The lisfranc injury he had 2 years ago would have sent many to IR. During the Seattle playoff game, he could barely run. He walked with a noticeable limp. This year, the shoulder.

He's not a Saints anymore, so that's about all the defending him I'm going to do, but I can definitely see 1,000 yards and 10 TDs.

you bet. would be a great time.

about Graham...I'm 95% positive Graham suffered a cuncussion from a hit by Thomas Davis in The dome this past season. I've heard talk that he's taken a few with no reports....

Never heard a thing about it, to be honest. Could he have? Sure. But it's really tough to get by without a concussion test being given now that he NFL has guys there just for that.

Lol you really believe that? With Jimmy Graham growing up in North Carolina... where you're pretty much either a Cowboys, Steelers, Redskins, Packers, or Panthers fan... that he grew up as a Saints fan... during an era where they were garbage and didn't even have fans outside of Louisiana?

Come on now.

Yes, I really believe that.

Here's the link:

http://www.neworleanssaints.com/news-and-events/article-1/Jimmy-Graham-Talks-About-Joining-the-Saints/b0cdd6dc-ce45-46ef-a0e0-613e684a9611

what about when Tom is gone, even if Gayle takes the reins do you think that will affect the ability of Loomis to flash big signing bonuses or convert future salary to guaranteed money in restructures as a way to massage the cap? I mean, I don't know if anybody knows for sure, but Benson is still doing quite well financially as far as I can tell, and he's still able to facilitate his money man being aggressive with the cap, which as we know requires cash on hand. good god this is theoretical. that's the offseason for you.

The thing about Gayle is, she won't get in the middle of all of it lol. She'll own them, but leave the running of the team to those who know what they're doing. At least that's the way it seems as an outsider.

Rita, I feel, would run them into the ground. No one in the organization likes her. Loomis and Payton won't work for her. If she takes over, I could definitely see a move for the Saints down the line.

As far as money goes, Tom has been wise enough that he will still be making a poo ton of money, long after he's gone. He's a shrewd business man who usually gets what he wants. Between the car dealerships, the land around the Supersome that he owns, the deals with the state, and the two teams, whoever he leaves it to will be in great shape.

I've spent a good bit of time in NOLA...definitely know my way around. if I get a chance to make it back down there, I'll call my brothers father in-law and get him to give up his 4 tickets he has 20 rows up on the 50 and we'll do it up right. he designed and built Zephyr Stadium and gives us his ticks when we come down. my brother is one lucky guy. if I can swing it I'll send you a message pod'nuh

Wow. Sounds like a good gig lol.

That sounds good though! I'd definitely have to treat to Dagos and Pat Os do that!

fascinating. Lofton was rated the #56 out of 60 qualifying ILBs per PFF (the guy who was #60 was the guy Lofton replaces for the Raiders for 2015). In 2014, Lofton failed to tally a single sack despite rushing the passer 98 times. Lofton had negative grades as a pass rusher, against the run, and in coverage (-12.2 vs run, -4.3 in pass coverage, -5.6 in pass rush). PFF rated Lofton the worst player on the Saints ENTIRE TEAM offense or defense, with a -21.5 grade. The only Saints starters with above the +6.0 grade of LT Armstead were Brees (+32.6), OLB Galette (+20.3) and RT Strief (+10.9)

Not a huge fan of PFF grades. Love them for their stats. Think their grades are as useless as tits on a bull.

But basically, their assessment is pretty close. I don't agree that he was the worst player on the team, however. But missing tackles as a linebacker will get you killed by PFF and Lofton did plenty of that last season. He whiffed quite a bit. And like I said, he doesn't make any plays behind the LOS. He'll rack up the tackles...5 yards down the field.

Only reason I would see him retained if we were in a better cap situation is because we're kind of void of linebacker talent.

@saints4life25, other saints fans in this thread

where are you as a fan at with the loomis situation. yes he's got a good track record in some areas but he also really misjudged some roster decisions this year and had to pay the piper by hemorrhaging cap assets. would you rather this fire sale be done at his direction or a new person?

same with the coach i guess. i actually agree that the offense will still be fairly productive without graham but it seems like such a waiting game for the defense to catch up year after year, with the exception of one or two seasons where it all came together.

it's not often you see a roster reset like this without cleaning house in the front office and leadership. i mean, i really don't think loomis is going anywhere anytime soon but what is the fan sentiment?

Loomis doesn't make the football decisions. Loomis is the money man, basically. He's an accountant by trade. It's what he went to school for. It's what he's done all of his life. It's why he usually gets away with manipulating the cap. He's great with numbers.

Football decisions, I would assume, ultimately go through Sean Payton. Loomis tells him what money would work, Payton does what he sees best.

I don't see either one going anywhere and I wouldn't want them to. Loomis is a good GM and Payton is a great coach. They make a very good team. Part of the reason I want Gayle to win the whole battle with Benson is because Loomis won't work for Rita, and Payton is leaving if Loomis leaves.

They've left some to be desired in some aspects, drafting in particular. Hopefully that changes with the front office changes this offseason. But for the most part have brought stability and a winning environment to NO. Loomis has Bensons full trust, as he runs the Pelicans as well. I don't think you'll see either leave for quite some time.

man...srsly? how bout next time I make it down there we go to Dracos and get some grilled oysters and then hit up DuMonde after a hurricane from Pat O's

I'm down for that without a bet! Lol

I don't even know if they can do it with the dead cap hit that would be.

I just remembered reading that somewhere don't know if it's true

This year it's basically impossible. The dead money would be outrageous. And only $11 million in savings. Next year? It's doable. Only $7 million dead money and $20 million savings. If they have another sub .500 season, I'd say there's a tiny chance it happens. Still not very high though.

Edit: I'm sorry, I just checked. It would cost us $7 million to cut or trade Drew Brees this year. His cap hit is $26 million. The dead money is $33 million.

the Titans have roughly 26 million in cap space and Zachary Mettenberger as their QB. could be very interesting.

I say again, how much are you willing to put down?

You say you'd put money on it, as will I.

I really can't understand that decision at all. Couldn't get a deal done, franchise tag as a TE, he appealed, lost, signed a new deal before the deadline, and boom he's gone. It's deeply confusing to me.

Lot of talk about a lot of hurt feelings during the whole thing. And rumors that Jimmy complained about his contract all year, even after getting paid. I can't verify any of that. But reports of a rift between Jimmy and management go way back to last offseason.

Just makes sense with the purge. Brees' best years are behind him, at least with the Saints. I mean...how many of his playmakers are left and how good is he gonna look after this fire sale...I would wager that his value would take a pretty big hit.

The Saints offense has always been filled with removable parts. Jimmy is by far the best receiving option he's ever thrown to, and he's a TE. Running backs routinely lead the team in receptions. The Saints offense is centered around great QB play and great interior protection. They feel everything else can be swapped out. Give Drew time, he'll find someone to throw to.

Drew Brees is basically a mayor in New Orleans. They trade him, they burn this bitch down.

I don't venture to other boards. What is the sentiment towards Graham?

Ya know, a lot of the guys over on SR has the predictable, "He got paid and hasn't been the same. We're better off without him and his huge contract.", reaction. But plenty of people around here are really upset by the move, me included. Jimmy grew up a Saints fan. He loved us and we loved him back. It's always tough to see those guys go.

I can understand the football decision to trade him. I don't necessarily agree with it, but I understand.

I guarantee you Graham took some concussions that weren't reported. I guarantee you he's damaged goods.

I would put money on the Saints looking to trade Brees for a sure shot at Mariotta before the dust settles.

Why would they want to pay a max contract to a QB whose value will only diminish from here out but could still make the difference on a team that needs a near-elite QB to get them into contention.

There are only 2 "sure-fire" franchise QB's in this draft and they are gonna both go top-10, if not top-2. The SuperDome is made for speed and cooks and Mariotta could be the makings of a dynamic offense.

So, how much would you be willing to put on them moving Brees? Cause I'm definitely down.

Keep in mind Graham only caught for 309 more yards than Jerricho Cotchery last year, and he is going from the #3 passing offense in New Orleans to the #27 passing offense in Seattle.

After the Tampa game and the shoulder injury, Jimmy couldn't pick his arms above his head without pain. Kind of takes away his advantage. You saw him draw up and protect his shoulder a lot. In the red zone, the fades would get thrown back shoulder into his gut, instead of in the air, because he couldn't lift his arms. He contemplated surgery this offseason.

Jimmy will put up 1,000 and 10-12 TDs this year. Guys a beast. I'll miss him.

Wait is that legit about graham?

/purple.

I was being a dick.

I think you and be could be buddies. You are a smartass but then again, so am I.

In all honesty, what are you guys doing?

We are cool, yes?

Lol. That's cool!

Not sure. Payton said after the season that changes would be made. It started with the changes on the coaching staff and has rolled over into the roster.

The Saints understand that Drew Brees is at his best when he has a pocket to climb and drive the ball. He doesn't have a rocket arm like Cam. He has to be able to climb to get velocity on his throws. It's also because of his size. He can't deal with pressure in his face as well as other taller QBs. When he gets constant interior pressure, you see him force throws and turn the ball over.

What do I think? I think the Saints made a call about Ungers availability. He missed a lot of time last year and they performed well without him, so why not check? They threw out some WRs, probably Stills and a pick or two and the Hawks asked about Jimmy. With the disconnect between he and management, he got dealt. It helps with the cap in future years as well.

Grubbs was just not very good. We've all known something would happen with him this offseason. With Evans injuries all year, I honestly thought something might get done with both. Grubbs was going to be cut. Not sure why the Chiefs traded for him. Apparently they didn't see him play this year.

As far as the cuts, the only one I didn't like football wise was Lofton. He's a solid backer. Problem was, you don't pay solid backers $9 million. He racked up tackles, but he missed a bunch and would hardly make plays behind the LOS. And please God don't ask him to cover someone lol.

I think there's just changes being made. And I'd be ignorant to suggest that none of it had to do with cap. If we were $20 million under, I doubt Lofton gets cut. Maybe Jimmy isn't available. I'm not sure, because that's all hypothetical. What I do know, is we were 7-9 last year, and that's not good enough. I'm happy they're making changes. Heard a lot of grumblings about the locker room last year. Haven't heard about that since Paytons been here.

And yes, we're cool.

I will count you as someone who doesn't have a prayer of winning the South or as having a practice facility makes you any better of a football player.

I can deal with that.